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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by kabob View Post
    That pertinent, required learning will be skipped or glossed over.
    Exactly
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  2. #22
    NUMBER 5 Younggun's Avatar
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    On the air today discussing HB47, shortening the CHL class requirement to 4-6 h

    I feel that being knowledgeable in the applicable laws is the responsibility of the CHL holder.

    For this reason I think the required class could be shortened and the laws could be looked at more in depth by the applicant on their own while waiting for their CHL to process.

    If someone would like a more in depth class it could be made available but not mandatory, just as they can do for their proficiency now.

    I personally would rather have constitutional carry with no classes and no fees, CHL I handy for by passing NICS checks but outside of that I believe constitutional carry is a better option.
    "If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen." Samual Adams


    I LOVE MY COUNTRY AND MY STATE. IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH EITHER YOU ARE MORE THAN WELCOME TO GTFO

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie View Post
    I'm pulled both ways on the "required" aspects of the CHL. In one respect, it allows those that actually want to learn to be exposed to the rules and regulations (however wrong that may be) that we are required to follow to remain law abiding citizens. But then again, if it's a constitutional right, why do we have to do anything to carry a gun? It's a tax, and it provides education for those that want it but ............. ?
    Charlie, I think many of us share the same sentiments. Many of us would through a no-shit-fit at the suggestion that we be required to take a class, pass a test, and pay a tax to vote. In fact, at one point in time, our country did require literacy tests and demanded taxes be paid by those wishing to vote. Today, we see such policies as wrong and even racist. While I agree, ownership and the right to carry a gun shouldn't be taxed, require a license, or any form of registration, I can't pretend that we are all born knowing how to shoot, the law, or the responsibilities that come with going armed. As much as I'd almost prefer a degree of anarchy, I feel a pull toward finding a way to be sure people who go armed, aren't an unnecessary hazard to themselves or anyone else.
    ____________________________________________
    When you take the time out of your day to beat someone, it has a much longer lasting effect on their demeanor than shooting or tazing them

    Gary Montgomery
    Guns Over Texas Radio
    http://gunsovertexasradio.com
    gary_at_gunsovertexasradio.com

  4. #24
    NUMBER 5 Younggun's Avatar
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    On the air today discussing HB47, shortening the CHL class requirement to 4-6 h

    That's all good, except I've seen people who couldn't really operate their firearm pass the CHL proficiency test.

    One in my class fired a gun for the first time when qualifying, had very little idea how it worked, and passed.

    I think that speaks to how much safer you are for the required course.
    "If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen." Samual Adams


    I LOVE MY COUNTRY AND MY STATE. IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH EITHER YOU ARE MORE THAN WELCOME TO GTFO

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Younggun View Post
    That's all good, except I've seen people who couldn't really operate their firearm pass the CHL proficiency test.

    One in my class fired a gun for the first time when qualifying, had very little idea how it worked, and passed.

    I think that speaks to how much safer you are for the required course.
    We all have seen people who couldn't operate their firearms, manage to pass or worse, be coddled through by instructors. No one said we like it or agree with it. I have quite honestly seen a blind man pass with a score of 180 by simply indexing toward the target. It may not be a popular opinion but, I'd argue it speaks to how pathetically easy the test is in its current form.

    Going to Austin to qualify with other instructors is often equally discouraging if not more so because there were people there who were nervous wrecks about the idea of scoring 90% or better as required for instructors. Some of them were rightfully concerned and needed coaching or remedial instruction from the DPS troopers. I don't know anyone who hasn't had a similar experience in Florence or on their own firing line and yet, every attempt to require higher standards for both CHL applicants and even police has been met with complaints that higher standards aren't fair or are otherwise impractical.

    The police unions and agencies themselves argue against higher standards due to the cost and time required for additional training. And the number one argument against higher standard for civilians remains that it is an infringement of the 2nd Amendment. It was also decided that the CHL qualification could not be any more difficult than that required for Texas peace officers. So where do we go from here? Toss it all in the name of our rights that shall not be infringed and just say that's the way it goes when someone is killed due to a shooter's negligence or ineptitude?
    ____________________________________________
    When you take the time out of your day to beat someone, it has a much longer lasting effect on their demeanor than shooting or tazing them

    Gary Montgomery
    Guns Over Texas Radio
    http://gunsovertexasradio.com
    gary_at_gunsovertexasradio.com

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Younggun View Post
    I feel that being knowledgeable in the applicable laws is the responsibility of the CHL holder.

    For this reason I think the required class could be shortened and the laws could be looked at more in depth by the applicant on their own while waiting for their CHL to process.

    If someone would like a more in depth class it could be made available but not mandatory, just as they can do for their proficiency now.
    This is exactly where I stand also. Ultimately, it is MY responsibility to know and understand the laws regarding carry and use of force. When I first came here from PA (with my PA license), before I even thought about carrying, I dove in and read, studied, and learned the laws. My wife was a new shooter, and I taught her a few things before sending her to an NRA basic pistol course. In that time, I helped her study the applicable laws, which also helped me learn them.
    I look at it this way- those of us who are serious about the subject will do what is necessary to know and understand. Those who are not serious won't. It's easy to sit in a class and burn 10 hours and walk away with zero knowledge.


    Brad

    "There are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations."- James Madison, 1788.

  7. #27
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    47, shortening the CHL class requirement to 4-6 hours

    How many people "fail" the current class and are not able to get a license? The whole "we train them and make them pass a test" as it is currently, is a joke. Someone who wants to learn...will. Someone who cares less about the law, will never learn it no matter the length of the class. 5 hours or 15 hours...won't effect anything either way.

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    You can only have too much ammo if you are on fire or swimming....

  8. #28
    The advocate's Devil. London's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kabob View Post
    If you can't make time for or sit still through a 10 hour class, you shouldn't be licensed to carry a handgun, in the first place. Sheesh. You have to take mandatory classes now to get your TXDL if you're 25 or younger, too. It ain't gonna kill ya.
    Please show me where the Constitution says you have a right to drive a car.

  9. #29
    The advocate's Devil. London's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kabob View Post
    That pertinent, required learning will be skipped or glossed over.
    Quote Originally Posted by gcmj45acp View Post
    Exactly
    What is exactly is the "Pertinent, required learning," and why would eliminating it be bad?

  10. #30
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    If we believe we are truly endowed with rights from our creator the only test should be we have a pulse.
    A "gun free zone" is tyrannies playground.
    I carry a gun to give me options, not a single solution.

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