Picking a 1911?
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riggergreg
Member
I'm in the same boat as you. I'm looking for a compact 1911. I've been doing a lot of shopping around, Checking out specs and reviews for every make and model in my budget range.
Figure out what your budget range is, check out everything you can find out about every one in that range, and be patient.
So far, I've got it narrowed down to 2-3 models. Now I'm just looking for the best prices.
Figure out what your budget range is, check out everything you can find out about every one in that range, and be patient.
So far, I've got it narrowed down to 2-3 models. Now I'm just looking for the best prices.
Bullseye Shooter
Active Member
Your decision will primarily depend on what your plans are for it. What I would pick as a Bullseye gun will be vastly different from what someone would pick as a carry gun. You might want to spend some time quizzing guys you know who have some sort of 1911A1 or spending some time in a gun store that has a pretty knowledgeable staff. Once you decide it's purpose, choosing will be a little easier.
I recently went through this process. I wanted a 1911, but I didn't see any reason to spend a lot of money on it. I decided on a Springfield 1911-A1 G.I. (the absolute low end model from Springfield) for $489 at GunBroker.com. It shot well enough (certainly met your 3-inch group at seven yards criteria), but I wanted it to be more accurate, so I sent if off to the Springfield Custom shop for some improvements. Essentially, this resulted in a custom gun on the inside. Here's the stuff I had done:
0) The Defense Package - they deburr the insides, tune the trigger to 4.5 pounds, tune the extractor/ejector, re-throat the barrel, polish the feed ramp, install a heavy-duty recoil spring and buffer, check the headspace, and inspect the barrel bushing fit on the barrel.
1) Novak 3-Dot Sights (with front dovetail sight)
2) Match barrel busing fit to frame and barrel
3) Lower/flare the ejection port and install an extended ejector (and completely re-parkerized the slide)
4) Remove the lanyard loop
The whole thing cost $510 (not including shipping to/from Springfield), and they had it back in my hands two weeks after they got it. So, the pistol is now worth $1000, but IMHO is better than any off-the-shelf Springfield you can buy in the same price range.
If you want to save some cash ($120), you can have them install the 3-Dot sights they put on the MilSpecs, but the Novaks are (I think) better because then you can replace those later with night sights if that's what blows up your skirt.
All in all, I'm very happy with my low-end custom pistol. I qualified for my CHL with it, and every shot was inside the 8 ring at 15 yards, even during the rapid-fire portion (fire five rounds in less than 5 seconds) of the shooting part of the class. All shots seven yards and closer were in the 9/10 rings.
Of course, if you want to be able to say you spent a lot of money on a Les Bear or Wilson Combat, go ahead and spend $1500-$3000 on a pistol, but for me, that didn't make a whole lotta sense.
BTW, I've found that a full-size 1911 isn't exactly the best concealed carry weapon. It's heavy when fully loaded, and kinda - well - huge. I'm thinking about getting a Taurus PT745 for carry, and leaving the 1911 either in the car, or on the nightstand.
0) The Defense Package - they deburr the insides, tune the trigger to 4.5 pounds, tune the extractor/ejector, re-throat the barrel, polish the feed ramp, install a heavy-duty recoil spring and buffer, check the headspace, and inspect the barrel bushing fit on the barrel.
1) Novak 3-Dot Sights (with front dovetail sight)
2) Match barrel busing fit to frame and barrel
3) Lower/flare the ejection port and install an extended ejector (and completely re-parkerized the slide)
4) Remove the lanyard loop
The whole thing cost $510 (not including shipping to/from Springfield), and they had it back in my hands two weeks after they got it. So, the pistol is now worth $1000, but IMHO is better than any off-the-shelf Springfield you can buy in the same price range.
If you want to save some cash ($120), you can have them install the 3-Dot sights they put on the MilSpecs, but the Novaks are (I think) better because then you can replace those later with night sights if that's what blows up your skirt.
All in all, I'm very happy with my low-end custom pistol. I qualified for my CHL with it, and every shot was inside the 8 ring at 15 yards, even during the rapid-fire portion (fire five rounds in less than 5 seconds) of the shooting part of the class. All shots seven yards and closer were in the 9/10 rings.
Of course, if you want to be able to say you spent a lot of money on a Les Bear or Wilson Combat, go ahead and spend $1500-$3000 on a pistol, but for me, that didn't make a whole lotta sense.
BTW, I've found that a full-size 1911 isn't exactly the best concealed carry weapon. It's heavy when fully loaded, and kinda - well - huge. I'm thinking about getting a Taurus PT745 for carry, and leaving the 1911 either in the car, or on the nightstand.
Start with the Mil-spec as it has the lowered flared ejection port already and the 3 dot sights.
What you need to do is decide what your budget is, what features you like in a carry pistol, go to ranges that rent and try some out. Almost any 1911 will deliver 4 inch groups at 25 yards right out of the box. So 3 inch at 7 is not a problem.
If you are located near DFW, we have a monthly shoot on the 25th. Come out and try some of mine. Just pm me with what size you think you want, cause I got em all from 3.5 to 5 inch with various stops inbetween.
What you need to do is decide what your budget is, what features you like in a carry pistol, go to ranges that rent and try some out. Almost any 1911 will deliver 4 inch groups at 25 yards right out of the box. So 3 inch at 7 is not a problem.
If you are located near DFW, we have a monthly shoot on the 25th. Come out and try some of mine. Just pm me with what size you think you want, cause I got em all from 3.5 to 5 inch with various stops inbetween.
Being a 1911 newb, i'm not sure what the "mil spec" model is....i'm not even sure what the "original" model is to compare all the changes since it's creation.
Ah hate ta bust yer bubble....but I've got less in THIS one:
than you do in yers - in fact, ah've barely got what you paid for your BASE gun for it. Anyone can buy one - the trick is to buy one right.
Now, THIS one set me back $2k.....
Then again, the original owner paid $4500 for it....never fired it...neither have I. Ultimately, after looking at the IPSC "landscape", I decided it just wasn't what I wanted, so it's goin' up for sale. Have 3 guys talkin' to me about it, and I won't lose money....an' they'll save a lot.
Come out to the next SA group git-together, an' you show me yer new gun....an' ah'll show ya some of my 2nd-hand ones!
Don't take me wrong - I ain't bustin' on YOU, but trying to point out that some good shopping techniques can reduce the money ya spend on a gun, and give you a better gun for the bucks.
Bullseye Shooter
Active Member
"Mil-spec" refers to one of the models of the 1911A1 that Springfield Armory produces. You can check their website for the specs.
The original 1911 as produced by Colt and others did not have relief cuts on the frame behind the trigger and it came with a flat mainspring housing, rather poor sights with a V notch, a shortened grip safety, and long trigger. The 1911A1 which came out in the early 1920s had the relief cuts, a square notch rear sight, arched mainspring housing, longer grip safety and short trigger. All these mods were recommendations from the Army Board.
Later commercial mods include things like an external extractor on some, checkered mainspring housings, ambidextrous safeties, lots of different sights, recoil spring guides, lowered ejection ports, slide cuts on the front of the slide and not just the rear, beavertail grip safeties, etc. etc. You get the idea.
However, how the gun functions and the basics have not really changed since 1911. In the 1980s there was talk of the "Wonder 9s" doing away with the 1911 type pistol, but guys found out real quick that just cause you had a magazine loaded with 15 rounds of 9mm, the old .45 ACP could still kick butt.
The Springfield Mil-Spec has certain "improvements" to the GI model. Better sights, Lowered and Flared ejection port are the two that comes to mind. The 3 dot sights on the Mil Spec are very usable.
Other modifications that you might want to consider are a beavertail grip safety which would require a commander hammer and a trigger job. If you change to the beavertail, you need the hammer and it must be mated to the sear and thumb safety.
There is a brand of 1911 called "American Classic." I do not have one but the ones that I have seen and handled appear to be well made, with very good fit and finish. They do not have a firing pin block like some, and many would call that a good thing (me I don't care either way).
The AC has all the bells and whistles that mose people want. Beavertail, Novak type combat sights. Lowered and Flared ejection. And a decent trigger pull. All right out of the box.
They are made in the Phillipines by metro arms and imported by the same folks that import Bersa firearms. They have much better fit and finish than any of the Bersas that I have seen. Sportingarms.com in Lewisville lists them at under $400. I have seen them at gun shows for up to $440 or so.
I have been toying with the idea of getting one as a truck gun.
Let me know if I can be of any help.
Where are you located?
Other modifications that you might want to consider are a beavertail grip safety which would require a commander hammer and a trigger job. If you change to the beavertail, you need the hammer and it must be mated to the sear and thumb safety.
There is a brand of 1911 called "American Classic." I do not have one but the ones that I have seen and handled appear to be well made, with very good fit and finish. They do not have a firing pin block like some, and many would call that a good thing (me I don't care either way).
The AC has all the bells and whistles that mose people want. Beavertail, Novak type combat sights. Lowered and Flared ejection. And a decent trigger pull. All right out of the box.
They are made in the Phillipines by metro arms and imported by the same folks that import Bersa firearms. They have much better fit and finish than any of the Bersas that I have seen. Sportingarms.com in Lewisville lists them at under $400. I have seen them at gun shows for up to $440 or so.
I have been toying with the idea of getting one as a truck gun.
Let me know if I can be of any help.
Where are you located?
The one with the "bells and whistles" is the "Deluxe" model. They currently have the Standard (MSRP $425) and then the Deluxe (MSRP $479).
If it truly is a well-made pistol, it looks like a good deal. Less than $500 for the beavertail safety and Novak sights - just - WOW!
They are also pretty highly regarded as being accurate and dependable.
Too bad they don't make a lightweight commander model...
I have a Colt Mk IV Series 70 that I bought back in the '70s and put some mods on. Since that was a long time ago that info doesn't help you. Earlier this year my son bought a Rock Island Armory 1911 .45. I believe it was less than $400 ($350?) new at the FTW gun show. The pistol shoots very well. 3" groups at 7 yards are no problem. It looks like a gov't 1911 clone on the inside. It seems to be well made.
As for adding a lot of mods, I'm hesitant to put too much fancy stuff on a carry gun. In a CQC situation you probably won't be spending a whole lot of time lining up sights and the possibility that fancier sights might snag on holsters or clothing is something to be considered. As far as the beavertails and all that other stuff, if it improves your grip (and you have to be able to have the proper grip as soon as you grap the pistol without using both hands to "settle it in") then go for it. I haven't found the expense worth it personally. Bottom line - you don't have to spend $1000 to get a good, reliable 1911 carry gun. But you can if you want to!
As for adding a lot of mods, I'm hesitant to put too much fancy stuff on a carry gun. In a CQC situation you probably won't be spending a whole lot of time lining up sights and the possibility that fancier sights might snag on holsters or clothing is something to be considered. As far as the beavertails and all that other stuff, if it improves your grip (and you have to be able to have the proper grip as soon as you grap the pistol without using both hands to "settle it in") then go for it. I haven't found the expense worth it personally. Bottom line - you don't have to spend $1000 to get a good, reliable 1911 carry gun. But you can if you want to!
Well, I have owned 9 different 1911's....and have shot many more. I currently own a Kimber Royal Carry (for sale), a Dan Wesson CBOB commander in .45ACP and a Les Baer Premier II.
First, you need to determine what you want the gun for. Then how much you are willing to spend. Once you have those parameters you can make a choice.
UNQUESTIONABLY , the best current 1911 for the money is a Dan Wesson. These can be had for under $1K if you shop around and they are superb guns. I have owned two (RZ10 which I sold regrettably and my CBOB) and both were excellent in every respect. Customer service is also top notch.
I would not touch the Taurus PT .... as usual for them , its hit or miss some are decent others problematic. Para is another to be careful about. Kimber gen I guns were great .....then they changed a good thing ..... and had problems.....now they are better but many still stay away from them. Smith and Wesson makes a pretty good 1911 and their customer service is superb as well- I wouldnt hessitate to buy one-shot several and they are good guns, though maybe not the best for customization or really heavy match use.
IF you have the money , Les Baer makes the best upper end gun for not as much cash....you can get into a good 1911 for around $1700 or maybe less if you get a good deal. As for shooters , they are superb. Ed Brown's are beautiful and fantastically built but expensive....love em though. Cant go wrong with Wilson but they too are expensive. Nighthawk and many others are very nice and very expensive.
I also like Fusion ALOT. This guy used to be over Dan Wesson and did their turnaround on their 1911's. His are excellent and reasonable (for a higher end custom style gun).
I personally like a commander size gun best. 4-4.25" slide/barrel combo with standard size frame (in aluminum or scandium if you want light weight) and bobbed for easier concealment when carrying.
As for features they almost all have em these days but for me a good beavertail, good sights, nice front strap checkering/stipling etc. along with the other goodies like lowered and flared ejection port, mag well beveling etc. I also like the "thin grips" for carry .....just makes the gun feel super slim .
Any way hope at least some of this was helpful.....I can go on and on....
First, you need to determine what you want the gun for. Then how much you are willing to spend. Once you have those parameters you can make a choice.
UNQUESTIONABLY , the best current 1911 for the money is a Dan Wesson. These can be had for under $1K if you shop around and they are superb guns. I have owned two (RZ10 which I sold regrettably and my CBOB) and both were excellent in every respect. Customer service is also top notch.
I would not touch the Taurus PT .... as usual for them , its hit or miss some are decent others problematic. Para is another to be careful about. Kimber gen I guns were great .....then they changed a good thing ..... and had problems.....now they are better but many still stay away from them. Smith and Wesson makes a pretty good 1911 and their customer service is superb as well- I wouldnt hessitate to buy one-shot several and they are good guns, though maybe not the best for customization or really heavy match use.
IF you have the money , Les Baer makes the best upper end gun for not as much cash....you can get into a good 1911 for around $1700 or maybe less if you get a good deal. As for shooters , they are superb. Ed Brown's are beautiful and fantastically built but expensive....love em though. Cant go wrong with Wilson but they too are expensive. Nighthawk and many others are very nice and very expensive.
I also like Fusion ALOT. This guy used to be over Dan Wesson and did their turnaround on their 1911's. His are excellent and reasonable (for a higher end custom style gun).
I personally like a commander size gun best. 4-4.25" slide/barrel combo with standard size frame (in aluminum or scandium if you want light weight) and bobbed for easier concealment when carrying.
As for features they almost all have em these days but for me a good beavertail, good sights, nice front strap checkering/stipling etc. along with the other goodies like lowered and flared ejection port, mag well beveling etc. I also like the "thin grips" for carry .....just makes the gun feel super slim .
Any way hope at least some of this was helpful.....I can go on and on....
I carry a Springfield V10 Magna Ported Ultra compact. You cannot go wrong with any Springfield firearm. Don't sweat it, you can never ever buy just one 1911. Buy one and start searching for the next. They are more addictive than crack cocaine.
Man I cant believe I left Springers off my previous post...very good guns.
Hawghauler ..... have you ever had an issue with firing your ported gun close to your body? Years ago I carried a Magnaported S&W 457 , GREAT gun , but after attending some training classes I realized that although the porting really helped recoil in a small light gun , the blast might not be good at night or near your body if you had to fire it close to you or near an object (like a barricade)....just curious.....
....31 1911's later.....NOW he tells me!
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