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FL Parking lot shooter arrested

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  • FireInTheWire

    Caprock Crusader
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    When I took my CHL, my instructor gave a scenario
    "You pull up in your drive way & see your front door is partially open, you step out the vehicle & walk towards the door... intruder comes running out of the house & throws the TV at you as he's running away... do you have the right to shoot him?
    He said you have ever right to shoot, but can you beat the court case.
    Yikes... no disrespect... but your instructor sounds like he needs a new job. That would not be justified. IMHO
    Texas SOT
     

    AustinN4

    TGT Addict
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    Nov 27, 2013
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    One difference with the Joe Horn incident is that it happened at night.
    He was safe inside his own home when he was reporting the burglary of his neighbor's house and told the 911 operator he was going to kill them. And then he went outside and did so, but yes, he claimed they came toward him.
    911 call:
    Background, including transcript of 911 call: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Horn_shooting_controversy

    He was No Billed by the GJ.
     

    Renegade

    SuperOwner
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    Mar 5, 2008
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    When I took my CHL, my instructor gave a scenario
    "You pull up in your drive way & see your front door is partially open, you step out the vehicle & walk towards the door... intruder comes running out of the house & throws the TV at you as he's running away... do you have the right to shoot him?
    He said you have ever right to shoot, but can you beat the court case.

    There is no scenario in Texas Law where this is justified.
     

    Kar98

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    IMO the Sheriff is running a False Flag operation. He does not like SYG, so he lets murders go under the guise that SYG prevented. Almost worked this time.

    Don't assume malice when stupidity provides a sufficient explanation. But you know, don't rule out malice.
     

    EZ-E

    King Turd of Shit Mountain
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    May 4, 2017
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    Middle of no where
    Yikes... no disrespect... but your instructor sounds like he needs a new job. That would not be justified. IMHO

    Exactly the point he was making.... yes the intruder assaulted you by throwing the TV, but since he fled the scene & was leaving... you were in no danger. Sure you could shoot him... he said you can shoot anyone... it's knowing when shooting someone can send you to prison & making the right choice of shooting someone & not going to prison.

    Another scenario was a woman running in a mall parking lot screaming... he's got a gun, as a guy chases her with a gun. Do you help her or mind your own business?

    Actually he has very high credentials, was sheriff in a few towns, owns a security school, trained law enforcement for 20 + yrs & has Doctorate in law.
     

    Kar98

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    Exactly the point he was making.... yes the intruder assaulted you by throwing the TV, but since he fled the scene & was leaving... you were in no danger. Sure you could shoot him... he said you can shoot anyone... it's knowing when shooting someone can send you to prison & making the right choice of shooting someone & not going to jail.

    It's the "you have every right to shoot him" part of your post, as you quoted him, that's the problem here. You do not.

    Another scenario was a woman running in a mall parking lot screaming... he's got a gun, as a guy chases her with a gun. Do you help her or mind your own business?

    Depends on quite a number of circumstances... without any further information, Imma mind my own damn bidness.
     

    EZ-E

    King Turd of Shit Mountain
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    May 4, 2017
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    ok, maybe not right verbiage on my part....sorry guys.
    The point was your out of harms way, you could shoot, but is it justified to take a life over a TV & as the guy is running away.
     

    Renegade

    SuperOwner
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    Exactly the point he was making.... yes the intruder assaulted you by throwing the TV, but since he fled the scene & was leaving... you were in no danger. Sure you could shoot him... he said you can shoot anyone... it's knowing when shooting someone can send you to prison & making the right choice of shooting someone & not going to prison.

    The question was "do you have the right to shoot him?", not are you physically able to shoot him.
     

    diesel1959

    por vida
    Lifetime Member
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    Nov 7, 2013
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    Houston & BFE
    I wish I could serve on his jury. He would walk.

    After getting violently shoved to the ground and in under 5 seconds he drew and fired from a shoved down position he had every right to nuke that thug.

    Even the sheriff in the press release said the attacker was still in a position to attack the downed man.
    The assailant began backing off when the man's handgun was drawn. There's at least a reasonable fact question regarding whether the shooting was justifiable on that basis alone.

    If, after having gotten knocked down, the guy had kept advancing on him and/or swung at him again, then damn straight, light him up. What I'm saying is that based upon what I saw on the video, there's a fact question for a jury to decide and that's what trials are for. The sheriff was wrong in his statement regarding the "Stand Your Ground" law. It is NOT absolute. Stand your ground laws are meant to provide victims legal "cover" such that they have no duty to retreat prior to a use of deadly force; however, the use of deadly force must STILL be objectively reasonable. It's merely my opinion, after having seen the video, that his shooting was not.
     
    Last edited:

    diesel1959

    por vida
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    Bullshit. This guy was in an argument with a woman when he was physically assaulted to a degree where he reasonably feared for his life. The true guilty party is the guy who ended up with a round in his chest, as he was getting ready to assault the guy on the ground again after already doing so. He did not cause the situation to escalate to that point, he was merely telling the woman she was illegally parked.
    I respect the hell out of you, major, but I definitely disagree on the facts. I absolutely agree that there was no legal right for the man to shove the guy to the ground. Nothing he did gave him legal justification to assault him. However, the assault ended and so too did the reasonableness of the shooter to have felt he was in immediate fear for his life. That was done when the man backed off. It would have been a closer case had the man drawn and fired DURING the shoving assault, but that's not what happened.
     

    Renegade

    SuperOwner
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    And the fact that you are not legally-obligated to do what a dispatcher tells you to do.

    Not sure what happened in this case, but the dispatcher should have been reprimanded if not fired for advising Horn not to shoot. The legal liability is off the wall. Likewise, he can not advise to shoot either. He can STFU. :-)
     
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