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In light of these Walmart incidents...

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  • oldag

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    Better training, better equipped, better lawyers and simpler rules of engagement: everyone over there needs being dead, go!
    That went entirely over your head, friend.

    Let me be more direct. If someone lays down their life for others, what difference does it make whether they are military, LEO or just a private citizen? The sacrifice is just as great and honorable for all.
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    Sublime

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    There has been an uptick in Texans applying for an LTC.....
    Well that won't do any good in a AS situation since most with a LTC are gonna exit like the unarmed folks or so I am told from some here.

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    Sublime

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    Who are you? Paul Kersey?

    Just a guy willing to help my fellow man or woman. You know, kinda like having access to a fire extinguisher and using it at a fire. Or maybe pulling my first aid kit out of the trunk to use if driving up on a MVA. Of course I won't need the TQ as I am told by some here but hey, I could use the quickclot or a pressure bandage. I could use a flashlight to direct traffic so there is not another one. If it was your wife or kids and you weren't around, wouldn't you want that? Selflessness?
     

    BillFairbanks

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    Just a guy willing to help my fellow man or woman. You know, kinda like having access to a fire extinguisher and using it at a fire.

    as opposed to acting like George

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    easy rider

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    Just a guy willing to help my fellow man or woman. You know, kinda like having access to a fire extinguisher and using it at a fire. Or maybe pulling my first aid kit out of the trunk to use if driving up on a MVA. Of course I won't need the TQ as I am told by some here but hey, I could use the quickclot or a pressure bandage. I could use a flashlight to direct traffic so there is not another one. If it was your wife or kids and you weren't around, wouldn't you want that? Selflessness?
    Although I don't have a wife and my kids have families of their own, I don't expect anyone to take a bullet for them unless that was their job. It may work out great in the movies, but running into an unknown situation guns blazing is foolish to me.
     

    Sublime

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    Although I don't have a wife and my kids have families of their own, I don't expect anyone to take a bullet for them unless that was their job. It may work out great in the movies, but running into an unknown situation guns blazing is foolish to me.

    So your adult kids need help and you aren't there so no good upstanding person should help them if it is not their job and it involves risk?? Maybe it is foolish to you that someone would be selfless and risk their life for another (if they aren't getting paid for it). It ain't just the movies. Time and time again, we see when someone using force engages the AS, he stops or kills himself. That is not a movie.
     

    easy rider

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    So your adult kids need help and you aren't there so no good upstanding person should help them if it is not their job and it involves risk?? Maybe it is foolish to you that someone would be selfless and risk their life for another (if they aren't getting paid for it). It ain't just the movies. Time and time again, we see when someone using force engages the AS, he stops or kills himself. That is not a movie.
    If you are talking about the scenario that the OP laid out to begin with, no I don't think finding out where a shooter might be is logical. Even the police assess the situation first and have back up for those going in to where the shooter is.
     

    candcallen

    Crotchety, Snarky, Truthful. You'll get over it.
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    So your adult kids need help and you aren't there so no good upstanding person should help them if it is not their job and it involves risk?? Maybe it is foolish to you that someone would be selfless and risk their life for another (if they aren't getting paid for it). It ain't just the movies. Time and time again, we see when someone using force engages the AS, he stops or kills himself. That is not a movie.
    That's not what he said.
     

    45tex

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    Most, even little departments include some life insurance. And like the Military your brothers and sisters will be there for the family as well
    Like you and many others, I signed that dotted line, three times. Would do it again and have been actively thinking about again.

    One slight difference between military and possibly LEO. As a civilian, I have no SGLI to take care of my family afterwards.

    Does that mean I won’t protect my fellow Americans if the poo hit the fan and I was in a favorable position to eliminate the threat? No, just the personal situation of me writing that check has a much more potential negative effect for MY family. As a husband and father, one of my first duties is to them.
     

    oldag

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    Although I don't have a wife and my kids have families of their own, I don't expect anyone to take a bullet for them unless that was their job. It may work out great in the movies, but running into an unknown situation guns blazing is foolish to me.
    You are assuming that citizen is running in with "guns blazing". What justifies that assumption?

    You are assuming that that the situation is unknown. What justifies that assumption?

    Those assumptions could well be incorrect.
     

    Sublime

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    That's not what he said.

    Ok, elaborate then. I think he could have said that if I did in fact twist his reply around (which I didn't)
    He clearly mentioned the act of helping someone being a part of their job, ie. any armed civilian should never try to help others if in the position to do so. Explain which part I twisted.
     

    easy rider

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    You are assuming that citizen is running in with "guns blazing". What justifies that assumption?

    You are assuming that that the situation is unknown. What justifies that assumption?

    Those assumptions could well be incorrect.
    My assumption is that we are keeping with this scenario:

    One scenario I keep thinking about is this:

    I'm by myself at Walmart around 6:00PM and I'm minding my own business somewhere towards the back of the store. I suddenly hear semi-auto fire coming from near the right main entrance (most Walmarts I've seen have a left and a right entrance). I feel as though I would immediately look for cover and listen to gather more information; where exactly the shots are coming from, what kind of firearm is being used, how many shooters are there, how many people are in the area of the shooter, if the shooter is shouting anything, if anyone is around me, etc. After that I know for a fact that I would subconsciously want to sneak from the rear of the store to behind the shooter (keeping cover incase he turns around), wait for a clear shot, and plant three to four rounds in the "V" as quickly and accurately as I can.

    Unless there is another I'm unaware of.
     

    oldag

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    My assumption is that we are keeping with this scenario:

    One scenario I keep thinking about is this:

    I'm by myself at Walmart around 6:00PM and I'm minding my own business somewhere towards the back of the store. I suddenly hear semi-auto fire coming from near the right main entrance (most Walmarts I've seen have a left and a right entrance). I feel as though I would immediately look for cover and listen to gather more information; where exactly the shots are coming from, what kind of firearm is being used, how many shooters are there, how many people are in the area of the shooter, if the shooter is shouting anything, if anyone is around me, etc. After that I know for a fact that I would subconsciously want to sneak from the rear of the store to behind the shooter (keeping cover incase he turns around), wait for a clear shot, and plant three to four rounds in the "V" as quickly and accurately as I can.

    Unless there is another I'm unaware of.
    So where is the going in with guns blazing in that scenario, Easy? I don't see it.

    Where does it say that the citizen does not assess the situation? I don't see it. Or do people think that only LEO's possess some unique power and thus are the only ones capable of assessing situations?

    Exaggeration does not help the conversation.
     

    easy rider

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    So where is the going in with guns blazing in that scenario, Easy? I don't see it.

    Where does it say that the citizen does not assess the situation? I don't see it. Or do people think that only LEO's possess some unique power and thus are the only ones capable of assessing situations?

    Exaggeration does not help the conversation.
    May I assume you have heard of "figure of speech"?
     

    easy rider

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    Do what you feel is best, I believe it's foolish to go towards rifle fire with a handgun not knowing where or how many gunmen are in the store.
     
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