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  • Coop45

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    Not a spelling nazi, but do enjoy fun facts. Bufo alvarius does not produce venom, so the article got that wrong. They, along with many other toads, produce poison (bufotoxin), primarily through their parotid glands (big circles behind the eyes on the skin). Venom has to be injected to be dangerous, such as snake venom, which as it turns out, isn't always poisonous. Poisons must be ingested, inhaled or absorbed.

    Licking toads and smoking toad skins has been a way to get stoned for many hundreds of years.
    Does this mean that I am not weird?
    Texas SOT
     

    benenglish

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    Nacho Vidal never struck me as particularly smart. He worked hard and had lots of success but the few times I was in the same room, the couple of times we spoke, he always seemed a bit off, a bit manic. I chalked it up to a high default energy level or maybe cocaine. Either way, I never sought to hang out with the guy.

    Sadly, this incident doesn't really surprise me.
     

    Glenn B

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    Not a spelling nazi, but do enjoy fun facts. Bufo alvarius does not produce venom, so the article got that wrong. They, along with many other toads, produce poison (bufotoxin), primarily through their parotid glands (big circles behind the eyes on the skin). Venom has to be injected to be dangerous, such as snake venom, which as it turns out, isn't always poisonous. Poisons must be ingested, inhaled or absorbed.

    Licking toads and smoking toad skins has been a way to get stoned for many hundreds of years.

    As far as licking Colorado River Toads (aka: Sonoran Toads, aka: Bufo alvaris or Incilius alvarius) the main substance that causes the high is N,N-Dimethyl-5-methoxytryptamine (compound); it a hallucinogen but is not the same as dimethyltryptamine but similar in effect. It is derived from a bufotenin/bufotenine.

    As far as the parotid glands go, they are not "big circles" behind the eyes; you may be confusing those with the tympanic membrane or the tympanum (aka: external ear of frogs and toads). The parotid gland is behind and or above the tympanum. In the pictures below the parotid gland and tympanic membrane are easily seen and distinguished from one another. Some toads, like the Sonoran Desert Toad, also have parotid glands on their rear legs.

    Bufo_marinus_from_Australia.jpg



    toad copy.jpg


    As far as snake venom goes, snake venom does not need to be "injected", it merely needs to enter the bloodstream. It can do so through open cuts, scrapes or other sores, through the eyes (think spitting cobra), and even through the nasal membranes. If you drink venom, say of a rattler - (mainly hemotoxic/hemmoragic with some neurotoxin - with the possible exception of the Mojave Rattlesnake that can have a highly neurotoxic and highly hemotoxic venom mixture or primarily either one, see: https://phys.org/news/2019-01-mojave-rattlesnakes-life-threatening-venom-widespread.html) - your stomach acid may neutralize it because it is protein based; however, should you have canker sores, gum disease with bleeding gums, herpes sores, syphilis chancres or any open wounds in your mouth, throat or esophagus (and maybe even in your stomach like a bleeding ulcer) you would quite possibly be in serious trouble including serious bodily harm up to and including death. That is as far as mostly hemotoxic venom goes. If on the other hand you ingested mostly neurotoxic venom, that might be another story. I am none to sure about whether or not someone could digest neurotoxic venom. In any event, someone would be quite foolish to try to ingest snake venom thinking it would not be harmful in any way.

    Of course, anyone would be rather foolish to crystallize and smoke toad secretion scrapings, dry the toad skin and smoke it or to lick live toads. I caught many specimens of Bufo alvarius during temporary work assignments and vacations to the Sonoran desert near Tucson over a decade ago. I never got high nor ill from handling them. The other states than AZ, they would be CA and NM where these toads are/were found, protected them completely back then. AZ was the only state that allowed taking them, with a fishing license as I recall. Funny thing is, if you visit the Arizona Game & Fish Department's amphibian page on the web, you will not see this species listed. See: https://www.azgfd.com/wildlife/nongamemanagement/amphibians/ I guess they do not want to advertise that these toads are native to AZ. The below pictured is one of the many I caught, you can still see the sand colored earth, in which it had buried itself to estivate, stuck to its head. The distinct white nodes at the corners of the mouth are a sure giveaway that the toad in hand is a Sonoran Desert Toad.

    Sonora Desert Toad 1.jpg


    By now they may be completely protected in AZ as well as they were in CA and NM. I handled scores of them if not hundreds. They were all over the place after heavy summertime rains. For much of the year they hibernate or estivate (depending on the season) underground. Once it rains heavily in the spring and or summer, they come out to breed in temporary pools. Their common name near Tucson was Sonoran Desert Toad as opposed to Colorado River Toad, I would guess because they were quite distant from the Colorado River. More on them here, here and here. I must say, they make an interesting addition to a herper's collection.
     

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    Glenn B

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    The parotid glands on the hind legs of this Sonoran Desert Toad are easily distinguishable, appearing like bumps, from the rest of the leg.

    288-6-13%29_78_circulo_montana%2C_patagonia_lake_ranch_estates%2C_scc%2C_az_-01_%289466158294%29.jpg
     

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    Coop45

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    Yep. No Navy, can't swim WAS, No Air Force, fly worse than I swim, No Marines, not stupid, that just left the army when Uncle Sam asked politely if I would join him for a little overseas adventure.

    I hate camping now.
     

    Coop45

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    Now I understand why my Bernese Mountain dog would carry toads on his mouth.
     
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