..question..is a Red Dot on a pistol.....

[Whisky]

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is a Red Dot on a pistol any good for accurate target shoot (like a Laser is not) or is it more for a "Gun Fighters" pistol ? thanks

Enhanced Capabilities Pistol Package On Your Glock Pistol

 

[ECS]

I would think they would be real good for accurate target shooting.

I've been out of the loop these last few weeks. Your link is the first I've noticed that they will mount a DeltaPoint for you.

Maybe a rule you could go by is something like an RM02 or RM07 for gunfighting or an RM06 for accuracy.

To be honest, I wouldn't hesitate to put an RM06 on a gunfighting handgun.

It is a deadly quick way of doing business, especially if you appendix-carry it like many of us carry those handguns.

I have an RM06 on a Glock 20sf. That works really well, but I've gotten past carrying that. If I feel like carrying a 10mil, I carry my 1911.

This G19 is my sometimes-carry.

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[M. Sage]

Good for accuracy and speed, IMO.

 

[SIG_Fiend]

Red dots can allow a shooter to shoot very accurately with a pistol. The main limiting factor with the red dot itself is the MOA size of the dot as well as the shape. Ultimately accuracy is primarily a function of the skill of the shooter.

As far as shooting at speed, what I've found is that, for the average shooter, there is probably not a huge difference. Some average shooters might find that it feels "easier" for them to shoot fast with the red dot, and I attribute much of this to an increased level of relaxation due to the shooter no longer having to juggle front sight, rear sight, the target all while focusing on only one of the 3.

That being said, from a pure speed standpoint, I find there are some hurdles to overcome with red dots, that the average shooter might not yet have the capability to do and truly extract max performance out of the RDS setup. What I mean by that is, I would say there is probably not a massive difference in speed between an average shooter using a RDS, and the same shooter gaining a bit more experience and confidence in their abilities with iron sights. Without a solid and optimal grip method, upper body stance, followthrough, all the other fundamentals, and experience shooting at speed, a shooter is going to have a less consistent index and still spend time trying to find the red dot initially as well as trying to find the red dot on followthrough. All of that is really not any different than having to take time finding the iron sights. Ultimately, the best way to see what actual differences in performance are achieved for a given shooter is in consistency of group size (shoot B-8 bulls for score at 25yds+) as well as measuring the results on a shot timer (shoot some Bill Drills), same shooter shooting the same type of gun setup nearly identical, with the sight method being the difference. Anything else would be subjective at best.

 

[ECS]

And that is why I will never describe a firearm as being "accurate". I might say that a firearm is a "straight-shooter", but never "accurate".

In the case of fighting guns, I believe that even the idea of "accuracy" can be subjective.

If I can shoot someone in the face at 30 yards, to me that's accurate. Your idea of accuracy may require that I be able to shoot someone in the right eye at 30 yards.

As was maybe just said, a red dot may not be some sort of magical solution. The solution is a learning of the fundamentals.

When I shoot at a public range, I'm always struck by how poorly seemingly most people shoot.

They were never taught the fundamentals.

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[Younggun]

I wouldn't put a red dot on my defense pistols for one reason.

At this point I don't have the muscle memory to have the sight lined up immediately on draw. Playing with red dots I have to "find" the dot. Takes me longer to do that than it does to get the sights lined up because there's not much reference.

 

[Jon Payne]

I wouldn't put a red dot on my defense pistols for one reason.

At this point I don't have the muscle memory to have the sight lined up immediately on draw. Playing with red dots I have to "find" the dot. Takes me longer to do that than it does to get the sights lined up because there's not much reference.

Notice the suppressor sights. They are the reference. Line up your irons and your red dot is sitting at the tip of your front sight.


The two most dangerous places in today's world:
1.) a gun free zone
2.) your comfort zone

 

[Whisky]

Red dots can allow a shooter to shoot very accurately with a pistol. The main limiting factor with the red dot itself is the MOA size of the dot as well as the shape..

this sorta answers my question...

I believe what I'm getting is "yes, a red dot is good for accurate target shooting" (?)

thanks for the input folks

 

[V-Tach]

This is my Son's edc...a little too pimped for my taste. He has run courses at CSAT with it and performed quite well with it.

He did the stipple job and the jeweling of the slide.

 

[Whisky]

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I noticed that your Son's pistol doesn't have suppressor sights installed - any reason for that ? (yep, a bit too much "bling" for me too..)

 

[ECS]

I was in your place earlier today with the G19 in post #2. I wonder if that's the Glock I saw on his hip. I saw stippling and I saw that silver slide. Didn't see the RMR by the time I decided to look away before Tyler got the idea that I might be checking out his rear-end.

It seems that some people need suppressor sights to provide some sort of reference that aids in picking up that red dot. Plenty of people do not.

Even if you don't need that reference point, I suppose they can be used as back-up sights.

I never see my sights.

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[V-Tach]

I was in your place earlier today with the G19 in post #2. I wonder if that's the Glock I saw on his hip. I saw stippling and I saw that silver slide. Didn't see the RMR by the time I decided to look away before Tyler got the idea that I might be checking out his rear-end.

It seems that some people need suppressor sights to provide some sort of reference that aids in picking up that red dot. Plenty of people do not.

Even if you don't need that reference point, I suppose they can be used as back-up sights.

I never see my sights.

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LOL.....yes, it was the same pistol...

 

[Pistol Pete]

Bullseye shooters have been using them for years. They are easily used by folks with old eyes as well as those younger folks. I think the action shooters also use them. I can't see much use for them in a self defense situation, better to learn to point and shoot or use the open sights if time allows.

 

[Big Dipper]

Bullseye shooters have been using them for years. They are easily used by folks with old eyes as well as those younger folks. I think the action shooters also use them. I can't see much use for them in a self defense situation, better to learn to point and shoot or use the open sights if time allows.

... and not depend on the battery working.

 

[navyguy]

Bullseye shooters have been using them for years. They are easily used by folks with old eyes as well as those younger folks. I think the action shooters also use them. I can't see much use for them in a self defense situation, better to learn to point and shoot or use the open sights if time allows.

I was just going to type something similar. I have an Ultra Dot on my Buckmark, and although I shoot pretty well with the fiber optic 3 dot sight, the Red dot closes my groups by about 50% at 25 yards. But I couldn't see myself having one on a defense pistol. On the other had, my AR has a red dot and I think that is just fine.

 

[M. Sage]

Bullseye shooters have been using them for years. They are easily used by folks with old eyes as well as those younger folks. I think the action shooters also use them. I can't see much use for them in a self defense situation, better to learn to point and shoot or use the open sights if time allows.

Action shooters do use them where permitted by rules. Red dot sights allow you to focus your vision on the target, not the front sight post, and to make accurate hits very quickly.

But you're right... why would anybody want to be able to keep a bad guy in focus without sacrificing their ability to aim precisely and make accurate hits faster and something you know you'll be able to see in any lighting? I mean, it's a life or death situation is all, and tradition is important damn it!

Seriously, all the reasons everybody puts optics on their fighting rifle? Same reasons to put them on a pistol.

... and not depend on the battery working.

Dual-illuminated RMR. Batteries?

Also, the tall profile sights are a good idea. Heaven forbid we have redundant aiming systems on our defensive guns...

 

[Jon Payne]

Ok, I'm impressed ^^THIS^^

The dual illuminated RMR does work. My experience is that it tends to wash out in very bright environments, but I have used one in a snow storm. I prefer the battery operated LED models like the RM02 and RM07.

 

[THE LAREDOAN]

I was a bullseye shooter and used red dots in my guns with better results than using only iron sights,but had to do it because my eyesight wasn't getting better with time...also for steel challenge red dots work good....but for self defense,I don't know,but think point shooting works better.

 

[Whisky]

I was a bullseye shooter and used red dots in my guns with better results than using only iron sights,but had to do it because my eyesight wasn't getting better with time...also for steel challenge red dots work good....but for self defense,I don't know,but think point shooting works better.

thank you for the reply.....self defense/gun fighting ISN'T the reason that I'm interested in a RDS - I, like you, have eyes that are growing old and I was interested to find out if a red dot sight would be "better" for me, for target shooting.

instead of buying another pistol (which I don't care to do) I think "mods" to a few of my existing pistols might satisfy the urge to "get something" - and, at the same time, help out the eyesight.....

 

[THE LAREDOAN]

thank you for the reply.....self defense/gun fighting ISN'T the reason that I'm interested in a RDS - I, like you, have eyes that are growing old and I was interested to find out if a red dot sight would be "better" for me, for target shooting..

Definitely,a red dot will work better for you....for bullseye I used a red dot with no more than 3 moa,preferably a 2 moa dot.