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  • Shotgun Jeremy

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    Like I said. I've never shot with a red dot, so I have no experience with them. What's the difference in $40 and say $80 like Primary Arms offers? Doesn't seem like near as big a jump as the $80 vs. the $400 I see for some of them. So $80 is ok but $40 is not? Where's the cut off?

    Not trying to be a smarta$$, I've just always used the old fashioned stuff so I really know nothing about this dot stuff.

    My very first red dot was a Leapers brand. I figured a red dot is a red dot, right? I didn't see the point in buying something expensive. Well, here's what I learned the hard way. A cheap china made, $40 sight will probably work for a .22. They're designed for airsoft guns with little to no recoil. Once you start getting the recoil going like on a .223 rifle, the electronics start getting shaken up and connections mess up, and the dot will start moving around-taking you off target. They also, generally aren't waterproof and quality control is lacking.

    Now, Primary Arms...they're also made in China (as I understand), but there is much more put into the designing of the sights. They put better parts in them and design them differently so that you don't have to worry about your dot walking off target from shooting a standard rifle. They put better/more o-rings in them so that a little water won't hurt them. They give them better internal electronics that give you smaller MOA's and don't get messed up with a little bit of recoil. PA designs their optics to be able to handle your average shooter-someone who takes care of their things and mainly just shoots at the range or hunting on occasion.

    I've seen several times where people talk about using their red dots for hard core applications, and every time, Primary Arms lets them know that these sights aren't designed to be relied upon in a heavy duty application. They basically went and made these sights as quality as they could, without making them heavy duty. From what I've seen, you can do everything with a PA Micro that you can with an Aimpoint Micro, except go diving and drop it out of a helicopter and expect it to keep going (I saw an Aimpoint do this and keep on going-it was amazing). So as long as you don't plan on doing any sort of special operations with your rifle, buying a PA optic should be good to go.
     

    F350-6

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    Thanks TXI, although I'm not encouraged by your post. I'm a young strapping lad and don't require glasses or contacts for everyday or distance vision. But unfortunately 43 has come and gone, so I have had to use reading glasses (with astigmatism correction) for more years than I care to admit now.
     

    robertc1024

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    My very first red dot was a Leapers brand. I figured a red dot is a red dot, right? I didn't see the point in buying something expensive. Well, here's what I learned the hard way. A cheap china made, $40 sight will probably work for a .22. They're designed for airsoft guns with little to no recoil. Once you start getting the recoil going like on a .223 rifle, the electronics start getting shaken up and connections mess up, and the dot will start moving around-taking you off target. They also, generally aren't waterproof and quality control is lacking.

    Now, Primary Arms...they're also made in China (as I understand), but there is much more put into the designing of the sights. They put better parts in them and design them differently so that you don't have to worry about your dot walking off target from shooting a standard rifle. They put better/more o-rings in them so that a little water won't hurt them. They give them better internal electronics that give you smaller MOA's and don't get messed up with a little bit of recoil. PA designs their optics to be able to handle your average shooter-someone who takes care of their things and mainly just shoots at the range or hunting on occasion.

    I've seen several times where people talk about using their red dots for hard core applications, and every time, Primary Arms lets them know that these sights aren't designed to be relied upon in a heavy duty application. They basically went and made these sights as quality as they could, without making them heavy duty. From what I've seen, you can do everything with a PA Micro that you can with an Aimpoint Micro, except go diving and drop it out of a helicopter and expect it to keep going (I saw an Aimpoint do this and keep on going-it was amazing). So as long as you don't plan on doing any sort of special operations with your rifle, buying a PA optic should be good to go.
    You are probably 100% right. I fortunately have to funds to buy an Aimpoint. My fun with tacticool is buying some Negro Modelo for my buds.
     

    ROGER4314

    Been Called "Flash" Since I Was A Kid!
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    Jul 11, 2009
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    Thanks Roger. I pretty much knew that, I think. But, having it put in understandable print, makes it less hard to figure out.

    That's OK. A lot of other people read these threads and maybe someone else can use the information. I hope that you got the answers that you needed.

    Flash
     

    Whisky

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    Jan 27, 2013
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    I recently had a Trijicon RMR 6.5moa RDS installed on my Wife's G34 Glock - we like it we like it we like it ! my G19 is next

    originally ordered a 3.25moa but changed to the 6.5 and I'm glad I did (we don't pistol shoot past 25yds - except for my Rebel .22lr) so the 6.5 is the best for us

    had the folks at One Source Tactical do the milling/mounting and suppressor sight install (also bought the hardware from them)

    if I had (a lot) more "pistol cash" I'd have all our pistols wearing RDS

    006_zpsfd475cf1.gif
     

    NOLA Jack

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    In simple terms, yes. The higher the MOA, the bigger amount of target the dot covers and the less accurate it becomes the farther out you shoot.



    Sorry to hijack, but I've never used a red dot sight and was just starting to look for one for a 22 pistol. I haven't seen this issue mentioned before, but since I do have astigmatism, are there any other sights out there that use a triangle or other shape that make it easier for folks like me? I really didn't want to drop that kind of money on a Leopold for some plinking.

    You should try a few different dots. My astigmatism doesn't make much difference except with a delta point triangle. For pistol optics the aimpoint micro and trijicon RMR are the best two sites currently availible. If you're going to carry it get one of those two. If you're going to put it on a 22lr for range time, a used delta point or a primary arms would be much cheaper and suit you just fine.

    If you get a gun milled for an optic(don't waste the money doing this with a 22lr) I'd strongly suggest the unity tactical atom mount. It is better than a lot of the cheaper alternatives because it is forward comparable with pretty much any optic and the rear sight is in front of the optic. This is important because it helps protect the glass from ejecting brass and when doing one handed manipulations.
     
    Last edited:

    TAVM

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    I thought the go-to systems for red dots were (most to least expensive) aimpoint, eotech, lucid, and vortex?

    And yes some dots with look more like a cluster depending on your eyes.
     

    Shotgun Jeremy

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    I like that micro! I may have to pick one up.


    Those ARE the top brands for people who either want to go all out or are using them on a work rifle. For the rest of us....there's PA. ;)

    Sent from my SGH-S959G using Tapatalk 2
     

    NOLA Jack

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    I thought the go-to systems for red dots were (most to least expensive) aimpoint, eotech, lucid, and vortex?

    And yes some dots with look more like a cluster depending on your eyes.

    Certainly not for pistols ;)
     

    TheDan

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    I recently had a Trijicon RMR 6.5moa RDS installed on my Wife's G34 Glock - we like it we like it we like it ! my G19 is next
    What is it that you like about it? I have an RMR on my M&P pro. I'm still on the fence on whether I like it or not; leaning towards not. I find it helps speed of acquiring the target and accuracy for distance shooting, but it seems useless for me at close up speed shooting.
     

    NOLA Jack

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    What is it that you like about it? I have an RMR on my M&P pro. I'm still on the fence on whether I like it or not; leaning towards not. I find it helps speed of acquiring the target and accuracy for distance shooting, but it seems useless for me at close up speed shooting.

    You probably won't see many gains there, but you shouldn't see any loss either. Where it really shines in shooting around cover, alternative shooting positions, and speeding up shots beyond 10 yards.
     

    TheDan

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    You probably won't see many gains there, but you shouldn't see any loss either. Where it really shines in shooting around cover, alternative shooting positions, and speeding up shots beyond 10 yards.
    Yeah, I do see the advantages at distance. Not so sure on the advantage on awkward shots. The window on the RMR is so small that you have to have the sights mostly lined up before you can see the dot. If I'm not perfectly consistent with where I hold the pistol and position my head I end up chasing the dot. In a scenario where I'd have to fish for sight alignment I think it would be just as slow or slower with the dot. I need to try it out, tho.
     

    NOLA Jack

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    Yeah, I do see the advantages at distance. Not so sure on the advantage on awkward shots. The window on the RMR is so small that you have to have the sights mostly lined up before you can see the dot. If I'm not perfectly consistent with where I hold the pistol and position my head I end up chasing the dot. In a scenario where I'd have to fish for sight alignment I think it would be just as slow or slower with the dot. I need to try it out, tho.

    I was shooting a vtac barrier with one last Sunday, once you get down to the bottom 3 holes you really see the benefit. It is a lot easier than trying to get a good sight picture. The one place I had trouble was with the narrow slots the WML made the gun impossible to put through vertically without blocking the dot due to its height. Not really a problem, but it surprised me and slowed me down a little until I worked through it.

    I still lose the dot occasionally, especially drawing from concealment with the sun behind the target. I'm using a RM02, so it adjusts to the dark and doesn't brighten up fast enough, same thing happens putting too much light on a white wall in a dark building. I'm putting some thought into switching to an aimpoint, I've shot them a couple of times and they are very nice. The tube has the effect of drawing your eye to the dot and makes finding it easier.
     

    Kyle

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    Feb 24, 2011
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    I bought a 40$ red dot on eBay. I put it on my ruger 22/45 and zeros it and noticed it wouldn't hold zero and the brightness could change randomly. I couldn't get that pos off my gun and literally onto a chopping block fast enough. A few hits with the axe and it was made better than I thought, but I eventually broke the shot out of it.
    I am most likely not buying a red dot again unless it's made in Texas from primary arms

    I picked up a cheapo, no brand, micro dot on ebay (34.99) and threw it on my AK... It is rock solid, the dot could be nicer, but I wont complain too much for that price. So far, after 200+ rounds, she is still thumping steel at 100yards with about 4+- MOA accuracy, no movement. maybe I got lucky? I know it hasnt been extensively tested, but in my experience, if they are going to fail hard, it will be in the first few hundred rounds. I dont typically skimp on optics, but I gave this a whirl and am plenty happy so far.
     
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