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  • Fishkiller

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    Jul 22, 2019
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    So define "use the roads" Guy driving 75 miles a day in West Texas where the speed limit is 75 mph so he only drives an hour, or the guy living in Dallas/Houston who drives 15 miles a day, but spends 3 hours on the road due to traffic? And what about the guy paying to drive on a toll road to avoid the traffic? Does he pay extra with the tax and the toll?
    it should also extend to the knobs riding bicycles. they should pay for the bike lanes, not use money from gas tax.
    Hurley's Gold
     

    TX OMFS

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    Nov 3, 2014
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    The entire Government run school system is a money sink. Most private schools do much more with way less.

    I don't have numbers for Texas so I'll fall back to Portland OR.

    The Jesuit high school in Portland charged $13K per year. It's a private school associated with the Catholic church. The students there consistently scored very high in state mandated testing.

    Portland Public Schools were spending $21k per student with mostly dismal results.

    1. Get the Government out of the school business. The ONLY thing Government should do is collect school taxes and issue vouchers to parents. Parents then can take that voucher to whatever school they want.
    2. Get sports out of the school system. If you want your kid to play sports then join a club and pay for it.
    3. Schools should teach reading, writing, math, science, and civics/social studies.
    4. Get rid of the current schedule. Teachers work a part time job. Go to a six weeks on, two weeks off schedule, year round. It's patently stupid to have schools sitting empty for the entire summer. Also this should make it so that the average student can obtain a high school education by the time they are 16.
    5. Go back to teaching practical skills, welding, auto shop, wood shop, metal shop, plumbing, electrical work. Stuff that pays a living wage.
    6. At the 9th grade level allow students to pick a path, college bound or skills based. By the age of 18 students should either have an associates degree OR have a journeyman's skill level.
    7. Scrap the whole idea of spending stupid amounts of money on the lowest 10% of the students. Instead spend that money on the top 10%.
    8. Scrap the idea that schools should be medical babysitting for profoundly disabled kids. I'm sorry that your kid was born blind, deaf, and mute with severe brain damage. Your kid isn't "learning" anything at school. Hell, your kid doesn't even know they are in school. There's no reason that a school should be forced to pay for medical transportation for your kid, two nurses and three therapists to "teach" your kid. There was a school district that was spending HALF it's transpiration budget to move ONE profoundly disabled girl to and from school. It was an ambulance ride each way.
    9. Break the grip of the NEA on education.
    10. Get rid of the Department of Education at the federal level.

    The Government run school system is failing students. High school students are reading at an average of 5th grade level. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/top-reading_n_1373680

    To me that's functionally illiterate.

    Most high school graduates can't do basic consumer math without a calculator. They don't understand basic science. But they can tell you all about the 205 genders.

    Get the government out of schools completely. Point #1 is still wealth redistribution. Let the market sort out all the other points.
     

    oldag

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    Any smoothbrain dimwit knows there are schools that are directly funded by parents, philanthropists, and other organizations like churches. There's also curriculums that are designed to be instructed by parents, and even schools that are totally free that can be accessed from anywhere in the world with an internet connection.

    Any slobbering imbecile knows that having the education system rely on tax money has created a self feeding beast that teaches children big government collectivism, and we obviously need new ways of funding education.

    View attachment 199383

    But what percentage of the students attend private grade school? That only serves a small slice.

    The money has to come from somewhere. Don't want to pay school taxes? Fine. You will pay a lot for private schools when no tax money is coming in.

    Schools don't operate free, as any slobbering imbecile should know. The money HAS to come from somewhere.
     

    oldag

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    Then we can each choose a different creative option for school instead of mainstream! My family didn’t benefit from any (school directed) funds raised from taxes, and we are both working stiffs. School-coops are a thing, and they could easily flourish with more folks participating.

    This week is national school choice week by the way.
    https://schoolchoiceweek.com/about/...LNDnWC83K_YMq1Ts8EJuHOSIvtkba9URoCYFgQAvD_BwE
    If one wants to change to a different form of education, fine. But it still won't be free.
     

    Younggun

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    6   0   0
    Jul 31, 2011
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    hill co.
    How well schools perform is likely tied much more closely to the social norms of the students than whether or not it’s a private/public school or how much money is spent.

    The school my kids attend does pretty well despite the students all being from a rural area that would be the butt of a joke on CNN while Don Lemon laughed like an idiot. But because the families in he area know the importance of personal responsibility and hard work and raise their kids accordingly the school has good test scores.

    Compare that to an area where social norms are more aligned with victimhood, kids are taught they can’t win or shouldn’t strive, etc and you will have poor results regardless of money spent.

    I’m sure there is a good amount of influence stemming from the fact that parents are paying directly towards the education and for that reason take a much more active roll in insuring that money is not wasted. But the parents who are willing to make that sacrifice are probably already raising their children to work hard and be responsible. Those kids would probably due equally well in the public school, although I can’t compare the quality of the education they would receive.

    Private schools do have more incentive to perform well due to their need to attract paying customers. However this can be a double edged sword. There have been cases of private schools falsifying scores in order to bump up their stats. I don’t believe this is extremely common, but it isn’t unheard of either.

    In my town, I can say that there are plenty of families that couldn’t pay 13k a year per student. Those families would be mighty upset if they were told the next year they would need to come up with 13-39k or their kids couldn’t go to school. And these aren’t people sitting home waiting for a welfare check.

    The biggest issue we face (aside from public schools being taken over by the left) is the government mandate that all problems be solved by throwing money at them. No amount of money can be thrown at a school to overcome issues that stem from cultural and social issues.

    Meanwhile, morons are still voting to pass a bond for that stupid fucking football stadium and worrying more about the game on Friday night than their kids report card. Asking how practice went instead of what they learned about that day. Politics is downstream from society. You’ll never fix any of the problems discussed here without first getting the community to make kids education a real priority in the home, not just a political talking point.




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    Wildcat Diva

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    If one wants to change to a different form of education, fine. But it still won't be free.
    I wasn’t referring to it being free.

    I was replying to the comment as to what could come next (comment about the public schools potentially shutting down in the wake of the theoretical case of property tax being abolished).
     

    Moonpie

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    Oct 4, 2013
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    Gunz are icky.
    So define "use the roads" Guy driving 75 miles a day in West Texas where the speed limit is 75 mph so he only drives an hour, or the guy living in Dallas/Houston who drives 15 miles a day, but spends 3 hours on the road due to traffic? And what about the guy paying to drive on a toll road to avoid the traffic? Does he pay extra with the tax and the toll?

    Use of the roads is simple.
    If you drive on them you're using them.
    75 miles is 75 miles. 15 miles is 15 miles.
    EVERY BODY who uses the roads pays.
    Bicycles and motorcycles too.
    Payment would be based on your odometer every year at inspection time. You get a bill. That way people would see exactly how much they're getting roo-roo'ed.
    You want to take a toll road? That's on you.
     

    pronstar

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    Jul 2, 2017
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    Dallas
    Little known fact:
    Heavy trucks are tesponsible for 99% of road wear caused by vehicles.
    And their road fees are 35% of total road fees assessed.

    Weather takes a huge toll as well...

    Passenger vehicles don’t really cause roadway wear.

    Lots of info here and below:

    https://truecostblog.com/2009/06/02/the-hidden-trucking-industry-subsidy/

    f89d5e45bd99a9f5524646e9f769fbc8.jpg



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    TheDan

    deplorable malcontent scofflaw
    Rating - 100%
    8   0   0
    Nov 11, 2008
    27,551
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    Austin - Rockdale
    Heavy trucks are tesponsible for 99% of road wear caused by vehicles.
    And their road fees are 35% of total road fees assessed.
    That's why it can't be mileage alone; needs to be a GVWR + mileage calculation ...and all those damn city buses aren't exempt.
    ...or just privatize the roads.

    Weather takes a huge toll as well...
    Just tax Al Gore then.
     

    Wildcat Diva

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    0   0   0
    Aug 26, 2016
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    Use of the roads is simple.
    If you drive on them you're using them.
    75 miles is 75 miles. 15 miles is 15 miles.
    EVERY BODY who uses the roads pays.
    Bicycles and motorcycles too.
    Payment would be based on your odometer every year at inspection time. You get a bill. That way people would see exactly how much they're getting roo-roo'ed.
    You want to take a toll road? That's on you.

    if you buy or sell a vehicle within any given year, then the miles aren’t going to compute correctly per person when it matches up at inspection time.
     

    Wildcat Diva

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    Also, what about if I want to go off roading in my truck? Or go mudding on private property? That’s gonna rack up miles that are not being used on any roads.
     

    avvidclif

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    3   0   0
    Aug 30, 2017
    5,794
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    Van Zandt County
    Little known fact:
    Heavy trucks are tesponsible for 99% of road wear caused by vehicles.
    And their road fees are 35% of total road fees assessed.

    Weather takes a huge toll as well...

    Passenger vehicles don’t really cause roadway wear.

    Lots of info here and below:

    https://truecostblog.com/2009/06/02/the-hidden-trucking-industry-subsidy/

    View attachment 199523


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    The first line on your chart casts doubt on the whole chart as it is totally incorrect. A Big Rig grossing 9 tons. ROTFLMAO. My PU and RV grosses 23k. The Peterbilt I had in the past by itself weighed 19k. Those "facts" cast doubt on the entirety if the chart.
     

    Younggun

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    6   0   0
    Jul 31, 2011
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    hill co.
    The first line on your chart casts doubt on the whole chart as it is totally incorrect. A Big Rig grossing 9 tons. ROTFLMAO. My PU and RV grosses 23k. The Peterbilt I had in the past by itself weighed 19k. Those "facts" cast doubt on the entirety if the chart.

    If the first line is only factoring the tractor then it would be an accurate weight estimate, according to your numbers.

    Would make sense to not factor in trailers due to the large variations in types and sizes.


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    Wildcat Diva

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    You will be taxed because you have a luxury vehicle. Everyone else will be driving 1970 Ladas converted to electric
    I was talking about the odometer miles scenario. It’s not fair to compute road usage tax by odometer miles because not all those miles might be on public roads and there is no way to prove how many miles I drove on the beach or whatever.
     

    Younggun

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    6   0   0
    Jul 31, 2011
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    hill co.
    Most folks I know consider a big rig as the package, tractor and trailer, grossing 40 tons or more.

    It comes from here: http://urbanfortcollins.com/greatest-demand-on-tax-dollars/

    “The American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials (AASHTO) sets a 18,000 pound big-rig as the median vehicle size, and therefore it’s the scale against which all other vehicles are judged. (The largest vehicle allowed on the road has a maximum weight allowance of 80,000 lbs!) I picked a few random vehicles that we might see on our local roads and I’ve used the Fourth Power Law to determine how they stack up in terms of damage caused to roads.”

    Such is the reason for the weight and terms used it seems.

    I doubt if you point at a bobtail freightliner and as someone if it’s a “big rig” they’ll say no. And given that the weight is accurate for a bobtail rig and the numbers were sourced from an organization tasked with determining wear and tear on highway infrastructure in order to help determine the types of materials that should be used based on expected traffic (as best I can tell after briefly checking out their website) I will assume the numbers are at least within ballpark accuracy.

    The link in the article returns a 404 error though and I didn’t bother searching to find the actual source of their numbers. So not going to say it’s impossible that they’ve been fudged in some way or cherry picked from a particular surface type.


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