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  • SIG_Fiend

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    Hi everyone. Just thought I'd set the stage for the intent I have with this section of the forum. For those of you that don't know, I'm a highly analytical person. Feel free to ask any questions you would like here, and I will gladly provide you all of the insight I have in as little or as much detail as you would like. Wanting to mount an optic on your rifle, but not sure how to determine what is a good one, or what mounting hardware to get? How about finding a good holster for concealed carry? What about diagnosing shooting errors? The intent I have is to simplify this stuff for you, so you can learn from my experience, my mistakes, or the mistakes of others. This stuff doesn't have to be so difficult. So feel free to create some threads here and ask away!
    Target Sports
     

    SIG_Fiend

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    What's your favorite semi auto shotgun cycling system and why?

    In a conventional shotgun, the Benelli Inertia Driven action. It's not perfect, however it is simple. While there are plenty of piston shotguns with simplistic designs as well, usually there are also O-rings and port fouling to deal with. I'm lazy. ;) The Benelli M4, with it's dual operating system (piston and inertia) is one of the most robust systems out there IMO.

    As far as a less conventional shotgun, I'd have to say the Saiga 12. Proven platform and it's an incredibly versatile one.
     

    ArmyZach

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    Alright, I'll start this off...

    What's the easiest way to bed a rifle? What's the process in detail?

    Bedding an action is nothing more than using a filler (fiberglass or other resin) to fill the gaps between action and stock.
    A release agent is used on the action, and mixing the resin is just following directions.
    I think the hardest part is setting the job up in such a way that you don't create cleanup work. Lots of tape to protect surfaces and act as dams.
    Brownell's is a great resource, both for material and information. Their methods and materials have stood the test of time and multiple users.
    They are my go to source for any of my tinkering (home spun gunsmithing).
     

    Pilgrim

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    Bedding an action is nothing more than using a filler (fiberglass or other resin) to fill the gaps between action and stock.
    A release agent is used on the action, and mixing the resin is just following directions.
    I think the hardest part is setting the job up in such a way that you don't create cleanup work. Lots of tape to protect surfaces and act as dams.
    Brownell's is a great resource, both for material and information. Their methods and materials have stood the test of time and multiple users.
    They are my go to source for any of my tinkering (home spun gunsmithing).

    I've read a few articles on bedding but it always seems (to me at least) a messy, error-prone process. Maybe I just have an innate fear of locking in my action because I failed to prep the surfaces correctly. I've been meaning to try it but I keep putting it off because of my concerns.

    I had less trepidation getting into reloading so there's no logical reason why I can't bring myself to bed an action...
     

    benenglish

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    Feel free to ask any questions you would like here, and I will gladly provide you all of the insight I have in as little or as much detail as you would like.
    I mean this in the nicest way because what you're offering to do shows a great generosity of spirit...but...you are clearly a glutton for punishment. ;)
     

    benenglish

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    What's the easiest way to bed a rifle? What's the process in detail?
    Assuming you're talking about bolt-action rifles, in my experience there are two ways to go.

    Alternative 1 -

    1. Discard current stock.
    2. Buy 100% aluminum stock.
    3. Torque all bolts to the values specified by the stock maker.
    4. Go to range and test.
    Alternative 2 -

    1. Take rifle to someone with more patience and skill than I will ever possess.
    2. Write large check.
    3. Wait far longer than is reasonable.
    4. Receive rifle, test, and then forget trying to figure out what magic the gunsmithing gods have wrought.
    PS - OK, SIG_Fiend, I'll quit fartin' around in your thread. I just couldn't pass up Pilgrim's invitation to post a smart-ass reply. I have a problem that way. ;)
     

    Dawico

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    I've read a few articles on bedding but it always seems (to me at least) a messy, error-prone process. Maybe I just have an innate fear of locking in my action because I failed to prep the surfaces correctly. I've been meaning to try it but I keep putting it off because of my concerns.

    I had less trepidation getting into reloading so there's no logical reason why I can't bring myself to bed an action...

    Read the directions and go for it. Simple process if you do what the directions say.
     

    Byrd666

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    I think I posted this before but, I can't seem to find it in my history so...

    So here's my problem. I went to the range the other day after finally finding some ammunition, and noticed during my practice session I was developing/having a problem with heeling, or anticipating recoil too much and a lot of my shots were going to the upper right of my target. Not all but, a good deal more than I would like.

    What can I do to correct this problem?

    Additional factors: I am paralyzed on my left side, so I only have the use of my right arm/hand for shooting. NO second hand support at all.

    Edit: This range trip was with was is my EDC, a S&W M&P 9c and the target range varied from 7+- yards to about 50+- yards using 200 rnds of115 grain ball Wolf ammo. And one twelve round clip of Black Hills 124 grn HP, My SD/carry ammo. Attached Thumbnails
    attachment.jpg


    My additional question is a debatable one. Who does the best trigger work on the S&W M&P models at a reasonable price? As how I think that is one of the major factors in my "heeling". I'm in a way fighting the trigger. My assesment.
     
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    ROGER4314

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    I've heard conflicting reports about the rotational speed (RPM) of a .17 HMR bullet as it exits the muzzle of a rifle. How does it compare to rotational speed of other rifles like the 30-06, .308 or .223?

    Flash
     

    Pilgrim

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    Assuming you're talking about bolt-action rifles, in my experience there are two ways to go.

    Alternative 1 -

    1. Discard current stock.
    2. Buy 100% aluminum stock.
    3. Torque all bolts to the values specified by the stock maker.
    4. Go to range and test.
    Alternative 2 -

    1. Take rifle to someone with more patience and skill than I will ever possess.
    2. Write large check.
    3. Wait far longer than is reasonable.
    4. Receive rifle, test, and then forget trying to figure out what magic the gunsmithing gods have wrought.
    PS - OK, SIG_Fiend, I'll quit fartin' around in your thread. I just couldn't pass up Pilgrim's invitation to post a smart-ass reply. I have a problem that way. ;)

    Smart-ass replies are ALWAYS welcome... just make sure there's something "smart" in it lol ;)

    BTW, alternative 2 is my go-to solution for everything :)
     

    Dawico

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    I think I posted this before but, I can't seem to find it in my history so...

    So here's my problem. I went to the range the other day after finally finding some ammunition, and noticed during my practice session I was developing/having a problem with heeling, or anticipating recoil too much and a lot of my shots were going to the upper right of my target. Not all but, a good deal more than I would like.

    What can I do to correct this problem?

    Additional factors: I am paralyzed on my left side, so I only have the use of my right arm/hand for shooting. NO second hand support at all.

    Edit: This range trip was with was is my EDC, a S&W M&P 9c and the target range varied from 7+- yards to about 50+- yards using 200 rnds of115 grain ball Wolf ammo. And one twelve round clip of Black Hills 124 grn HP, My SD/carry ammo. Attached Thumbnails
    attachment.jpg


    My additional question is a debatable one. Who does the best trigger work on the S&W M&P models at a reasonable price? As how I think that is one of the major factors in my "heeling". I'm in a way fighting the trigger. My assesment.
    Dry fire practice will help fix both your issues. Get used to pressing the trigger and holding the gun perfectly still without worrying about recoil. Dry fire will also help naturally break in the trigger.

    The biggest issue is that your gun uses magazines, not clips. Sorry, had to.
     

    Dawico

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    I've heard conflicting reports about the rotational speed (RPM) of a .17 HMR bullet as it exits the muzzle of a rifle. How does it compare to rotational speed of other rifles like the 30-06, .308 or .223?

    Flash

    To compare actual numbers you would have to have an actual cartridge and load in mind as the RPM is based on velocity. Looking at the formula to figure RPM it would appear that the 17HMR has a higher RPM than most of the cartridges listed.

    RPM = MV (muzzle velocity) x (720/ twist rate in inches)

    A quarter of a million RPM is actually fairly common.
     

    SIG_Fiend

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    I've heard conflicting reports about the rotational speed (RPM) of a .17 HMR bullet as it exits the muzzle of a rifle. How does it compare to rotational speed of other rifles like the 30-06, .308 or .223?

    Flash

    Considering typical loads at SAAMI spec and typical twist rates, it is just a bit over the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow (11m/s) to the 4th power. Not a big difference between those calibers.


    I think I posted this before but, I can't seem to find it in my history so...

    So here's my problem. I went to the range the other day after finally finding some ammunition, and noticed during my practice session I was developing/having a problem with heeling, or anticipating recoil too much and a lot of my shots were going to the upper right of my target. Not all but, a good deal more than I would like.

    What can I do to correct this problem?

    Additional factors: I am paralyzed on my left side, so I only have the use of my right arm/hand for shooting. NO second hand support at all.

    Edit: This range trip was with was is my EDC, a S&W M&P 9c and the target range varied from 7+- yards to about 50+- yards using 200 rnds of115 grain ball Wolf ammo. And one twelve round clip of Black Hills 124 grn HP, My SD/carry ammo. Attached Thumbnails
    attachment.jpg


    My additional question is a debatable one. Who does the best trigger work on the S&W M&P models at a reasonable price? As how I think that is one of the major factors in my "heeling". I'm in a way fighting the trigger. My assesment.


    Try this the next time you go to the range. It's called the 5 in 1 drill. Basically, for every 1 live round, you are going to do 5 perfect dry fires. Perfect being no movement in the sights when you break the shot. To set it up, load 1 round from the mag, remove the mag and stow it. Fire your live round and take note of where it hit. The gun will have cycled and will now be empty. Proceed with your first dry fire. Do EVERYTHING the same, just as if it were live fire. Same stance, grip tension, etc. Really take your time, get comfortable, and try to focus on getting those 5 perfect dry fires, with no sight movement when you pull the trigger. Once you have 5 (they don't have to be consecutive), load another round from the mag, drop the mag and stow it. Fire your next live round. Wash, rinse, repeat. Usually when I notice myself slipping on the range, I'll stop what I'm doing and do the 5 in 1. This forces you to get back to the basics. Focus on all of your fundamentals here. I like to tell people to think about it from their toes to their finger tips. Is your lower body stance and foot placement where you want it? Good, move on to the upper body. Keep moving from their until you have grip, sights, sight alignment, sight picture, breath control, and finally followthrough.

    I'll usually do this anywhere from 5-10rds. Doing this with a 50rd box is no small feat, and something that will wear you out! ;) Think about it. For every live round you are achieving 6 trigger presses. 50x6 = 300 trigger pulls. Great way to maximize use of ammo, slow your ammo consumption down, and get some good fundamentals training. Usually 5-10rds is enough of that, however, and you should start noticing a difference. I see this with most shooters. Usually after the first few live rounds, they immediately notice their groups starting to tighten. Although I don't know that this is 100% correct, I attribute it to the shooter being able to see and experience things from different perspectives. They see it while they're live firing. They see it while dry firing, so they see what the gun is actually doing, without blinking. As they get more dry fire reps in, they also experience the feeling of pulling the trigger without upsetting the sights. After awhile, they then experience the same feeling in live fire, and once you experience that, you can build on that. At that point, you have "done it right", so now all you have to do is replicate that feeling.
     
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