12 GA Pump Action for Home Defense

[Southpaw]

Back off, BC was being kind and polite to you. Also you are very new to TGT since you just joined in Mar 15, so says your profile.

And, with that out of the way, birdshot is for little birds, which is why is is called birdshot. Duh!

There is a good possibility he has two logins here and just started using this new one recently.

 

[Hoji]

There is a good possibility he has two logins here and just started using this new one recently.

I was thinking troll account, but as shitty as he got so quick, I am now thinking maybe a banned troll returning.

 

[Enochwel]

"The turkey hunter is probably using a 12ga"
Not to get off the current trail here, but for the sake of this thread, this does actually bring a personal experience to mind. I shot a turkey flying directly above me with a bird shot. I know I hit him because he was very near above, slow enough, and he faltered for a moment after taking it on the under side. That, and I wouldn't have missed. However, he flew away never to be seen by me again. He couldn't have been more than 15 feet away, and probably less.

 

[Savage20]

At 15ft a solid hit would've dropped that turkey with a 12ga. Sorry but you probably missed.

Everyone is so quick to blame the gun or the ammo when in reality it's the shooter that was lacking. No offense, just stating an opinion. I'm not a bad wingshooter but I'm not so naive to think that even I can mess up what should be an easy shot.

I've shot enough "things" with a 12ga to know what it can and can't do.

Let us know what gun/ammo you decide to go with.

 

[Jakashh]

I was thinking troll account, but as shitty as he got so quick, I am now thinking maybe a banned troll returning.

He's not a troll... Just very opinionated.

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

And wrong. You forgot "very wrong"

 

[Savage20]

You mean about the part where I said "I load mine with 00buck"?

 

[Enochwel]

"Sorry but you probably missed."
No, I cant live with that... I hunted that turkey for a long time before that shot.

 

[Younggun]

I never said birdshot will only cause a superficial flesh wound, I said I wouldn't stop a motivated or drugged up attacker, which it won't.

It will not have the penetration needed to hit vital organs and whoever uses it will be relying solely on pain to take away the attackers urge to do harm.

Ballistics gel test results in finding which are (supposedly) being done to FBI standards are showing maximum penetration of ~5.5". That means as little as 1 pellet managed to get that far. Ballistics gel does not account for the bones that protect vital organs.

No, birdshot is not a good choice for self defense, and will not stop a hog at close range unless the sound of racking the shotgun scares it to death.

 

[BIGPAPIGREG]

No, birdshot is not a good choice for self defense, and will not stop a hog at close range unless the sound of racking the shotgun scares it to death.

I scared a wabbit once.....................didn't have a shot gun though...

 

[Savage20]

and will not stop a hog at close range unless the sound of racking the shotgun scares it to death.

I misread your initial post. I agree that birdshot is a bit light, and that's why I load my own HD shotgun with 00buck. But I understand why some folks choose birdshot if the likelihood and consequence for overpenetration is greater.

I still maintain that 12ga birdshot is not nearly the pussycat that many people (not pointing fingers) make it out to be.


Jeez, you can't even say pu$$ycat on this forum?

 

[Ready.Fire.Aim]

Federal flite control #1 buckshot in a pump 12ga with 18" barrel.
Simple and efficient.

The Box O' Truth #56 - Federal Flight Control #1 Buckshot The Box O' Truth
.
I had the exact same results when tested in my 870 pump with 18" barrel and my Benelli M4.

--------

Or go short (NFA)

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

Maybe Massad Ayoob can convince you.
Use the right ammunition! by Massad Ayoob

Mas has never shot anyone w birdshot up close so his opinion must be discounted.

\sarcasm

 

[Jakashh]

And wrong. You forgot "very wrong"

Yeah that too. Dick Cheney used birdshot...

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

My idiot friends used to shoot each other across a big stock tank in high school to stay entertained when the doves werent flying . It was more like 70 yds though.

No one died. Luckily no one lost an eye either. Idjits.

 

[Savage20]

Yeah that too. Dick Cheney used birdshot...

It was also 40yds and the guy ended up in the hospital.

 

[Enochwel]

"the guy ended up in the hospital"

I remember this guy. He was almost 100 years old... Pointing at him and yelling bang could have just as effectively sent him to the hospital. Anyways, I'm corrected. For some reason I remembered the story that he had walked up behind Cheney and blamed himself, so I took that to mean he was right there with him. I agree that from 5 to 10 feet a shotgun blast from a 12ga bird shot could kill a person, but one of the major points of a defensive round is to stop a person surely and efficiently, and with my experience with a bird shot it just doesn't fit the bill.

I think one solution to this is to have the gun in a place where if she needs to use it, she would be pointing it away from potential neighbors by default. Somebody else mentioned a shortened cartridge specifically made for close range defense. That sounds more along the line of HD to me. I'm going to have to look into that.

 

[ROGER4314]

I use 00 Buck or slugs in my HD shotguns and have supreme confidence in what those shells can do!

I do not use bird shot for HD but you guys have it all wrong. Across a room, the wounds from bird shot are extreme.

My next door neighbor's brother "T", shared a house in a bad neighborhood. One night some BG's broke in to rob them. "T" hid in a closet but one of the guys opened the door and pointed a shotgun at him. "T" held up his hand in a defensive gesture when the gun fired. It blew his hand off and part of his face! I am happy to report that his face has been rebuilt, he has a prosthetic hand and he is now married with one child! I see him often and he has made a remarkable recovery.

I saw a picture of a shotgun suicide. All that remained were two ears, a bit of hair on each side and everything in between was gone! I wish that I hadn't seen the damned picture. It's hard to "unsee" something like that.

Guys, shotgun shells create massive wounds at close range.

Flash

 

[zincwarrior]

Whoa, this post reminds me this is a gun forum.

I know its almost offensive isn't it.

**Agree on the short barrel.
**Agree on the no pumping for effect thing. BUT NOTE if you have a child don't rely on "I taught them not to touch it." Kids are curious and other kids are about as well. Also kids can climb like monkeys. Take these factors into consideration on your strategies. Locks, unloaded etc. I've even seen a quick release safe type thing for shotguns.
Here's one but I have seen a variety of them:
The ShotLock Solo-Vault for Shotguns
**The argument for birdshot (better people will make it than myself) is that at room distance, the pattern and effectiveness will be very tight. It may not kill them, but it will stop the threat.

**Personally we rely on pistols and quick opening gun safes, but we also have short barreled Mossberg 500 with 3in 00 buckshot, and a Remington Wingmaster that I could use as a pike its so long for riot situations.

 

[Charlie]

Three inch buck and/or slugs in a 12 ga. ..... in a ".. small apartment.."?? Seems a bit "overkill" (sarcasm). A 20 ga. pump with #2 or #3 shot would easily be capable of stopping a threat under those circumstances.