.308 Match Loads

[Texas1911]

Well, I picked up a new toy and I am looking for some good match loads. Gun is a National Match M1A which has a .308 Win chamber and a 1:11 twist stainless medium barrel.

I'm thinking something centered around a 168 grain Sierra Match King or A-Max would suit it well. Berger VLDs would be cool, but I need something that will still fit in the M1A magazine.

Let me know what you guys use, and what you use it in. A friend just picked up a 700 R5 so if you have a load handy for that, I'm all ears as well.

 

[308nato]

AIM has some German 7.62 nato rds that look pretty good.

 

[SteveW]

42 grains of RL15 under a 168 grain SMK in Hornady match brass. Winchester large primer. Sized to fit the mag. Works very well in my friends Supermatch M1A. I have heard some 'internet discussion' about how Winchester primers are too sensitive for M1As and can cause slam fires. I don't know if that is true, but its never happned to me and I have shot a lot of reloads through a H&K G3. Not a M1A, but there you are..

 

[phatcyclist]

I use a 168 grain Nosler HPBT bullet with 44.5 grains of Varget in Winchester brass with CCI #34 primers w/ very light crimp in my bolt-action. I used a fairly close setup (only differing in OAL) in my old H&R heavy barreled survivor and got 2/3" groups with it. The Nosler bullet is as close as I could find to a Sierra Match King when I couldn't get them.

 

[Texas1911]

42 grains of RL15 under a 168 grain SMK in Hornady match brass. Winchester large primer. Sized to fit the mag. Works very well in my friends Supermatch M1A. I have heard some 'internet discussion' about how Winchester primers are too sensitive for M1As and can cause slam fires. I don't know if that is true, but its never happned to me and I have shot a lot of reloads through a H&K G3. Not a M1A, but there you are..

The G3 has an aggressive loading mechanism too.

I'll check it out.

One of the regulars at the range got some damn nice groups using Benchrest.

 

[Texas1911]

42 grains of RL15 under a 168 grain SMK in Hornady match brass. Winchester large primer. Sized to fit the mag. Works very well in my friends Supermatch M1A. I have heard some 'internet discussion' about how Winchester primers are too sensitive for M1As and can cause slam fires. I don't know if that is true, but its never happned to me and I have shot a lot of reloads through a H&K G3. Not a M1A, but there you are..

The G3 has an aggressive loading mechanism too.

I'll check it out.

One of the regulars at the range got some damn nice groups using Benchrest.

 

[Bullseye Shooter]

For the M1A and my .308 M1 Garand, I load 41.0 grains of IMR 4895 with the Sierra 168 HPBT and LC match brass. If you're using commercial brass, you could go to 43.0 grains. I use either CCI's military primer or Winchester Large Rifle primers.

As long as you seat the primer below the case rim you won't have a problem with slam fires. Slam fires happen because of a high primer, not because of a particular brand.

 

[Texas1911]

How much of a difference does the brass make? How would you rate the importance of brass weight?

Most of the stuff we get is cheap commercial, but I'll keep my match brass.

 

[djspump2003]

I have the Savage F/TR with a 30" barrel, but a 1:12 twist. I tried working up several different loads with everything from 168g HPBTs to 210 Berger Match (they were supposed to send me 190s). I ended up settling on Brad Suave's match 1000 yard load:
43g VARGET pushing 175g SMK HPBT, Lapua brass, Russian primer.
He uses the Russian primers, so I bought a few thousand to try out. In comparison with Rem 9 1/2, BR-2, and Fed 210M, I would have to say that the Russian primers match up most closely with the Rem 9 1/2s. With the same comparison, the Federals have given me the best results. I went out to Eagle Peak and at 300 yards, got several .75" groups with the above mentioned load. That's about as good as I can shoot. The Lapua brass edges out the rest, but I haven't tried the Noslers sitting in my cabinet because the Lapuas last for at least 30 reloads. I hate Norma brass b/c it is twice as expensive, thin walled so that it expands the neck twice as much when I shoot it. I have to change out the bushing in my Forster die just for the stupid Norma brass. ...my 4 or 5

 

[Texas1911]

The M1A is 1:11 so I could get away with a heavier bullet, but it might have problems fitting in the magazine. I know moving up to the heavy grain bullets in .223 Remington causes that issue in AR15s.

I'll have to try out the 175 grain SMKs. I've read that some of the guns like it, others do better with the 168 grain. That being said, I have noticed that the 175 grain exhibited less spin drift at long range.

 

[UnixMarine]

I use 175 Grain Sierra BTHP's in mine and it fits fine and works great in either my M1A SOCOM II or my R700

 

[baboon]

As good as Federal .308 match ammo is, if you can find IMI .308 match ammo buy it or let me know were it's at.

 

[djspump2003]

The M1A is 1:11 so I could get away with a heavier bullet, but it might have problems fitting in the magazine. I know moving up to the heavy grain bullets in .223 Remington causes that issue in AR15s.

I'll have to try out the 175 grain SMKs. I've read that some of the guns like it, others do better with the 168 grain. That being said, I have noticed that the 175 grain exhibited less spin drift at long range.

Alan - if you bring your M1A on Friday to Red's, I'll bring my Stoney Point chamber measuring device with one of my 175 SMKs and we'll see if you would have to seat the bullet outside of the magazine dimensions such that the bullet was .018" off the rifling. It was a problem with my M4 carbine. When I measured it, the rifling was so far away from the bullet that you couldn't even seat the bullet in the brass without it falling out, not to mention fitting in the mag. Because of that, I just seat mine to the 2.26" for the magazine and leave it at that. We'll have to see about the M1A. I suspect it is better b/c so many people used to compete with them.

 

[Texas1911]

Alan - if you bring your M1A on Friday to Red's, I'll bring my Stoney Point chamber measuring device with one of my 175 SMKs and we'll see if you would have to seat the bullet outside of the magazine dimensions such that the bullet was .018" off the rifling. It was a problem with my M4 carbine. When I measured it, the rifling was so far away from the bullet that you couldn't even seat the bullet in the brass without it falling out, not to mention fitting in the mag. Because of that, I just seat mine to the 2.26" for the magazine and leave it at that. We'll have to see about the M1A. I suspect it is better b/c so many people used to compete with them.

Looking at the magazine, there is so much room. Much more than you have with say, a 55 grain loaded in an AR magazine.

I'll bring it up there on Friday.

You should see the crap Keith and I shot today. He put some .30-30 style round nose softpoints with the bullet seated way forward. I would call it a ragged hole, but it's not even that... it's a .30 caliber hole that 3 rounds went through at 100 yards. We were very surprised. This is with his 700.

I shot some of the higher loaded rounds and did a 1" group. Most of the lower loaded stuff was touching. 1" is damn good for me since I have to stand and shoot, I get alot of movement even with good rests.

 

[djspump2003]

Looking at the magazine, there is so much room. Much more than you have with say, a 55 grain loaded in an AR magazine.

I'll bring it up there on Friday.

You should see the crap Keith and I shot today. He put some .30-30 style round nose softpoints with the bullet seated way forward. I would call it a ragged hole, but it's not even that... it's a .30 caliber hole that 3 rounds went through at 100 yards. We were very surprised. This is with his 700.

I shot some of the higher loaded rounds and did a 1" group. Most of the lower loaded stuff was touching. 1" is damn good for me since I have to stand and shoot, I get alot of movement even with good rests.

I already love that 5R Keith bought. I shot several groups with the match ammo I loaded up for my Savage. I would get 2 in one hole and of course pull one a half inch out. I am so used to my Savage accutrigger that it takes a little getting used to that Remington trigger. I have to stand up as well, with the height of those stupid stools you guys have there at Red's I don't feel as comfortable. I do have one of those Caldwell 15lb bench rests that I use from time to time. Maybe I'll go to the trouble of lugging that thing into the range Friday as well. My groups are always better when I use the rest rather than the Harris bipod. Keith's rifle is a 1:11.25 twist, so it is supposedly made to shoot the 175's and not the 168's.

 

[SteveW]

Alan, if you get Handloader magazine, this months copy has a big write up on making accurate 308 for a tactical bolt gun. Lots of loads, lots of bullets.

If you don't get it, the summary is 45gr Varget, 168gr Berger Match Bullet, Nosler Match brass, CCI 220 LR primer and very careful assembly with a match bullet seating die. Bullet seated about 5 thou off the lands. Four groups of five rounds each came out at an adverage of 0.3xx inches. I can't remember the group size off the top of my head, but it's in the threes..

WRT the 175 grain SMK, you won't see a difference untill past 300 yards.

Do you shoot anywhere else except Reds or Lone Star ? You would be surprised at what a difference going to 200 yards will make from 100 on an outdoor range.. Austin Rifle Club has 100, 200 and 350 yard ranges. The 350 yard range is usually only available early Wednesday mornings, but coffee and a toaster from Sonic on the way makes it more user friendly !

 

[djspump2003]

Alan, if you get Handloader magazine, this months copy has a big write up on making accurate 308 for a tactical bolt gun. Lots of loads, lots of bullets.

If you don't get it, the summary is 45gr Varget, 168gr Berger Match Bullet, Nosler Match brass, CCI 220 LR primer and very careful assembly with a match bullet seating die. Bullet seated about 5 thou off the lands. Four groups of five rounds each came out at an adverage of 0.3xx inches. I can't remember the group size off the top of my head, but it's in the threes..

WRT the 175 grain SMK, you won't see a difference untill past 300 yards.

Do you shoot anywhere else except Reds or Lone Star ? You would be surprised at what a difference going to 200 yards will make from 100 on an outdoor range.. Austin Rifle Club has 100, 200 and 350 yard ranges. The 350 yard range is usually only available early Wednesday mornings, but coffee and a toaster from Sonic on the way makes it more user friendly !

I know you were talking to Alan, but I can't help but chime in. I now want to check out the Handloader magazine. I hadn't loaded a 168 BTHP with 45g of VARGET since 43g was working so well. That got me a .75" at 300 and several 1" groups at 300. But that was with 175 SMK BTHP moly coated bullets, not 168s.

I know Berger recommends seating their bullets into the lands b/c they are longer than most. Those Bergers have some great BCs. I have some 190s that I have been meaning to work a load up for.

Eagle Peak has me spoiled since they have an ATV to drive out to the 300 yard range and you can shoot there on days other than Wednesday. Their range masters are not friendly, though.

 

[SteveW]

Yeah. I don't "do" Eagle Peak anymore since almost being strip searched for FMJ bullets that I might be using in a FAL. I was using soft point hand loads for it, but the old walrus in the office almost had a fit when he saw the FAL.

 

[AusTex]

there is a Palma match load that i have modified a little for my rifle. You are running 1:11 and i think you might be able to squeak this by.

155 lapua's hpbt's

IMR 4895 with 44.8 grains .. since you are running 1:11 i would work it up though starting prolly 43 ..

CCI - BR2 primers

Lapua brass ..

Since im not shooting in the wimbeldon cup or anything i use this

155 SMK's HPBT
44.4 grns IMR 4895
Fed Match primers
Win brass

I get good results and it shoots a litter flatter than the 168's .. however again i have a 1:12 twist..

Dont rule the lighter bullets out though. Run up some test rounds shoot some groups start with that.. then I would try at range.. Its strange but when i was trying to find loads my rifle liked ( FN SPR .308 20" BBL )
- I found it through shooting at range in winds... I dont know why but i could not get the consitance out of the 168's .. at anything past 500 yards.

Jeremy

Ohh .. besides match rounds I can tell you my gun loves the Nosler ballistic tips 125's

Imr 4064
win primers
win brass ..

any varmint out to about 300 yards better be scared I can put these things between the eyes .. and they are explosive.. Hoji thinks they are a little light.. but he was referencing hogs .. not smaller game

Also id like to know what kind of toy you are talking about

 

[Texas1911]

FALs and other battle rifles of that era love the 145 - 155 grain stuff. I'm not so sure about my M1A liking it though. I bought some cheap-o 150 grain BTSP that I'm going to run through it to season the barrel.

The 125s would probably foul up the barrel and not group in a 1:11, it's a bit fast for such a light round. Perhaps if I underloaded it, but that is dangerous territory I don't care to venture down.