AG Opinion KP-0050: OC and school "premises" including sidewalks

[Mreed911]

This one's a bit scary, folks - read it carefully. Sidewalks ARE premises for Open Carry purposes (but apparently maybe not CC?).

[h=3]KP-0050[/h][h=4]Opinion: (KP-0050) Application of Penal Code sections 30.07 and 46.03, relating to the open carry of handguns, to school districts[/h]Request for Opinion: ( RQ-0054-KP) Summary: Subsection 46.03(a)(l) of the Penal Code prohibits handguns from places on which a school-sponsored activity is occurring, which places can include grounds otherwise excluded from the definition of "premises" such as public or private driveways, streets, sidewalks or walkways, parking lots, parking garages, or other parking areas.

 

[Shotgun Jeremy]

I thought this was already pretty well put in the new law.

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[BRD@66]

You'd need to know that there wasn't an "event" in progress before you drove by the school???

 

[Mreed911]

You'd need to know that there wasn't an "event" in progress before you drove by the school???

No problem driving by. Stepping out is problematic.

 

[Mreed911]

I thought this was already pretty well put in the new law.

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There was another opinion that for CHL purposes, sidewalks and driveways didn't count. This basically says they do, but only if they're part of the school's property and something school-y is going on, I believe.

 

[locke_n_load]

I missed this thread and think the AG opinion is pretty dang vague here.
Is the AG saying that during school, the sidewalks/parking lots are off-limits to carry, but outside of school hours, it is ok?

Here is the law:

(a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly possesses or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or prohibited weapon listed in Section 46.05(a):
(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution, any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written regulations or written authorization of the institution;

I think the AG's opinion is trying to state that when school is in session, all school grounds are off-limits, and if something school sponsored is happening somewhere else, then that localized area is off-limits as well. Makes an argument for zoos and the likes in regards to field trips, if that is indeed what he is saying.

However, commas are important in the law, and I will break it down into what I think:

on the physical premises of a school or educational institution
clear enough - school premises (buildings) are off limits at all times.

any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or educational institution is being conducted
any grounds - if the school sponsored activity, i.e. school has rented out an area/venue or owns a parking school and they are doing some activity there, then that outside area is off-limits. If a school has rented out a building or is in session, then those buildings are off-limits. However, if the students are not outside, then the outdoor areas of a school are not off-limits. Also, dropping off/picking up your kids before/after school is ok for carry (if you step out) because student drop-off is not school sponsored.
Of courses buses and school transportation are off limits too.

I don't see how the AG could rule that sidewalks are off-limits when school is in session and the kids are inside, but rule that if a band is practicing outside in parking lot A then parking lot B is ok to carry at. It's either grounds vs premises or grounds includes all property and buildings.

I thought I had it figured out here?

 

[Mreed911]

I'd argue that sidewalks are not owned by or property of the school, but I might be wrong. It would depend on the survey, deed, plat, etc. I know on MY house, I own it to the curb, but there's a setback in the front where I can't build where a sidewalk could go.

The real question is probably "could you be criminal trespassed, traditional 30.05-style, off a sidewalk in front of someone's house and forced to walk in the street instead?"

 

[locke_n_load]

I'd argue that sidewalks are not owned by or property of the school, but I might be wrong. It would depend on the survey, deed, plat, etc. I know on MY house, I own it to the curb, but there's a setback in the front where I can't build where a sidewalk could go.

The real question is probably "could you be criminal trespassed, traditional 30.05-style, off a sidewalk in front of someone's house and forced to walk in the street instead?"

For your question, probably not.
But what about student dropoffs, which are a ways away from the actual street? School parking lot? Let's say I walk my kiddo to school, carrying, and walk them up to the front door?

Really gonna push for LTC holders to be exempted from this part (and many others) mentioned in 46.03 next year.