Military Camp

Change in healthcare?

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  • Texas42

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    Hey Yall,

    I thought i would ask your opionons on the upcomming debate (or more likely lack thereof) of healthcare. It seems pretty obvious to me that Obama and company want to try and shove a bill through congress that will give the US a socialized healthcare system of sorts, or cause the US to be on the road to a imminent socialized healthcare system.

    I just would like yall's take on the whole thing. These next few years will have a very big impact on my future (I'm in med school, btw).

    I'm rooting against the whole thing, but I'd like your opinions.
    Military Camp
     

    oldguy

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    As a senior on low fixed income paying more then I can afford with Medicare and supplemental insurance I'm totally against the national health care system, what we will have is rationed health care which will apply to all especially seniors, from information I'm reading government will decide who gets what, if your considered too old to "save" then you will not receive necessary care or it will be very limited.

    My doctor has already indicated to me he will retire early if this is passed we will lose many doctors and those young people like yourself will look to other careers. While health care cost are too high and that I agree however there are other ways to contain cost. We continue to allow millions of people with little education and very few prospects to enter this country adding to already burdened system and we spending money to build roads, schools in Irag, Pakistan while as a country we are failing, strange thinking in my opinion.

    All in all I consider this administration,anti-capitalism therefore anti-American. Sorry for the ranting but three months of this administration for this old person has been a nightmare with more to come.
     

    DCortez

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    Aside from the military, I can't think of one thing the government does that is worth a squat. Does anyone seriously trust a bureaucrat over a doctor.

    My wife's side of the family has healthcare professionals in Canada. They do not like the system and come to America for their own services.

    Google will give you more ammo.
     

    Jemplayer

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    As great as free health care would be, how can any rational U.S. Citizen really be for it? Look at how well social security or welfare is run. Health care by our goverment would be 10x worse.

    In European countries with free health care the routine stuff seems to work out OK, but with SHTF type stuff like cancer it routine to hear about how somebody was denied this or that because some bean counter weighed the cost vs the age and probability of survival and denied them. And in Britain if this happens to you and you go "Well I'll pay for it out of my own pocket" your kicked off the national health care plan for everthing.
     

    CharlieBear

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    In the Business

    Guys/Gals,

    This is a subject that is very close to my heart.

    Worst Case, Medicare for everyone! Think about it, Medicare is basically Socialized type program. Its just for seniors (at this stage of the game). To finance it, the government will let BCBS be the 800 pound gorilla (its technically a non for profit)(go figure), and The Govt, will have no choice but raise our taxes via our paychecks.

    Or raise the State Medicaid income limits to god knows what.... As always, the taxpayers will be pinged for that as well via state taxes and subsidized via the feds.

    Or...Leave it alone, let the market forces take over...Business' and individuals are dropping health coverage benefits and/or raising the deductable limits. Prices will drop to try to bring in more beneficiarys...

    Can the free market fix itself before this happens?

    Anyone know what an HSA is??? (I have one)

    Charlie Bear
     

    GM.Chief

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    Only remotely for it, meaning the only ones that I think should get help are people who WILL DIE without treatment(i/e Leukemia, etc.). Even then, to be honest, I'm still on the fence and leaning towards anti.
     

    M. Sage

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    I know folks who left England - their lives, friends and families - to escape the socialist hell of their health care system.

    Google will give you more ammo.

    Head on over to Google and search for "NHS doctor shortage", NHS being the UK health system. Also search up "Canada doctor shortage". They don't have enough caregivers...

    As great as free health care would be, how can any rational U.S. Citizen really be for it? Look at how well social security or welfare is run. Health care by our goverment would be 10x worse.

    In European countries with free health care the routine stuff seems to work out OK, but with SHTF type stuff like cancer it routine to hear about how somebody was denied this or that because some bean counter weighed the cost vs the age and probability of survival and denied them. And in Britain if this happens to you and you go "Well I'll pay for it out of my own pocket" your kicked off the national health care plan for everthing.

    I just want to point out that this health care is not "free." We'd still have to pay for it. Nothing is free (except air, maybe). Nothing can be free when it requires the labor of someone else, barring slavery.

    Everybody who wants "free" health care wants to make a slave out of someone else to provide that health care for them.

    Using the term "free health care" is the same as using the term "health care provided by slaves".

    I don't see how any rational person could be for it - it's just theft, plain and simple.
     

    navyguy

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    There is no question we have some health care issues in this country, but nationalized health care is one of the worst ideas yet.

    Case after case has shown the Federal Government can not efficiently operate anything. Administration costs will sky rocket, (guess who pays) there will be long waits to see doctors, drug companies will lose their incentive to develop better products, services will be denied to elderly based on a computer driven decision tree punched in by some snotty nosed 20 year old, there will be less incentive for up and coming students to enter med school ... and on and no. We need only look to countries that have such health care.
     

    Starker

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    I just want to point out that this health care is not "free." We'd still have to pay for it. Nothing is free (except air, maybe). Nothing can be free when it requires the labor of someone else, barring slavery.

    Everybody who wants "free" health care wants to make a slave out of someone else to provide that health care for them.

    Using the term "free health care" is the same as using the term "health care provided by slaves".

    I don't see how any rational person could be for it - it's just theft, plain and simple.

    You're exactly right. Even slaves aren't free. (no pun intended) They're cheap, but not free. (again, no pun intended...although, that is a funny line...read it several times...it gets funnier each time)
     

    Bob Loblaw

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    Could someone please point out the text in the constitution that allows provisions for federally funded healthcare? The problem I see lies with the insurance companies, and I'm not sure who's fault that is, or how to fix it, but no plan implemented by the heroes in DC has been successful so far, why do more of the same? If the state legislature wanted to tackle the issue, fine, but they are pretty busy protecting us from trans-fats and tanning beds.
     

    M. Sage

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    I'm not saying im against it or for it, but, alot of people here are so negative and say this is the worst idea!!
    So what would you recommend?

    Free market health care. One of the major issues with our system is how easy it is to file a lawsuit against a doctor. Some reform there might be nice.

    One of the reasons drugs are so expensive here is that most of the industrialized world has already gone socialized, and many of these nations put a cap on drug costs, only allowing a minor amount of profit above what materials and labor cost. Problem is, most of the cost of producing drugs isn't in labor or materials, it's in research and development. So the US basically winds up paying for the world's R&D.

    Just look at Africa: the "international community" won't recognize patents on AIDS drugs there. How are you supposed to make your R&D back without a patent!?
     

    navyguy

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    Free market health care. One of the major issues with our system is how easy it is to file a lawsuit against a doctor. Some reform there might be nice.

    One of the reasons drugs are so expensive here is that most of the industrialized world has already gone socialized, and many of these nations put a cap on drug costs, only allowing a minor amount of profit above what materials and labor cost. Problem is, most of the cost of producing drugs isn't in labor or materials, it's in research and development. So the US basically winds up paying for the world's R&D.

    Just look at Africa: the "international community" won't recognize patents on AIDS drugs there. How are you supposed to make your R&D back without a patent!?

    That is correct, but the other thing that drives drug costs is liability. When a new wonder drug comes out, say like Celebrex, until it has been used by the general public for many years, there is a great potential for law suites should someone die or have adverse effects. And then I forget how many years the original patten is good for, but once that runs out, generics can be made which really drive down costs.

    If someone just today discovered Aspirin, it would be 10 or so years before the FDA would approve it for sale, and due to the side effects, it might require a prescription.
     

    MadMo44Mag

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    Free market health care. One of the major issues with our system is how easy it is to file a lawsuit against a doctor. Some reform there might be nice.

    One of the reasons drugs are so expensive here is that most of the industrialized world has already gone socialized, and many of these nations put a cap on drug costs, only allowing a minor amount of profit above what materials and labor cost. Problem is, most of the cost of producing drugs isn't in labor or materials, it's in research and development. So the US basically winds up paying for the world's R&D.

    Just look at Africa: the "international community" won't recognize patents on AIDS drugs there. How are you supposed to make your R&D back without a patent!?

    Highlighted RED

    I was about to make that same statement

    R&D cost billion but when the world has a cap far below what US citizens pay it leaves us here in the US to pay the lions share of the R&D

    My attitude is very simple. Set fair prices for all nations and if you or you're country does not agree, make you're own dam drugs!!!!:mad:

    Now on for health care.
    The same cause for drug prices exists in the hospital field.
    R&D is a good chunk of the bottom line cost in hospitals.
    The only solution is to have a level playing field internationally.
    Also hospitals need to make better use of the resources on hand and not buy every multi - billion dollar gizmo that comes along until there is proof the new technoligy is cost effective, reliable and needed.
    Back when my mom needed so many drugs I went to Mexico and it cost me 1/3 there than it did here.
    NO SOCIALIST HEATH CARE
    EVERYONE PAY THE SAME
    IF YOU WON'T PAY - DIE - BUT DO IT QUIETLY BECAUSE I AM TIERED OF YOUR WHINING!;)
     

    Major Woody

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    I use herbs, Chronobiotic nutrition, the real deal, not some artificial molecules. You cannot get a natural healing with artificial junk. Ok everyone line up for your coolaid [shots] said Jim Jones.
    Doctors:
    The number of doctors: 700,000+
    Accidental death by doctors 120,000 a year = .171 ratio
    Guns
    Number of gun owners 80,000,000+
    Accidental deaths by gun owners 1500 = .000188 ratio
    Conclusion
    Doctors are approximately 9000 more times as dangerous as gun owners
    Guns don't kill people on a large scale, Doctors do. I'll pass on the health care, I'll hire Herb.
     
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