Military Camp

DOD hoists finger to SCOTUS RE: R v W

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  • Sasquatch

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    Tim Pool brings up an interesting question - DOD says they'll continue to provide abortion services even in states with total abortion bans. If those states make abortions a felony - will they push and charge abortion providers with murder or whatever the appropriate charges are under state law? Will the state courts say "pound sand" when the feds try to supercede jurisdiction?

    After Ruby Ridge, the state of Idaho brought charges against the piece of shit known as Lon Horiuchi for the murder of Vicky Weaver, the feds intervened and stole the case from Idaho, then tossed the charges. Idaho probably should've said "nope, not gonna fly, we're going to try him in state court for violation of state law"

    I do think Tim is right in his assessment that this is yet another step toward the inevitable second American revolution or hot civil war - whatever you want to call it. The lines are becoming clearer every day showing us where the 3-5 new nations would be formed if the union is dissolved.

    I fall on the side of "prosecute them in state court regardless of what the feds say or attempt to do" - even if you have to try them without them present if the feds secret the defendants away. If they're convicted, they're now a convicted felon with a warrant issued for their arrest. SCOTUS will *have* to take up that issue too - I don't think they'd have a choice - and it could lead to some large shifts in states' rights - providing that happens before the civil war that I'm of the mind that we're in goes hot hot.

    Federal supremacy is a double edged sword - the Federal government should be far, far more limited in power / authority IMO, as the founders intended. States should be left to craft their own laws within the bounds of the Constitution. There is *zero* mention of abortion or the right to kill your child in the constitution, though you do have a right to life. I wonder if it can be argued that state laws *allowing* for abortion are violations of the 4th amendment rights (security of the fetus' "person") maybe even the eight amendment, though it might be a stretch. Could be argued that the state sanctioned abortion of the unborn equates to cruel and unusual punishment - a death sentance passed without due process.

    Biden's regime has made it crystal clear, they don't give a shit about SCOTUS rulings that don't favor them. They will forge ahead. Some states have likewise stated they don't care and will continue business as usual. Without an enforcement mechanism beyond the gentlemanly agreement of the various political bodies that make up our nation, the court has no teeth. I suppose the well armed citizenry could be looked at as their enforcement mechanism, but thats another stretch.
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    toddnjoyce

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    This has already been posted in the other RvW thread. FWIW, DoD installations are federal property, so state jurisdiction ends at the fence.
     

    Sasquatch

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    This has already been posted in the other RvW thread. FWIW, DoD installations are federal property, so state jurisdiction ends at the fence.

    BLM lands are federal property too, so a murder or other crime committed on said BLM lands would be out of the purview of state / local officials by the same vein.
     

    seeker_two

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    That place east of Waco....
    This has already been posted in the other RvW thread. FWIW, DoD installations are federal property, so state jurisdiction ends at the fence.
    True. But, if a state puts out a warrant for arrest, it still carries legal weight if the wanted individual ever leaves base. Will the military make the effort to bail them out?

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    toddnjoyce

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    True. But, if a state puts out a warrant for arrest, it still carries legal weight if the wanted individual ever leaves base. Will the military make the effort to bail them out?

    Sent from my SM-G715A using Tapatalk

    The state is going to have a real hard time gathering evidence in a place they don’t have access to.

    DoD doesn’t bail anyone out, that’s up to the individual member. There are some agreements in place where a member will be released to the command on personal recognizance for minor offenses.
     

    toddnjoyce

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    So military surgeons are performing abortions on base?

    There were 91 abortions performed on military installations between 2016 and 2021.
    “Abortions are generally not performed at military medical facilities in the continental United States. In addition, few have been performed at these facilities abroad for a number of reasons. First, the U.S. military follows the prevailing laws and rules of foreign countries regarding abortion. Second, the military has had a difficult time finding health care professionals in uniform willing to perform the procedure.

    With the enactment of P.L. 104-61 and P.L. 104-106, these questions became moot, because then, neither DOD funds nor facilities could be used to administer any policy that provides for abortions at any DOD facility, except where the life of the mother may be endangered if the fetus were carried to term. Privately funded abortions at military facilities are permitted when the pregnancy was the result of an act of rape or incest.”

    The CRS report below provides additional insight.

     

    motorcarman

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    seeker_two

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    That place east of Waco....
    The state is going to have a real hard time gathering evidence in a place they don’t have access to.

    DoD doesn’t bail anyone out, that’s up to the individual member. There are some agreements in place where a member will be released to the command on personal recognizance for minor offenses.

    All it takes is someone sneaking out a medical file or two.....
     

    Sasquatch

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    All it takes is someone sneaking out a medical file or two.....

    Or one or more of the witnesses being anti-abortion and making sworn statements to the state authorities. Or a relative / friend of the abortion-seeker diming them out. Get the investigative ball rolling - while having a confession or other physical evidence would be good, people have gone to the chair for murder with less.
     

    Younggun

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    There were 91 abortions performed on military installations between 2016 and 2021.
    “Abortions are generally not performed at military medical facilities in the continental United States. In addition, few have been performed at these facilities abroad for a number of reasons. First, the U.S. military follows the prevailing laws and rules of foreign countries regarding abortion. Second, the military has had a difficult time finding health care professionals in uniform willing to perform the procedure.

    With the enactment of P.L. 104-61 and P.L. 104-106, these questions became moot, because then, neither DOD funds nor facilities could be used to administer any policy that provides for abortions at any DOD facility, except where the life of the mother may be endangered if the fetus were carried to term. Privately funded abortions at military facilities are permitted when the pregnancy was the result of an act of rape or incest.”

    The CRS report below provides additional insight.


    Sounds like the DoD is just getting mouthy and virtue signaling on a topic that they can’t actually follow through on in the way they are implying.


    The only thing about their rules that doesn’t mesh with Texas law is rape/incest. And IIRC, Texas is the only state that doesn’t allow abortion in that type of situations. So for 49 states the rules are with the same or more strict and in Texas the rule is only very slightly less strict and only in a situation where public opinion will be far less antagonistic overall.
     

    oldag

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    It ain't just DOD. Judges in several states have issued stay orders against the states' new abortion laws. Guess they don't think the SCOTUS opinion matters.
     
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