Getting into casting?

[skfullgun]

I'm about to retire and thinking about starting to cast my own bullets. I currently reload for .38/357 and .32 h&r and .327 mag. I've reloaded for .45 Colt and 30/30 and plan to add those back to the list soon.

Until now I have purchased cast bullets for my loading.

I have access to a private range and can probably reclaim most of my lead.

Please advise me of the basics to get started casting. If I fire 2k rounds,b combined calibers per year, is it cost effective? I'm retiring within a year and thinking of adding this to my hobby list. Thanks in advance!

 

[sabot_round]

Brother,
The initial cost will be about the same to start reloading. It could be addictive and expensive too. Since you have access to a private range, that could cut the cost down - lead availability could be an issue with the cost of lead being at almost $1 per lb.

I did start with a Lee 20lb production pot, 6 cavity molds and sizers, which are very economical (I do have some other molds that I did acquire at a very reasonable price through auctions). The advantage of the Lee sizers is that you can use them with your existing single stage press, and that there is no need to buy a lube sizer (please see the fourth paragraph for the reason).

I enjoy the hobby but it is still gonna cost you money because you will have to turn that reclaimed lead into usable lead (i.e. heat source and reclaim pot). DO NOT USE YOUR SMELTIN POT TO RECLAIM LEAD!! It will crud it up with all kinds of stuff, and you will have to clean it every time before casting. You will need a separate system to reclaim your lead - i.e. a Dutch oven or a cast iron pan - depending on the amount of lead that you will be processing, and along with that separate system you will need a heat source (propane is what I use).

I have also transitioned from ordinary bullet lube to powder coating, which is very economical too, and it keeps my barrels lead free. For more info please click HERE.

Please PM me if you have any more questions. I will be happy to answer them all, especially if you can share your lead source.

v/r
Sam

 

[Moonpie]

Casting is fun and interesting but it IS work.
It really doesn't pay unless you reload old obsolete, unusual, or high volume.
High volume has its own challenges. Mainly time.

Bullet moulds - Basically two choices, Aluminum or steel.
Aluminum:
+'s = cheap to buy. Easy to maintain. Heat up quickly.
-'s = Cool off quickly so more difficult to cast quality bullets. Wear out.

Steel:
+'s = Once seasoned easier to cast quality bullets. Last forever with proper care.
-'s = More expensive. Rust. More time to maintain.

Each manufacturer has their own moulds and mould handles. There are a few that can interchange. So when buying a mould you will need to purchase handles as well. Some even have a Small or Large handle. Make sure to get the correct handles for the mould.
Depending on what bullet you're making the choice of a multiple cavity mould may be available. Single cavity moulds are very time consuming but are easier to use. Multiple cavity moulds will take time to master.
Round balls are very easy to cast. Long, large bullets with multiple grooves are more difficult.

Melting pot: Sound advice above. Get two. One for smelting and one for casting. Lee Production pots are an economical choice.
Use one to melt your scrap. Flux and clean then pour into clean ingots.
Use the other to melt the clean ingots for casting into bullets.
The more care you take in producing clean ingots makes for much less frustration when trying to cast. Foreign matter = very poor quality bullets.

Metal: Range scrap will be all manner of alloy. It's usable for simple blasting ammo. Range scrap will require some extra care to smelt into clean metal.
Very precise grade bullets need to be made from known alloy so you can reproduce them.
Lead is getting more difficult to obtain with each passing year. Wheel weights used to be a great source but sadly most wheelweights now are zinc. Be careful when melting these.

You'll need extra tools/equipment as well.
A soft mallet to tap open the sprue cutter. Do NOT use a steel hammer. This will damage the sprue cutter. You can buy mallets for this made from wood or just make one.
Simple stainless steel kitchen spoons work great as skimming tools. You can buy cheap ones at any store like WalMart.
Flux - you can go uber cheap and use plain old sawdust if you have a source or buy ready made.
Misc pans - you'll need some kitchen baking pans to drop hot bullets on. I use a bread pan lined with a cotton towel to drop just cast bullets into. You don't want to drop hot soft bullets onto a hard surface. they'll get dinged up.
Containers for dross/slag - I just use empty washed out metal food cans.
When you skim molten metal the resulting slag is very hot. Be careful where you place it. You can get moisture explosion and/or fire. Dried out metal cans work great for this.
Lead thermometer - this will help you figure out the best temp to cast at.
Alloy lead normally has to be cast at a higher temp than pure lead.
These aren't expensive. Get a couple.
Casting ladle - I've found using a ladle works better when casting very large bullets. The pour spout on the melting pots tends to plug and slow metal flow resulting in an unacceptable bullet.
Safety gear - eye/face protection, apron, gloves
Ingot mould - use for purified metal.

Once you get going on a cast you will find you have to work rapidly.
The trick is to always keep the mould filled with hot metal, keeping the mould hot and at working temp.
Pour - let metal set - tap open and drop - quickly refill mould.
Any additional actions should be done after the mould is filled. This is where a steel mould has an advantage. It gives you a few more seconds to work.
Aluminum moulds cool very rapidly so you must refill quickly.

Always, ALWAYS pre-heat anything that molten metal will contact.
I use one of those instant light propane torches to heat things.

Good heavens! Enough from me.
Have fun and enjoy your new hobby.

 

[TheMailMan]

Ya forgot brass molds and your handle advice is decades out of date. Lyman consolidated their handles a long time ago. Two cavity and four cavity handles. RCBS uses their handles, almost everything else uses Lee six cavity handles.

1. If you're going to cast get a good furnace. You'll thank me later. Midway has the new RBCS on sale right now.

2. Buy good molds. You'll thank me later. RCBS molds are solid. They're iron molds, cast to size and run around $70 per. Stay away from new Lyman molds. Avoid them like the plague. There are many other companies that make molds. Mainly aluminum and brass. There are a couple that make iron molds...starting at around $170 per. Most of the other companies use Lee six cavity handles. Good molds hold their value. Lee molds aren't worth the cost of postage.

3. For smelting I use a crab/crawfish cooker and a cast iron dutch oven.

 

[skfullgun]

Thank you to all of you who responded. You have given me a lot to think about. I think I will begin to look for some used casting molds and take it a little at a time.

 

[Moonpie]

There are a bunch of vids over on the Youtube to help you see what you're getting into.
I forgot to mention something.
Smokeless powder bullets will be alloy(harder metal).
Blackpowder bullets will be soft pure lead.
This is due to the higher pressures of smokeless powder.
BP runs at a much lower pressure. The soft lead adheres to the rifling mch better.
Soft lead fired with smokeless powder will result in poor accuracy and leading in the barrel.

 

[Charley]

"Soft lead fired with smokeless powder will result in poor accuracy and leading in the barrel. "
Have to disagree. 35 years of casting, proper sizing and lube are far more important than hardness. Pure lead is not the greatest idea for smokeless, but will handle up to 900-1100 FPS, again with proper sizing and lube.

 

[grasshopperglock]

3. For smelting I use a crab/crawfish cooker and a cast iron dutch oven.

Heh. I've used a deep cast iron sauce pot. At the time I had a gas grill with a stove burner on the side. The stove burner would smelt the lead. I was doing it to temper springs and pouring some fishing weights. Had some kinda flux from a welding supply to get the slag out.(borax based). Worked like a charm. The crawdad fryer is good idea.

Technically, you can melt lead on the kitchen stove. It's the vapor coming off the lead that makes it a bad idea.

 

[TheMailMan]

To get vapor that will cause a problem you need to get that lead up to 1400° or better. Pretty hard to do that on the kitchen stove.

 

[grasshopperglock]

To get vapor that will cause a problem you need to get that lead up to 1400° or better. Pretty hard to do that on the kitchen stove.

It wasn't 1400. More like around 400°F. I guess it was slag burn off. It wasn't clean lead. Crappy wheel weights. Whatever it was, it fumed for a minute. I still wouldn't stick my nose over a clean lead pot and take a whiff. Not me.

 

[RevolverGuy]

Go to these sites to find way more info than anyone can post here:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com
http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm

 

[RevolverGuy]

"Soft lead fired with smokeless powder will result in poor accuracy and leading in the barrel. "
Have to disagree. 35 years of casting, proper sizing and lube are far more important than hardness. Pure lead is not the greatest idea for smokeless, but will handle up to 900-1100 FPS, again with proper sizing and lube.

Soft boolits causing leading is one of the biggest myths in the gun world.

THE worst leading I’ve ever experienced were commercial “hard cast” .38 wadcutters loaded to low pressure. They were undersized and too damned hard to obdurate and seal the chamber throats. Same experience with commercial .44 SWCs.

 

[TheMailMan]

To follow up on that most commercial cast bullets are way to hard for things like the .45 ACP, .38 SPL and such. Some of them are so hard they're not even ideal for magnum calibers.

It's one of the reasons I started casting my own. I use half pure lead, half clip on wheel weights and 1-2% added tin.

I've decided I'm only going to use Hi-Tek coating. I've got no problems with leading. I size to 0.002 over bore.

 

[Charley]

Commercial swaged lead handgun bullets can easily be pushed to 800 FPS or so in most handguns, with little or no leading. For my cast, just as said above, proper sizing and lubing are the most important factors. And yep, I agree with the "most commercial cast bullets are too hard". Hardness sells, and the business has to have a selling point. One of the reasons I've met a lot of reloaders over the years that swear at, not by, cast bullets, and will not use them after the first or second time trying them. They had a bad experience or two with somebody's hard cast bullets, and think all cast bullets are going to lead the bore.

 

[popper]

$6-7/100 for 40sw, $15-16/100 for 30 cal rifle,Loaded cost. Foundry bought alloy.
Cost of lead per Lb * your CB in grains/7000 = cost per bullet. PC for $5-6/Lb. but any TL will work.
Lee pot and a few mould is where you will spend the $$. A good leisurely tinkering hobby.

 

[sergeant69]

Soft boolits causing leading is one of the biggest myths in the gun world.

THE worst leading I’ve ever experienced were commercial “hard cast” .38 wadcutters loaded to low pressure. They were undersized and too damned hard to obdurate and seal the chamber throats. Same experience with commercial .44 SWCs.

THIS!

 

[flashhole]

I started with the Lee Pro-20 bottom pour pot and never found a reason to change. I have both aluminum and steel molds, both have their quirks, both can be made to work really well. I cast for 45-70 and 40 S&W and will likely cast for a revolver or two once I get relocated to TX.

Lots of good advice and pointers. Casting lends itself well to sharing lessons learned from experienced people. You don't have to pee on the electric fence to figure things out.