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Hard to understand, but I believe it

Discussion in 'News Articles' started by PhulesAu, Jul 11, 2018.

  1. Ole Cowboy

    Ole Cowboy TGT Addict

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    "
    The liens filed on behalf of the city seeks on average $20,000 per family.


    The hired attorney is also hoping to recoup $50,000 from the survivor – Robert Yarbrough.


    The city is hoping to get that money from possible settlements and judgements from lawsuits the families have filed against several private companies they believe had a role in their loved ones deaths."

    Lets me understand this. A Firefighter, whose job it is to fight fires, died in the fire and his family has the right to sue and collect what could be $Millions from the companies. AND because of this and this only it appears the city wants to collect some of the monies it spent on medical support, which they estimate to be not more than $20,000 per.

    Well lets not take money from these POOR firemen:

    City of Houston: "Generous pension plan

    But more significant is the firefighter pension plan. Far more generous than the plans available to other city employees, the plan has two components. The standard retirement is based on firefighters' pay near the end of their career. A firefighter qualifies for a retirement after 20 years of service. Most firefighters join the department in their early 20s; they typically qualify for retirement in their early 40s. At 20 years' service, the benefit is 50 percent of a firefighter's salary for their life and the life of their spouse. Firefighters who continue to work after 20 years will see the percentage of their retirement benefit rise 3 percent for each additional year of service to a maximum of 80 percent. The amount of the benefit increases each year during retirement by 3 percent or inflation, whichever is greater.

    However, in addition to the standard benefit, firefighters who have served 20 years can participate in a special program called the Deferred Retirement Option Plan, or DROP. Under this plan, the city sets up an account and deposits the retirement benefit the firefighter would have earned into the account. In other words, the firefighter continues to earn his regular salary, but is also being paid his retirement, albeit into an account that the firefighter cannot access.

    More than a drop in the bucket

    The city guarantees that the participants in the plan will earn 8 percent interest on the amount in the DROP account. No money actually changes hands during the DROP period. The transactions are purely accounting entries. The firefighter is paid the total amount in the account in a lump sum upon retirement. The only thing the firefighter gives up by participating in the DROP is that the annual increase in the retirement benefit is lower at 2 percent. But payments into the account are increased by the 3 percent or cost of living during the DROP period.

    The DROP benefit is significantly higher than the standard benefit, so almost everyone opts into the program. This means that most firefighters who retire after 30 years will receive about 70 percent of their ending salary for life and a lump sum distribution from the DROP account of $700,000 to $1 million.

    A city actuary has calculated that the net present value of the retirements earned by firefighters who retired last year was about $1.6 million.

    The cost of such a pension plan is considerable. The budget for the current year calls for the city to contribute $91 million, or about $23,000 per firefighter. But even at that level, the city will not be funding the full cost of the plan.

    So the bottom line is this: The average firefighter earns about $73,000 in direct salary, and the city pays about another $34,000 in health insurance and into the firefighter's retirement account. The city also is incurring a long-term liability for the health and pension benefits that it is not currently funding."


    Before any of you cry to hard, suggest you go down to the VA and look at at some of the soldiers there with war wounds they are being paid a couple of thousand per month, when they die from those wounds their spouse will get nothing, they cannot sue anyone for those wounds, missing limbs or the slow painful death from the cancers of Agent Orange chemical exposure.

    The average pay for a Vietnam combat soldier (Infantry) was about $350 per month, not even min wage, yet many of those combat soldier will live with the health burden till it takes their life.

    1977-2017, ALL firefighter in the us, total deaths: 4,493

    Vietnam: 58,209

    Middle East all wars: 7069

    And none of these men and women are on 24, off 48 or get OVERTIME!
     


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  2. deemus

    deemus TGT Addict

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    So you are trying to draw a correlation to Vietnam soldiers and Houston firefighters? You shittin' me? Bit of a stretch don't you think?

    Ignoring the lawsuit against the companies, not sure my thoughts you that yet, but leaning towards not right.

    So these guys risk their lives to keep citizens and properties safe, and IF. IF. If these guys who have one of the most dangerous jobs around make it to retirement age, you begrudge them a comfortable retirement?

    You been drinking this morning?
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018 at 2:32 PM
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  3. Ole Cowboy

    Ole Cowboy TGT Addict

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    I did not make a correlation just a parallel to: Public workers paid for by the taxpayer.

    So either you think our soldiers should retire with $Million dollar cash plus get up to 80% of their pay for the rest of their life and their wives. In addition should we not pay our soldiers overtime, how about 24 on 48 off, do you support that to?

    No in fact you don't and it tells exactly what you think of the people that have laid down their lives for you, you would piss in their mouth if their guts were on fire. I am neither surprised or shocked at your attitude, its more the norm than the unusual!

    I will assume you are on this forum because you own a gun(s). How about you get off butt and walk into where ever you keep that gun, pick it up, look at in you hand and know, because you clearly don't that its a soldier that protects your rights to own that gun. It was a soldier that gave his life in Europe and the Islands of the Pacific and would give his life to fight the Russians if need so you can type your response in English and not German, Japanese or Russian...maybe he deserves a decent payday and decent healthcare, he NOT asking you for a $Million bucks!
     
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  4. Renegade

    Renegade SuperOwner

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    70% of firefighters in the US are volunteers and get NOTHING.
     
  5. yakdung

    yakdung Member

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    Firefighters in the town I live in are a voluntary force. They are trained by the multi-billion dollar oil and gas company I worked for. I believe I read somewhere recently, three quarters of the calls that are dispatched from the Houston Fire Department are EMS related.
     
  6. Ole Cowboy

    Ole Cowboy TGT Addict

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    1,160,450 firefighters protected the United States in 2015. 345,600 (30%) were career firefighters and 814,850 (70%) were volunteer firefighters.

    And YES they get NOTHING!

    But I did donate a piece of land I owned in White Bluff to the Volunteer Firefighters to auction off to raise money for equipment and help make improvements to the station. I owned more than one piece of property in White Bluff that is on Lake Whitney and when I decided to not retire there I donated to them.
     
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  7. deemus

    deemus TGT Addict

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    Nice end around. I like how you got inflammatory to sidestep the fact you drew unsupportable, borderline ridiculous conclusions.

    Don't tell me I've pissed down a soldiers throat. You know nothing about me. I did NOT serve. On purpose. I left home to get OUT of the military. I know quite a bit about the sacrifices made by our men and women in uniform.

    I think our soldiers are drastically underpaid. Wish we could do something about that. But you want a guy who served two to four years sweeping out a hanger to get a million dollar retirement? Seems pretty unreasonable.

    On the other hand, it seems very reasonable to pay handsomely the firefighters who risk their lives, should they live to retirement. Especially in the Houston area where they have refineries and chemical plants. I get the idea you have zero clue about the dangerous stuff those guys do down there. And on a daily basis.

    I'm impressed they were able to negotiate such nice benefit. I know a few firefighters, and I can tell you the Houston FF contract is a rarity.

    I'm going to ignore the time difference of money from 1967 to 2018.
     
  8. deemus

    deemus TGT Addict

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    Its a damn shame how the values on that place dropped. I know several who sold out for a fraction of the original price. Its a prime spot, with some gorgeous views. I was hoping it would work out.
     

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