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I got to shoot 8 milsurp pistols today.

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  • Mikeinhistory

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    Hey, guys. This is maybe a little off topic, but I got a chance to shoot a bunch of milsurp pistols today, a Nagant M1895, an Astra Model 1921, a Steyr Model 1912, a No2Mk1**, a Colt Police Positive Special, a Colt Army Special, a Zastava M57, and a Smith & Wesson Model 1937. I had a good time and thought you guys might enjoy this little video I made of the day. Hope you all have a good weekend.
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    Blind Sniper

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    So, I have two questions.

    First, which one was your personal favorite?

    Second, did you try the DA trigger on the M1895, or did you treat it like a single-action gun? Not even kidding, both of mine have 25+ pound DA pulls, but single-action is still a (comparatively) light 6-9.
     

    Mikeinhistory

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    So, I have two questions.

    First, which one was your personal favorite?

    Second, did you try the DA trigger on the M1895, or did you treat it like a single-action gun? Not even kidding, both of mine have 25+ pound DA pulls, but single-action is still a (comparatively) light 6-9.

    My personal favorite is and always will be the No2Mk1 top break revolver series. Although, I do like the Webley Mark IV as well but they are basically the same thing. I don't get to shoot them too often because the ammo is hard to find.
    For shooting purposes I think it would be between the Colt Army Special and the S&W Model 1937. The Colt is in .38 special and the S&W is in .45 so I am a better shot with the Colt, but the .45 has a real fun kick. The only drawback is the S&W grips are original, but they are terrible. They are small and smooth wood. It's like holding onto a sweaty pencil that is trying to jump out of your hands.

    I'll agree with you on the M1895. We did shoot it both ways, but I don't think I even hit the target in DA. Yes, the pull was pretty heavy, and actually even compared to everything else it seemed almost unnecessarily heavy. The Astra M1921 had the best trigger I have yet used, even on a modern weapon. It is in 9mm Largo, but kicks like it is a much larger round because of the odd angle of the grips and because it is very light. The M1895 actually is supposedly a Vietnam bring back. It is pretty rough and it has no import marks and I did buy it from a Vietnam vet I know, but he doesn't always remember things exactly. He claims, well actually I guess he remembers carrying a "tanker" Garand at some point in Vietnam, which I am pretty certain cannot be true. So maybe he did bring back a Nagant revolver and maybe this one was it, but I do not know if I will ever know for sure.
     

    Blind Sniper

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    My personal favorite is and always will be the No2Mk1 top break revolver series. Although, I do like the Webley Mark IV as well but they are basically the same thing. I don't get to shoot them too often because the ammo is hard to find.
    For shooting purposes I think it would be between the Colt Army Special and the S&W Model 1937. The Colt is in .38 special and the S&W is in .45 so I am a better shot with the Colt, but the .45 has a real fun kick. The only drawback is the S&W grips are original, but they are terrible. They are small and smooth wood. It's like holding onto a sweaty pencil that is trying to jump out of your hands.

    I'll agree with you on the M1895. We did shoot it both ways, but I don't think I even hit the target in DA. Yes, the pull was pretty heavy, and actually even compared to everything else it seemed almost unnecessarily heavy. The Astra M1921 had the best trigger I have yet used, even on a modern weapon. It is in 9mm Largo, but kicks like it is a much larger round because of the odd angle of the grips and because it is very light. The M1895 actually is supposedly a Vietnam bring back. It is pretty rough and it has no import marks and I did buy it from a Vietnam vet I know, but he doesn't always remember things exactly. He claims, well actually I guess he remembers carrying a "tanker" Garand at some point in Vietnam, which I am pretty certain cannot be true. So maybe he did bring back a Nagant revolver and maybe this one was it, but I do not know if I will ever know for sure.

    Re: Favorite - I gotta agree, there's something about the kick of a .45 that never fails to make me grin, even shooting with my gimpy right wrist. That S&W looked like a beauty - though I have to agree on the grips. Smooth is -never- a good idea on a handgun, IMHO.

    Re: Nagant - Amen on the trigger! Not gonna lie, I can't even reliably fire mine in DA because I just don't have the strength to muscle through that stack-happy pull. If you ever want to see what gives it that rough DA pull, pop off the left-hand frame plate and cock the hammer nice and slow while you watch everything move. It's surprising just how many moving parts there are, and how some of them interact.

    Honestly, if it doesn't have import marks, then odds are it's a bring-back from somewhere. Might not be from Vietnam (according to Wikipedia at least, the vast majority of M1895s the VC used were suppressed, for use as assassination tools), but it's almost certainly seen some service. What would be really cool is if it were possible to trace the serial number, find out when exactly it was made (after all, the Tula plant shut down in December of '41 - which makes my '43 Tula rather rare, apparently) and if it was ever issued as part of a soldier/conscript's loadout.
     

    Mikeinhistory

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    Re: Favorite - I gotta agree, there's something about the kick of a .45 that never fails to make me grin, even shooting with my gimpy right wrist. That S&W looked like a beauty - though I have to agree on the grips. Smooth is -never- a good idea on a handgun, IMHO.

    Re: Nagant - Amen on the trigger! Not gonna lie, I can't even reliably fire mine in DA because I just don't have the strength to muscle through that stack-happy pull. If you ever want to see what gives it that rough DA pull, pop off the left-hand frame plate and cock the hammer nice and slow while you watch everything move. It's surprising just how many moving parts there are, and how some of them interact.

    Honestly, if it doesn't have import marks, then odds are it's a bring-back from somewhere. Might not be from Vietnam (according to Wikipedia at least, the vast majority of M1895s the VC used were suppressed, for use as assassination tools), but it's almost certainly seen some service. What would be really cool is if it were possible to trace the serial number, find out when exactly it was made (after all, the Tula plant shut down in December of '41 - which makes my '43 Tula rather rare, apparently) and if it was ever issued as part of a soldier/conscript's loadout.

    She is a beauty for sure.

    Yeah, the Nagant is like the one over-designed Russian weapon ever. Everything else is a big hunk of metal they milled out. The Nagant is like a Swiss watch in comparison.
     

    Mikeinhistory

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    The chamber moves up and connects with the barrel as it turns,so there is no "gap". All the gas goes out the barrel unlike other revolvers. It's also the only revolver that can be outfitted with a silencer because of this. The VC apparently used it with some success on "assassination" missions.
     

    robertc1024

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    If I had mine with me, I'd already have pictures up to show you just what we're talking about. Suffice to say, that little piece is complicated! It's the only revolver I know of that uses a separate recoil plate and breech block as part of its action.
    I'd be fascinated - post those bad boy pics up. I am in no way saying anything other than I'm ignorant of that platform.
     

    Blind Sniper

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    The chamber moves up and connects with the barrel as it turns,so there is no "gap". All the gas goes out the barrel unlike other revolvers. It's also the only revolver that can be outfitted with a silencer because of this. The VC apparently used it with some success on "assassination" missions.

    FWIW, if you're ever up in Langley, there's an example of a suppressed Nagant in the CIA museum.

    Also - it's not just the cylinder moving forward that creates the seal. The 7.62x38mmR round is a key part of it, because the case mouth (which is crimped -over- the end of the bullet) is forced into the forcing cone by the cylinder's forward push.

    Edit: Rob, you missed the "If I had mine with me..." part of that >.< Regretfully, they were among the things I had to leave with my dad when I moved back north - and now he's being a dick and refusing to give 'em back, claiming that Michigan has "hostile" gun laws. But that's something for the Rant section next time I'm drunk.
     
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    Mikeinhistory

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    FWIW, if you're ever up in Langley, there's an example of a suppressed Nagant in the CIA museum.

    Also - it's not just the cylinder moving forward that creates the seal. The 7.62x38mmR round is a key part of it, because the case mouth (which is crimped -over- the end of the bullet) is forced into the forcing cone by the cylinder's forward push.

    Edit: Rob, you missed the "If I had mine with me..." part of that >.< Regretfully, they were among the things I had to leave with my dad when I moved back north - and now he's being a dick and refusing to give 'em back, claiming that Michigan has "hostile" gun laws. But that's something for the Rant section next time I'm drunk.

    Oh, yes you are right about the ammo. I always forget the weird looking rounds it uses. That is what the whole thing is built around. It's just so over designed and really how many fps does it save? And it's really not a very big round either.

    I'll post a pic or video of it tomorrow sometime when I have time to get a camera out or something.
     

    Blind Sniper

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    Over-designed, yeah. Impossible to break? Apparently. Unless you do something outright retarded like heat up the mainspring enough to screw with the original heat-treat, or dry-fire on an empty chamber enough that the firing pin breaks, there's really nothing you can do to render a Nagant inoperable.
     

    RetArmySgt

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    IMG00018-20100812-1537.jpg
    IMG00019-20100812-1538.jpg Hammer foward
    IMG00020-20100812-1539.jpg Hammer cocked, cylinder forward.
    IMG00021-20100812-1540.jpg
    IMG00022-20100812-1541.jpg
     
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