Is Suicide Always the Result of Mental Illness?

[majormadmax]

In light of the two celebrity suicides this week, both of which were considered "well off" I would like to have a frank but civil discussion about the claim that suicide is always the result of mental illness.

Suicide rates are increasing in almost every state, a new report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention found.

In more than half of the states, the rate increased more than 30 percent between 1999 and 2016, according to the CDC. Suicide is one of just three leading causes of death that are increasing, the other two being Alzheimer's disease and drug overdoses (source).

Last year, nearly 45,000 people died by suicide, according to the CDC.

The CDC found that 54 percent of people who committed suicide did not have a known diagnosed mental health condition when they died.

I found a UK study that claimed that not all who commit suicide are mentally ill, and also that mental illness is often not clearly distinguishable from normal stress. The extent to which someone is expressing their free will and is capable of being responsible for their actions is important to establish when deciding whether suicide indicates a psychopathological state of mind. The principle of autonomy, integral to a free society, requires that a person's decisions regarding their own life should be respected wherever possible (source).

I am curious as to everyone's thoughts on the matter...

Cheers! M2

 

[oldag]

Guess that would really depend upon the definition of mental illness. Would depression be considered mental illness?

 

[AustinN4]

Last year, nearly 45,000 people died by suicide, according to the CDC.

Wonder how many of those were assisted suicides, as in beating a really bad disease
to the punch, so to speak.

 

[Wildcat Diva]

Some people get really mad and make an impulsive choice that can’t be undone. That’s not mental illness on its own.

Poor coping skills and emotional regulation skills are often co-existent with those who have diagnosable mental health conditions, but it’s not only those folks who have these deficits.

 

[Wildcat Diva]

To reference the OP, well-off does not equal not mentally ill, though.

 

[grasshopperglock]

Is suicide a free will decision? Or can it be explained by an excuse?

I've been hospitalized for depression. Suicide to escape it??? How incredibly selfish and cruel to those that love me. Sometimes you gotta drop the balls and cope. If you reach a breaking point. You'll either lose to it or grow stronger. What you become on the other side is completely up to you.

There is no excuse.

 

[toddnjoyce]

No. For a lot of reasons. Keep in mind that suicide is an irrational action to all but the person committing the act.

No mental illness required, diagnosed or not.

 

[majormadmax]

I just noticed the irony of my signature block (from Rudyard Kipling's The Young British Soldier) and the subject of this thread...

 

[easy rider]

To reference the OP, well-off does not equal not mentally ill, though.

On the flip side, well-off (money) isn't always a measure for depression. I was never suicidal, but at a point I had the most money I also had the most depression. Money helped in providing distractions, but the depression was still there.

 

[Charlie]

Let ten people of many backgrounds define mental illness, and you will probably get ten different answers.

 

[busykngt]

I’ve made the connection between suicide and “mass shootings” before (as have many other people). Many mass shootings have ended with the shooter either taking his own life (which was likely the intended result from the beginning) or shooting until stopped (a suicide by cop type scenario). Why some overtly suicidal people decide to take their own life (and only their life) in a very “private” manner and others feel the need to take fellow human beings with them, remains a great mystery (at least to me).

I cannot fathom the depth of despair that even temporary depression would lead someone to take their own life; rather lone, feel the need to take innocent victims with them.

 

[pronstar]

IMHO self-preservation is a fundamental tenant of all life.

So suicide would go against what it means to be alive.
A defect, if you will, though there’s maybe a better word for it.

Sometimes we see suicide-like behavior among abused/captive animals, but I would argue their living conditions contributed to a mental defect.

I’m curious to hear Wildcat Diva’s take on this, given her profession.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[busykngt]

I think the idea (societal permissibility) of suicide can also be ingrained as a cultural manifestation. For instance, historical Japanese cultural acceptance of honor involving hara kiri (seppuku) - Shogun era and later, the kamikaze; and even today in their “suicide forest”.

The radical Islamic jihadist with their suicide bomb vests and seventy-two virgins awaiting their arrival. Is any of this rational? Certainly not in our western culture. Really? What about the soldier throwing himself on the grenade to save his buddies? The 911 tower jumpers... faced with burning to death or...
(maybe suicide can be “rational” after all?).

 

[Dawico]

There is obviously enough mental illness involved to overcome the will to live in a suicide.

That illness may be a defect, a result of some type of drug, or just what happens in the mind from life situations. It may even be temporary or permanent.

At the end of the day though it doesn't much matter the reason. The solution is final.

 

[Sam7sf]

In light of the two celebrity suicides this week, both of which were considered "well off" I would like to have a frank but civil discussion about the claim that suicide is always the result of mental illness.

It was celebrities. I have zero sympathy for them. With the lifestyle they lead, how people fallow them like a cult, the money and all the possessions they have I don't feel bad for them. They somehow will be remembered and the kids or adults who actually needed a friend will just never have existed.

One reason depression is selfish is because it's a choice to say please have pitty on me and pay attention to me. I remind myself that their are people in the world who are hurt and feeling alone on levels far greater than mine. This is why my philosophy has changed the older I got. I'm not perfect. I don't have many friends, I'm a dick, I have had a chip on my shoulder, its hard for me to trust, but I do know the world doesn't revolve around me. It's important to help pick others up even when you feel like no one wants to help you get back on your feet.

 

[Vaquero]

I don't know.

 

[benenglish]

maybe suicide can be “rational” after all?

Of course it can.

Louis Awerbuck ended his life messily and I wish he'd found a neater way. But I certainly don't blame him for it and I have just a touch of admiration for his willingness to leave when he did. His suicide was entirely rational.

If I'm in the same situation, I hope I have the same fortitude to choose the same path.

 

[grasshopperglock]

Of course it can.

Louis Awerbuck ended his life messily and I wish he'd found a neater way. But I certainly don't blame him for it and I have just a touch of admiration for his willingness to leave when he did. His suicide was entirely rational.

If I'm in the same situation, I hope I have the same fortitude to choose the same path.

Are you really applying romanticism to suicide? How was it rational to destroy the gift of life? There's a million other people that would have took what life force he had left. Just to hug a child. Feel the warm sun again. Smell a fresh breeze of honeysuckle flowers.

Screw that guy.

 

[AustinN4]

http://www.isegoria.net/2014/06/louis-awerbuck/
Alzheimer’s

 

[grasshopperglock]

Is that the justification or the excuse? Or did he just give up on the fight?