Is the defense shortgun still relevant?

[zackmars]

Between you and Massad Ayoob, who is more credible and experienced?

Massad has little real world experience in reality, and is only really an expert because he said he was, it was enough to get him called on on court, and got him an audience.

He has some good points, but when you boil him down, he is little different than all the martial arts "experts" that came around in the 70's

 

[camotoe]

I also like shotty at home,


easy to get a newb rollin with one to

 

[billtool]

I also like shotty at home,


easy to get a newb rollin with one to

I assure you, Brother, a Saiga 12 is absolutely a relevant shortgun for home defense as well. A 20 round drum with full boat 00 Buck will defend my house, your house, and a couple other guy’s houses.

 

[London]

Massad has little real world experience in reality, and is only really an expert because he said he was, it was enough to get him called on on court, and got him an audience.

He has some good points, but when you boil him down, he is little different than all the martial arts "experts" that came around in the 70's

Please define "Real world experience" so we can compare his to those advocating unsighted shooting.

 

[London]

Let me ask you this question. In a violent attack on your person or your loved ones, with a violent criminal or deranged individual, and your life, or the lives of your loved ones are at stake, is Massad Ayoob going to be there to back you up, or will it all be on you?

Sure, he's written a few books on the subject, give seminars and lectures on the subject, and some seem to think he's an expert or an authority on the subject of self defense. I don't anymore. Because when the chips are down and it's me against someone that might end my life, he's not around. I only have myself to rely upon to survive that encounter. Not Massad Ayoob. I have and will learn and practice what I think I need t survive a violent encounter, and not what some so-called expert thinks I need to survive.

Massad Ayoob is my co-pilot.

 

[Axxe55]

Massad Ayoob is my co-pilot.

 

[zackmars]

Please define "Real world experience" so we can compare his to those advocating unsighted shooting.

Anything more than being a part time deputy (or whatever he was) in a peaceful northeastern hamlet

You have no idea what you are arguing about, and running to ayoob is akin to the blind leading the blind

He is little more than a con artist. Someone who has managed to BS his way to success despite zero experience to actually back it up

 

[zackmars]

View attachment 238485

There's a far side for that

 

[Leadeye]

I'm partial to the High Standard 10-B, an old design, but still works well.

 

[zackmars]

I'm partial to the High Standard 10-B, an old design, but still works well.

My boss has 3 and i am desperately trying to claw one away from him

 

[billtool]

I'm partial to the High Standard 10-B, an old design, but still works well.

Cool. Never saw one and didn’t know they existed. Any more pics?

 

[Axxe55]

I remember some years ago, on a similar type thread, on another forum this discussion came up about the best choice for gun for home defense. Now I am partial to the shotgun for various reasons and state that I think it's the best option for my circumstances and specific requirements for my home defense platform. It may, or may not be the best option for others though.

Well some idiot chimed in on the thread and started bashing me for choosing a shotgun because it would do too much damage to the sheetrock and other interior building materials, plus would leave too much blood and such to have to clean up.

I stated if fixing damaged sheetrock and cleaning up blood and brains was all I had to do if an attacker broke into my home and my loved ones were safe after that encounter, that was small price I was willing to pay. A price I'll pay anytime.

 

[Hoji]

Please define "Real world experience" so we can compare his to those advocating unsighted shooting.

Let me just say that shooting from retention is a legitimate technique for close quarter defensive shooting.

I will also say that if you pull a gun on me and bring the sights up to your eyes at 6’ or less between us, I will beat your trigger pull and cause a critical malfunction of your pistol.
Now you are in a test of strength and meanness with me, and I assure you I am both stronger and meaner than most.

Mas has a ton of great insight, and is worth listening to, but he is not the know all and end all of defensive handgunning.

 

[Hoji]

I remember some years ago, on a similar type thread, on another forum this discussion came up about the best choice for gun for home defense. Now I am partial to the shotgun for various reasons and state that I think it's the best option for my circumstances and specific requirements for my home defense platform. It may, or may not be the best option for others though.

Well some idiot chimed in on the thread and started bashing me for choosing a shotgun because it would do too much damage to the sheetrock and other interior building materials, plus would leave too much blood and such to have to clean up.

I stated if fixing damaged sheetrock and cleaning up blood and brains was all I had to do if an attacker broke into my home and my loved ones were safe after that encounter, that was small price I was willing to pay. A price I'll pay anytime.

Or you could just call these guys

Crime Scene, Biohazard, Suicide & Trauma Cleanup Dallas TX

BioTechs, a biohazard, suicide, blood and crime scene cleanup Dallas TX company, is Rated A+ w/BBB. Most insurance companies cover our death cleaning services cost.

www.biotechsdfw.com

 

[Axxe55]

Or you could just call these guys

Crime Scene, Biohazard, Suicide & Trauma Cleanup Dallas TX

BioTechs, a biohazard, suicide, blood and crime scene cleanup Dallas TX company, is Rated A+ w/BBB. Most insurance companies cover our death cleaning services cost.

www.biotechsdfw.com

Only the sight of my own blood bothers me!

 

[Hoji]

Only the sight of my own blood bothers me!

Screw a bunch of getting some junkie’s hepatitis seething blood and entrails on any part of me. Homeowners insurance should cover it and having professionals do it pretty much insures I don’t miss a piece, have one of my goofy ass dogs pick it up, and lick me in the face with Hep infested offal.

 

[Axxe55]

Screw a bunch of getting some junkie’s hepatitis seething blood and entrails on any part of me. Homeowners insurance should cover it and having professionals do it pretty much insures I don’t miss a piece, have one of my goofy ass dogs pick it up, and lick me in the face with Hep infested offal.

Dayem Hoji! I was thinking about dressing like Leatherface and just getting the job done!

 

[Leadeye]

The High Standard Model 10 went through some changes since it's development by a California policeman in the early 60s. Designed so that he could fire it with one hand while in his police car the gun does this well and is quite controllable. This is the B model which had some improvements and made the flashlight mount detachable.

Sitting in a vehicle with the gun shouldered it's easy to swing it to shoot out either window or you can stick it out the drivers side and fire it straight forward with one hand. Shot from the left shoulder it's a problem as it ejects the shells in your face.

 

[Axxe55]

The High Standard Model 10 went through some changes since it's development by a California policeman in the early 60s. Designed so that he could fire it with one hand while in his police car the gun does this well and is quite controllable. This is the B model which had some improvements and made the flashlight mount detachable.

Sitting in a vehicle with the gun shouldered it's easy to swing it to shoot out either window or you can stick it out the drivers side and fire it straight forward with one hand. Shot from the left shoulder it's a problem as it ejects the shells in your face.

That is a pretty cool shotgun. I never knew they existed.

 

[billtool]

That is a pretty cool shotgun. I never knew they existed.

Neither did I. Sounds purpose built though if you can’t shoulder it without taking a mouthful of spent shell.