Leaving gun in car at work

[DoubleActionCHL]

This is of particular interest to me since our employee manual says we can't have a handgun on company "premises". The above cited clause implies that I can in fact have a handgun in my locked vehicle in the company parking lot because parking lots are not considered to be "premises".

I think I'll look into this further.

This definition does not apply to your employer. If your employer has a "No Guns Policy," it applies to all premises and property owned or under the control of your employer.

 

[arvetus]

They CAN fire you, but they can't prosecute you with anything criminal. Legally, you can carry, but your employer does have the right to execute their policy. I don't believe the "parking lot bill" got to the floor for a vote this year. This bill, if passed, would have protected your job, but I guess we have to hold out for next year. A lot of good and worthwhile gun items passed this year...can't get everything you want all to once I suppose...

 

[dt300mm]

premises defination & schools

this is right out of the CHL handbook. Kinda wordy, but most of the answers to everyone's questions are here.

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PC46.035. TEXAS CONCEALED HANDGUN LAWS​

mined by the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission under Section
104.06, Alcoholic Beverage Code;
(2) on the premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional
sporting event or interscholastic event is taking place, unless
the license holder is a participant in the event and a handgun is used
in the event;
(3) on the premises of a correctional facility;
(4) on the premises of a,hospital licensed under Chapter 241.
Health and Safety Code, or on the premises of a nursing home licensed
under Chapter 242, Health and Safety Code, unless the license
holder has written authorization of the hospital or nursing home
administration, as appropriate;
(5) in an amusement park; or
(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established
place of religious worship.
(c) A license holder commits an offense​

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if the license holder intentionally,
knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority
of Subchapter H. Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of
,whether the handgun is concealed, at any meeting of a governmental
entity.
(d) A license holder commits an offense if, while intoxicated, the
license holder carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H,
Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is
concealed.
(e) A license holder who is licensed as a security officer under
Chapter 1702. Occupations Code, and employed as a security officer
commits an offense if, while in the course and scope of the security
officer's employment, the security officer violates a provision of
Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code.​

(9​

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In this section:
(1) "Amusement park" means a permanent indoor or outdoor
facility or park where amusement rides are available for use by the
public that is located in a county with a population of more than one
million, encompasses at least 75 acres in surface area, is enclosed
with access only through controlled entries, is open for operation more
than 120 days in each calendar year, and has security guards on the
premises at all times. The term does not include any public or private
driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or
other parking area.
(2) "License holder means a person licensed to carry a handgun
under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code.
(3) "Premises" means a building or a portion of a building. The
term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk
or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.
(g) An offense under Subsection (a), (b), (c), (d), or (e) is a Class A
misdemeanor, unless the offense ,is committed under Subsection
(b)(l) or (b)(3), in which event the offense is a felony of the third
degree.
(h) It is a defense to prosecution under Subsection (a) that the​

actor, at the time of the commission of the offense, displayed the

PC 4​

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6.035. PLACES WEAPONS PROHIBITED. (a) A person commits
an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly possesses
or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or prohibited weapon
listed in Section 46.05(a):
(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution,
any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or
educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation
vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or
educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written
regulations or written authorization of the institution;
(2) on the premises of a polling place on the day of an election or
while early voting is in progress;
(3) on the premises of any government court or offices utilized by
the court, unless pursuant to written regulations or written authorization
of the court;
(4) on the premises of a racetrack; or
(5) in or into a secured area of an airport.
(6) within 1,000 feet of premises the location of which is designated
by the Texas Department of Criminal Justice as a place of
execution under Article 43.19, Code of Criminal Procedure, on a day
that a sentence of death is set to be imposed on the designated
premises and the person received notice that:
(A) going within 1,000 feet of the premises with a weapon listed
under this subsection was prohibited; or
(B) possessing a weapon listed under this subsection within
1,000 feet of the premises was prohibited.
(b) It is a defense to prosecution under Subsections (a)(l)-(4) that
the actor possessed a firearm while in the actual discharge of his official
duties as a member of the armed forces or national guard or a
guard employed by a penal institution, or an officer of the court.
(c) In this section:​

(1) "Premises" has the meaning assigned by Section 46.035.

 

[DirtyD]

Again, as stated by DoubleAction, the definition of premises in the CHL handbook does not apply to employers....

 

[DoubleActionCHL]

Again, as stated by DoubleAction, the definition of premises in the CHL handbook does not apply to employers....

Read your sig, D... Nobody cares!

 

[DirtyD]

Read your sig, D... Nobody cares!

Evidently not... But I like beating dead horses!

GC​

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9411.203. RIGHTS OF EMPLOYERS. This subchapter does not
prevent or otherwise limit the right of a pubiic or private employer to
prohibit persons who are licensed under this subchapter from carrying​

a concealed handgun on the premises of the business.

 

[DoubleActionCHL]

Evidently not... But I like beating dead horses!

GC​

9411.203. RIGHTS OF EMPLOYERS. This subchapter does not
prevent or otherwise limit the right of a pubiic or private employer to
prohibit persons who are licensed under this subchapter from carrying​

a concealed handgun on the premises of the business.

The key here is the fact that the definition of premises cited is limited to the statute of context.

 

[thorkyl]

This is actually very simple.
If you have a CHL and your employer says no firearms then your risk is your job unless the post 30.06.

So you have to ask yourself a simple question.

Is having my firearm on company property so I can defend myself and others worth the risk of being fired?

Only you can answer that question.

 

[DirtyD]

The key here is the fact that the definition of premises cited is limited to the statute of context.

Context kills em every time!

 

[DoubleActionCHL]

This is actually very simple.
If you have a CHL and your employer says no firearms then your risk is your job unless the post 30.06.

So you have to ask yourself a simple question.

Is having my firearm on company property so I can defend myself and others worth the risk of being fired?

Only you can answer that question.

Absolutely! I would never suggest that anyone ignore the wishes of their employer, or break the law, for that matter. Am I willing to allow myself or family to become a victim by bowing to the rules of some New York attorney? Not me!

 

[pheet17]

What needs to happen is the bill that keeps getting left in a politicians desk get pushed and passes. Then this is a dead issue.

 

[thorkyl]

What needs to happen is the bill that keeps getting left in a politicians desk get pushed and passes. Then this is a dead issue.

As Gov. Perry stated, it would have passed if the democrats did not slow the process down and stop the voter ID bill from coming to a vote.

 

[APatriot]

My employer does not allow firearms on company property, including parking lots. Will the law that allows carrying concealed in your vehicle protect my job if my employer does a search? I believe Oklahoma and Florida are passing, or have passed, laws that protect employee rights to keep weapons in their locked personal vehicles, even in parking lots. Do we have the same protections here in God's country?

Businesses have the right to prevent firearms on their property. If an employer finds a weapon in your vehicle on their parking lot, you can't be charged with a crime, but you could lose your job due to violating the employer's policy. When and if the law in Texas is passed, wherein an employer's parking lot is not secured, therefore public access is available, then CHL holders only will be permitted to keep a firearm in their vehicle. However, such legislation is not yet law in Texas.

 

[jsimmons]

I've been pretty lucky in this regard. The last company I worked for had probably a 50-60% participation rate in terms of firearms in vehicles, and several of the employees were CHL holders. In November 2008, I started with a new company who has a no firearms on *premises* policy "unless specifically permitted" to do so.

After finding out that "premises" does not include parking lots (by the state's definition), I figured I'd ask for "specific permission". Last week - a couple of days after I requested permission - we had our monthly employee luncheon, and it was announced that it was acceptable to have firearms locked in cars during the work day.

 

[jsimmons]

When and if the law in Texas is passed, wherein an employer's parking lot is not secured, therefore public access is available, then CHL holders only will be permitted to keep a firearm in their vehicle.

I'm willing to bet that the law (if ever passed) won't exclude non-CHL holders (as an example - the MPA doesn't). Why should non-CHL holders be denied the ability to defend themselves?

 

[DirtyD]

After finding out that "premises" does not include parking lots (by the state's definition), I figured I'd ask for "specific permission". Last week - a couple of days after I requested permission - we had our monthly employee luncheon, and it was announced that it was acceptable to have firearms locked in cars during the work day.

Glad to hear your employer has some sense, however, you are mistaken in the bold part of your statement above...

 

[SiscoKid]

I'm now retired but used to work for a Houston company traveling the state in a company van. Have had my Texas CCW Permit since they were available.

When I went to work for this company around 2000 there was a long set of rules on a sheet, one was no firearms. Now it didn't take me but one trip to see that I was traveling to some, let's just say, areas of concern (OK, seedy parts of town). Therefore, from that point on I had a .25 inside a pocket of my personal briefcase.

Never had to use it, but a few times I observed some potential situations where drunks approached me for money. I always had it in my back pocket then. (was even "solicited" three times over the years)

If the situation was to occur where my life depended on having a weapon or complying with company rules, I don't have to think about which decision I would make. A no brainer for me.

I could always get another job. But if I was clubbed or stabbed .....

 

[DoubleActionCHL]

I've been pretty lucky in this regard. The last company I worked for had probably a 50-60% participation rate in terms of firearms in vehicles, and several of the employees were CHL holders. In November 2008, I started with a new company who has a no firearms on *premises* policy "unless specifically permitted" to do so.

After finding out that "premises" does not include parking lots (by the state's definition), I figured I'd ask for "specific permission". Last week - a couple of days after I requested permission - we had our monthly employee luncheon, and it was announced that it was acceptable to have firearms locked in cars during the work day.

Once again, this definition of premises does NOT apply to employers! It is specific to TPC Section 46.03 and 46.035.

 

[APatriot]

My friend,

I would argue it doesn't even need to be permanently attached. It could be a "lock box" with a key. Employer searches vehicle, sees the "lock box", you forgot the key at home. What do you think?

Without re-arguing the previously mentioned private parking lot restrictions or blanket consents to search by employers:

Given the number of vehicle burglaries and vehicle thefts in <insert your town here>, don't you think it would be irresponsible to leave a firearm or any other unsecured personal property in an unattended vehicle? I mean, it's not like the owner of that parking lot <insert your employer's name here> is going to assume any responsibility for loss or theft, right?

Wouldn't you all agree that a locking, hardsided container permanently and discretely attached to the car (bolted under the seat, in the trunk, in the console, or whatever) would be the most responsible means of storing said personal property in said unattended vehicle that is regularly parked in said crime-prone community? Heck, if you make an occasional cash bank deposit it might be a good idea to have something like that.

Now (assuming the employer ever even sees the storage receptacle) it sure is easy to forget and leave the key to that thing at the house. We only use it occasionally when we run to the bank. Gee, I'll bring the key with me to work and you can look in there first thing tomorrow morning...

 

[APatriot]

My friend,

I may be wrong, but I think the poster is referring to an employee handbook which states "premises". As such, if the employee handbook does not say "employee parking lot or similar", there could be an issue of wrongful termination if employee vehicle search turns up a weapon in the vehicle on the parking lot, using the definition of legal "premises". The employee could simply say, "I didn't think it applied to the parking lot in that the handbook states "premises" and since I am a CHL holder, I referred to the definition of "premises" in accordance to state law". Just a thought. With that said, don't go to HR questioning the definition of premises as defined in the employee handbook...LOL...then you are screwed.

Again, as stated by DoubleAction, the definition of premises in the CHL handbook does not apply to employers....