Legality of CCW in privately owned businesses with no 30.06 signage

[jordanmills]

They can, however, post rules and if you don't comply can ask you to leave for non-compliance, then use traditional Criminal Trespass to enforce.

Yes, but they'd have to know it. I honestly hope I don't ever have to give the general public clear evidence that I'm carrying a loaded gun.

 

[Mreed911]

Yes, but they'd have to know it. I honestly hope I don't ever have to give the general public clear evidence that I'm carrying a loaded gun.

Completely agreed on both points.

 

[45tex]

I'd be interested to know how many gun stores/ranges have been robbed by chl holders? I am to the point in life where I have no loyalty to any business. And that's about how much loyalty I feel from them.

profound thinking about stuff

 

[Shorts]

The law says you commit an offense if you carry a handgun on the property of another without consent, AND you were either given notice that entry with a concealed handun was forbidden, OR you remained on the property after being given notice that remaining with your concealed handgun was forbidden.

In this law, penal code 30.06, the word "notice" is defined as oral or written communication. Oral communication is not defined, so if someone with apparent authority to act for the owner, or the owner, tells you you cannot carry, then you commit an offense if you then enter or if you fail to leave if you are already there.

Written communication IS defined. It is a card or document with specific language, normally called 30.06 language, or a sign posted on the property that meets the specific requirements.

So let's look at a ghost busters sign posted at Joes Book Store. You do not know Joe, and you do not have his consent. Is the ghostbusters sign oral communication? No. Is it "written communication"? To know if the sign is written communication we ask ourselves this question, is it a card or other document with specific language? No. Is it a sign posted on the property? No

So if you carry inside do you violate 30.06.

No.

Do I pass your CHL class?

 

[Robb in Austin]

The middle one doesn't comply either. White on clear is not contrasting.

Are you willing to take that stance to trial?

I'm not trying to be a donkey. But, if you took that opinion to trial, either before a jury or a judge I think you would wind up on the losing end.

I can see a lawyer holding up a picture of that and telling a jury "Can you read this?" I'd then bet more than 90% of the public would say yes and you would lose. I'd also bet a judge would be in that majority. Sure, if you get a slick defense lawyer he *might* be able to spin that in your favor but I wouldn't be willing to risk it.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

No.

Do I pass your CHL class?

Hey girl, long time....

 

[Tejano Scott]

Hey girl, long time....

Not really. You bumped a year old thread that I linked in a different thread earlier. LOL

 

[majormadmax]

Any time I see a anti-gun sign, I do not enter the business. I take myself and money else were to shop.

I do, and I carry when I do so, just on a matter of principle.

I just don't buy anything...

That shows them!

 

[TheDan]

Well screw Toby Keith then! I'm switching to blue Solo cups...

 

[Booyah]

Not that I'm aware of, but "clear" doesn't contrast with anything. It's pretty easy to trot out documentation of that.

I would like to see that documentation if you don't mind...it being easy to trot out and all.

While most of us hear can probably sympathize with your opinion on the clear on white dilemma, you do realize that our opinions do not constitute law...unless you are a judge?

 

[Tejano Scott]

This thread is over a year old! Sheesh

 

[Booyah]

This thread is over a year old! Sheesh

At least I didn't start it (points finger at cam)

 

[Odiferous]

One more thing - if you ever see a gunbuster or otherwise non-compliant sign, please do not point out to the business owner that it's not enforceable. If he or she is really anti-gun, then they'll tell you guns aren't allowed and you'll have been given notice, or they'll educate themselves and post a proper sign and ruin it for the rest of us.

I prefer to believe that the business owner knows the law and posts a gunbuster with full knowledge that it's not enforceable, to keep ignorant anti's happy.

In any event, it's not your job to make sure he or she knows the law. Keep your mouth shut.

All things considered, even here in liberal whacko central Austin, you really don't see too many gunbuster signs (or 30.06 signs, for that matter) and the ones you do see are typically on chains that are headquartered out of state. Local or Texas based businesses don't typically post anything.

This x10

On a side note, I had a friend from Massachusetts visit recently. He knew I was carrying, and finally asked why I was carrying in places that had "no guns" signs. After I explained 30.06 and proper signage to him, he came to the same conclusion as you did.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Not really. You bumped a year old thread that I linked in a different thread earlier. LOL

Oooooooooh!

I saw the date of her post, & missed the fact it was "2014", lol.

Duuuuuuuuuuuuh!

 

[ZX9RCAM]

At least I didn't start it (points finger at cam)

Well..........







It's Scott's fault, he linked to it, lol.