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  • wbstx11

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    Sep 14, 2015
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    Hi everyone – I am new to rifle reloading, I have been re loading38 spcl and 45 acp for about 3 yrs; started off with RCBS Rock Chucker &Lee dies, and later got a Lee Loadmaster Progressive (finicky junk!). I will stick to the Rock Chucker for 308reloading. My rifle is a Ruger American22” with 1:10 twist. Mainly I target shoot for personal satisfaction and I wantto see how accurate I can get with this rifle. This is just a hobby for me. Last trip to the range I shot severalcommercial ammos @ 100 yards and averaged 3 groups of 3 rounds each andmeasured the following average results: HornadySuperformance 165gr SST - 1.25”; Fiocchi Extrema 180gr SST 4.5”, FreedomMunitions Remanufactured 147gr FMJ 3.25” and Federal 180gr SP 3.25”. I boughtsome used military brass – mostly LC 12 and LC 13 which I am processing andsorting/culling. I have FL sized, headspaced, trimmed OAL, and drops into chamberOK. My question is: to focus onaccuracy, where would you start? – what are some of the key issues to makepriorities? I have a Hornady HeadspaceComparator, a Wilson case trimmer, a Lyman electronic powder measurer, LeeDelux Die Set, Lee decapping die, and plan to use Varget mostly, also haveRL15. I’ve read a lot, like what I’veread on this site – so I thought I’d ask.
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    Dawico

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    Good bullets and good brass are the keys.

    Trim your brass all the same and weigh them. Load brass in groups that weigh the same, even if each group weighs much different. In time you will need to buy better and more expensive brass but any will work to start with.

    1:10 twist barrels seem to like heavier bullets but that is a very general rule. I would try 178 gr Amaxes as my rifle liked them, but heavy SMKs should work well too. Most .308s do well with 168gr bullets too. If you want the most out of your rifle stick with match bullets like Hornady Amaxes, Sierra MatchKings, or even others that are more expensive. If you want a good match hunting bullet I like Hornady SSTs.

    I used to load with 4064 but Varget seems to do well too.

    Eventually you will find that your rifle and shooting ability will be the limiting factors. If 1" 5 shot groups are your goal you should be able to do it with what you have. Smaller groups get very spendy.

    One of the keys to small groups is consistency. This is where spending more on brass and bullets comes into play.
     

    ed308

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    Good bullets and good brass are the keys.

    Trim your brass all the same and weigh them. Load brass in groups that weigh the same, even if each group weighs much different. In time you will need to buy better and more expensive brass but any will work to start with.

    1:10 twist barrels seem to like heavier bullets but that is a very general rule. I would try 178 gr Amaxes as my rifle liked them, but heavy SMKs should work well too. Most .308s do well with 168gr bullets too. If you want the most out of your rifle stick with match bullets like Hornady Amaxes, Sierra MatchKings, or even others that are more expensive. If you want a good match hunting bullet I like Hornady SSTs.

    I used to load with 4064 but Varget seems to do well too.

    Eventually you will find that your rifle and shooting ability will be the limiting factors. If 1" 5 shot groups are your goal you should be able to do it with what you have. Smaller groups get very spendy.

    One of the keys to small groups is consistency. This is where spending more on brass and bullets comes into play.

    Couldn't have said it better. But make sure that .308 rifle has a good trigger!
     

    shortround

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    You cannot load an accurate load unless the rifle is inherently accurate for that load.

    Start out with several commercial loadings, and see how they shoot.

    Work up your loads from there.

    Be well.
     

    Younggun

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    First steps, IMO, are finding the bullet and powder load it likes.

    Generally AMAX and SMKs work well for most rifles. Learn what ballistic coefficient means and try to find bullets with high BCs that your rifle likes to shoot. A good starting point are the 178gr Amax that was mentioned.

    Powder charge has to be tuned. Like mentioned, faster usually isn't better. I tend to find the sweet spot in the upper mid range. Your rifle may be completely different.

    Learn about the powders. Some don't like temperature swings, some handle them pretty well. Two schools of thought on testing. Load 1 round each on .2 gr increments, find where the rounds settle across several loads. Fine tune in that area by loading 5 rounds each of the charges that groups close.

    Once you get you charge down you can start tinkering with seating depth, and other small variables to see what it likes.

    Making a load that shoots well is easy, finding the perfect load takes a lot of patience, note taking, and time at the range.

    Make sure you have a good scope before you start, a steady shooting platform, and the skills needed to bring the groups together. If you can't tell where te round should have went when you squeeze the trigger, you can end up going in circles.
     

    wbstx11

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    Thanks all for the comments, and most of this is about what I expected, so good confirmation and does give me some priorities which is what I wanted! My scope is a Leupold VX-1 2-7; something of a compromise but I figured quality counts (Leupold) even if I can't afford the super-duper version. I have the trigger dialed down as far as the Ruger adjustment will go, but there is definitely a need here - I am used to light triggers on my pistols. I have already sorted the LC brass into batches by weight, so guess I am going correctly there. I grew up with iron sights, and this is my first 'scope rifle, really shows up the movement! I already have a selection of name brand bullets, mostly 150gr, so I need to add some heavier ones. I plan to start with minimum powder load and work up at 0.2 gr increments as suggested. Thanks all for your helpful advice.
     

    Dawico

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    Thanks all for the comments, and most of this is about what I expected, so good confirmation and does give me some priorities which is what I wanted! My scope is a Leupold VX-1 2-7; something of a compromise but I figured quality counts (Leupold) even if I can't afford the super-duper version. I have the trigger dialed down as far as the Ruger adjustment will go, but there is definitely a need here - I am used to light triggers on my pistols. I have already sorted the LC brass into batches by weight, so guess I am going correctly there. I grew up with iron sights, and this is my first 'scope rifle, really shows up the movement! I already have a selection of name brand bullets, mostly 150gr, so I need to add some heavier ones. I plan to start with minimum powder load and work up at 0.2 gr increments as suggested. Thanks all for your helpful advice.
    That is what we are here for.

    Definitely load the 150s up and see what they will do. Your rifle may love them.

    Longer ranges is where the heavier bullets really hold their own. The extra weight helps hold more energy and fight the wind better.
     

    popper

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    Your first post told you what the rifle likes, 165 SST. You could also try the Amax 168, which mine likes. Varget, H4895, ARcomp work well too. I'd get a better sizing die, look at the seater plug and fix it or get a better seater die, anneal the necks, M type expander, chamfer tool for the case necks and the Hornady PP uniformer. LC brass is good but the PPs need some work. Lee FCD is great but the rest is kinda shaky for accuracy.
     

    phatcyclist

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    When I was loading .308, I used Varget exclusively. I owned a few rifles in that chambering over the years, and the Varget was more than acceptable in all of them. I've had mixed luck with military brass, and you have to remember that 7.62 NATO cases are thicker, and actually have a slightly smaller case capacity than SAAMI spec .308 Winchester cases. I never weighed my brass.

    The first thing I always did when setting up for a new rifle, or when using a new projectile, was to full length size some cases, and set a projectile in the case, but quite a few hundredths out from specification. Then, I'd close the bolt slowly, allowing the rifling lead to push the projectile into the case. I'd then slowly open the bolt and very carefully remove the case/projectile. I may do this two or three times, because next I'd measure the OAL of the cartridge. I'd set my seating die up, to where the seater would just rest on the projectile. After that, I'd set the seater just a little deeper in, roughly 0.040 of an inch. Many people scoff at this method, but I've never owned the equipment to do this the 'professional' way, and it's still yielded great results. I never crimped my projectiles.

    I cannot speak of specific load data, because honestly it's been a while since I've even owned a .308 and cannot remember it. Not that you should ever trust someone's load data without referencing it in a few legitimate reloading manuals. I always used CCI primers, because my Lee Handloading book had loads for CCI brand primers. I started about 6/10ths of the way up between the lowest and highest load data, and worked up from there. As people have mentioned, the highest pressure loads generally don't produce the best accuracy, and I found that as well.

    I always loaded 165 grain Nosler BTs, because my rifles were mostly used for hunting, I did make some rounds with Nosler HPs in 168 grain (I think), and they were very accurate. My last scoped .308 rifle was a Tikka T3, and after just a little bit of work I was in the 3/4 M.O.A. range consistently.
     

    wbstx11

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    Range report on the RA 308. I loaded a spread of 4 bullets: Sierra HPBT Match 150 gr, Everglades "pulled" JHP Match 168 gr, Barnes TSX 165 gr, and Hornady AMAX 178 gr. Loaded a min/max spread of Varget for each in LC 11 (used military) and also Federal once fired as new from this rifle. The LC was FL sized, and all trimmed. I seated all to be 0.10 off the lands. Frankly, the results were disappointing. I could see no discernible pattern except for my crummy shooting! All rounds were within the 4" targets at the 100 yd range thankfully. I thought some of the higher charges walked to the right, but not enough pattern to confirm. The trigger was very frustrating, so I did what I've said I would not do, I bought a Timney. Tonite I put it in and set it for 1lb 10 oz., feels good and passes the safety checks - so now I am anxious to try it. Guess I'm too used to my handgun triggers. Maybe I need to focus on just getting good with commercial ammo before I go nuts on reloading work. Suggestions?
     

    Dawico

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    First off, Ruger rifles have never been known for their superb accuracy.

    Second off, pick a bullet. You have too many variables.

    Third, how many loads did you load for each bullet? Hkw many rounds in each powder weight group?

    Fourth, seat the bullets to max COAL while testing. Some rifles do not like bullets seated near the lands.

    Fifth, did you weigh the cases and group similiar weights together?

    Sixth, LC brass sucks.

    Seventh, did I mention you have too many variables?

    Eighth, just reading that it sounds like you fired 200 rounds. That is never good for group testing.
     

    smschulz

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    My question is: to focus onaccuracy, where would you start? – what are some of the key issues to make priorities?

    Measure everything multiple times.
    Document everything.
    Don't forget to chrono the loads.
    Be consistent.
    You'll eventually find the right load.
    Varget is a great choice.
     

    A.Texas.Yankee

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    First off, Ruger rifles have never been known for their superb accuracy.

    Second off, pick a bullet. You have too many variables.

    Third, how many loads did you load for each bullet? Hkw many rounds in each powder weight group?

    Fourth, seat the bullets to max COAL while testing. Some rifles do not like bullets seated near the lands.

    Fifth, did you weigh the cases and group similiar weights together?

    Sixth, LC brass sucks.

    Seventh, did I mention you have too many variables?

    Eighth, just reading that it sounds like you fired 200 rounds. That is never good for group testing.

    Ruger American rifles are very accurate for their cost. Probably one of the best sub $500 rifles. Although, I only have personal experience with the .308 and .270 calibers, but both were right at or under moa out of the box with good factory ammo @ 100 yds. My customers have had similar experiences.

    Past that, I agree with the rest. If you really want consistent loads, take the variables away. Start with new, unfired brass of same lot / manufacturer.

    I typically can tell a bad load combination after ten rounds, but fine tuning can take much longer. Unless you're my business partner who got dime size groups on his 7mm-mag first load test. Jerk.
     

    scap99

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    Ruger American rifles are very accurate for their cost. Probably one of the best sub $500 rifles. Although, I only have personal experience with the .308 and .270 calibers, but both were right at or under moa out of the box with good factory ammo @ 100 yds. My customers have had similar experiences.

    Past that, I agree with the rest. If you really want consistent loads, take the variables away. Start with new, unfired brass of same lot / manufacturer.

    I typically can tell a bad load combination after ten rounds, but fine tuning can take much longer. Unless you're my business partner who got dime size groups on his 7mm-mag first load test. Jerk.
    I guess I'm spoiled. 1 moa would piss me off.

    Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
     

    wbstx11

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    Thanks guys for the comments, some real good stuff here - and it already occurred to me I had WAY too many variables - but thought I'd try it to see if anything jumped out. Also, the mark of a real passionate group is when you ask a question to 5 people and 7 people give you 10 different answers (with a smile). I appreciate the constructive comments. This is a hobby for me - and a challenge to see how accurate I can get with what I have. I don't have a goal of sub-MOA accuracy - just the best I can get with this RA308. Frankly, I like Ruger - certainly not a hand made super accurate piece, but good for a $300 rifle - dependable low cost basic rifle. Better accuracy out of the box than the M16-A1 I carried in Viet Nam, but then I think that old service M-1 I shot in US Army training was probably pretty dam good. At least I shot 100% with it.
     
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