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Oh... CRAP!! Sold Pistol Used In a Crime

Discussion in 'Stolen Property & Criminality' started by Mike1234567, Jul 28, 2016.

  1. pronstar

    pronstar Well-Known TGT Supporter

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    ...and it Berns when I pee


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  2. SQLGeek

    SQLGeek Active Member

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    @pronstar if your friend wants to take a lowballl offer on the PS90, I'll take the hit and do the FFL. But putting my name on forms isn't cheap. :D
     
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  3. pronstar

    pronstar Well-Known TGT Supporter

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    I'll post up if/when it gets to that point


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  4. A & P Armory

    A & P Armory Active Member

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    Seems pretty well resolved, but just to clarify if there are any inconsistencies:

    A dealer has to fill out a multi-gun sale form for two or more handguns in a 5 day rolling window. If you buy one today and one in 4 days, multi-gun sale. If you buy another one in 3 days, another multi-gun sale (and you reference that it was part of another multi-sale...). The customer doesn't do anything. It's for the dealer to do. We have to fax it by the end of the business day to sheriff and ATF.

    A dealer has to fill out a multi-gun sale for "certain types of rifles" (basically AR/AK types...not hunting rifles or bolt action. just the evil ones). Same concept. 5 days. But we only have to tell ATF. No LE notification. I didn't know until reading here that it was just for bordering states. This is our only store so I didn't know it wasn't nationwide. So Obama loses a bunch of guns and now I have extra paperwork for it. Nice. Ass.

    Our store offers, and the ATF recommends, doing a "private-party sale 4473". So we do the background check for you just as if we sold the gun. That removes liability from you to the same level that we get in the sense that what else could you do? We did NICS or otherwise documented the sale. We charge $25 just like a transfer. If you're wound up about not having your name on documents, this isn't for you. But the new 4473 even has a place to mark "facilitate private party transfer". Basically it means the item wasn't ever in our inventory but we were helping with background checking. The alternative solution is to not sell to anyone without a CHL/LTC because they skip the NICS check anyway. You're using the same prudence a dealer would.

    We have to keep 4473s for 20 years. If we go out of business, as someone said, F Troop gets our records. Cancelled or denied 4473 is 5 years. That's why dealers should charge you for filling out 4473s and then maybe apply it to the purchase. It takes time and we have to keep paperwork even on a denial. Time is money.

    We've had 3 traces so far. They find a gun, call the manf, then the distro the manf sold to, then the dealer the distro sold to... We had one guy buy a gun for his son and a few weeks later it showed up at a burglary. Another guy killed himself with a gun we sold. And another one was found somewhere and not sure of the story behind it. So the guns are kind of registered in the sense that I have to know who I sold them to. But it's not registration in the sense that you have to put your social security, keep your address current, update it when you sell it, etc. And we keep it all on paper so it's not in a federal registry (except NFA items). Call it quasi-registration.

    I also learned that pawn shops have a hard time doing transfers. I think a pawn owner told me they have to keep used/transferred/sold guns for 3 weeks before releasing them because they have to give 5-0 a chance to find stolen goods. Regular FFLs (01 dealer/07 manufacturer) don't have that restriction. Pawnshops are actually type 02 FFLs.

    Finally, dumbest rule in ATF land: if you consign a gun with us, you have to do a 4473 to get your own gun back. But if you drop it off for repair, you can pick it up without doing any paperwork and even have someone else pick it up for you (but the someone else does have to do a 4473 and skip 11a)! Where's the logic in that!?
     
  5. SloppyShooter

    SloppyShooter Certifiable

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    Your tax dollars at work. Sheesh!!! Excuse me sir....just one more thing....
     
  6. Kar98

    Kar98 Well-Known

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    Obviously I'm neither a dealer nor a gunsmith, so the following is just from my side of the counter, the customer side:
    One gun I left with a gunsmith for some repair and got back after several days, I didn't have to fill out anything to get it back other than signing the sales receipt.
    And the range told me as long as it doesn't stay overnight, no 4473, because only if it stays overnight they have to sign it in and back out.
     
  7. SloppyShooter

    SloppyShooter Certifiable

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    I really hate the fact I pawned an untraceable gun....not untraceable anymore!
     
  8. SloppyShooter

    SloppyShooter Certifiable

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    Yeah ...but tha
    Yeah, but that's your gun...why in the WIDE WORLD OF SPORTS would you have to? Crap, I don't have to do a title change to get a brake job done.
     
  9. Kar98

    Kar98 Well-Known

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    Right? Like signing over your car title to Firestone when getting your brakes done, LOL.
     
  10. hoghunting

    hoghunting Active Member

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    That might depend on city or county laws as I used a pawn shop for transfers many times as they charged less than gun stores, and the firearm was transferred to me the same day the shop received it.
     


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