Patriot Arms - Galveston -- BEWARE!

[Kincaid]

I just had a very unpleasant experience with the owner of Patriot. Been in Tx a year, had a gun shipped to his shop - charged me $250 to transfer it to me upon arrival! Does not like Yankees - very prejudice and argumentive - even invoked the name of the President in a very rude manner. Go elsewhere!!!!!

 

[512Ram]

what?!!? $250 FFL fee?

Did you not inquire about their fee before you had the gun shipped to them? The highest i've heard of so far is $50.

 

[Texas1911]

There is more to this story...

 

[Kincaid]

Actually, when you boil it down - there is no more to this story. Unless you want to involve the ATF stepping in - do you?? I was charged $250 to transfer my own gun back to my possession. Unless this FFL has a special fee for Yankees, or for people he suspects voted for Obama (I didn't) it boils down to -- $250 to transfer my handgun back to my possession.

 

[dbgun]

$250 to transfer my handgun back to my possession.

What kind of handgun is it?

 

[juwaba98]

The ATF doesn't set a transfer fee. The shop does so I don't see how the ATF involvement will help you.

Also, please be careful with your tone, especially when directed at the owner of this forum who has no affiliation with the store in question.

 

[Kincaid]

Patriot Arms

Sorry - meant no disrespect to the owner/manager of this forum. I just had a very unpleasant experience. Had to call the ATF down from Houston to get the gun released. Owner relented - but - nailed me with a $250 transfer fee as final insult. I can file a complaint with the ATF even if they have no direct regulatory authority - they keep files. I also filed with the BBB. See, this person not only gouged, but was very abusive and insulting in the process.

 

[Kincaid]

It was a Bond Firearms "Ranger" model - .410/.45

 

[Texas1911]

All I am saying is there are always 2 sides to the story.

I work in a gun store in Austin. I'm aware of how things transpire many times.

 

[Kincaid]

Yes, you are correct, there is more from his perspective I'm sure. But, Sir, the bottom line is the man is in business to provide a licensed service. It isn 't his job to judge, be argumentative, verbally abuse, etc. A firearm showed up at his place of business, he knew before hand it was coming, there was a question of residency - that's it. Instead of working with me, looking at my 10 months of rent receipts, asking for some guidance from the ATF (if needed), he set out on some sort of personal attack. I'm 61 years old, a veteran, licensed to carry a concealed weapon (Pennsylvania - reciprocal in TX), multiple gun owner, federal employee - I'm not a criminal. Fortunately, for me, I met a reasonable ATF Agent who in 15 minutes cleared up the situation. My take is that this FFL didnt like it and charged me a punitive fee of $250 to transfer my gun back to my possession. That's the story.

 

[Texas1911]

It's actually his job to judge. It's the moral and legal duty of an FFL holder to do what he can to assure that guns are not illegally handed over to criminals. It's his duty because he faces extreme penalties for not upholding the law. Verbally abusive, etc. is generally the measure of a person. I don't know him, or you, so I can't comment on that.

I think in this instance that it's somewhat apparent that you aren't a criminal. I'm not quite sure why he would react in this manner, which is what leads me to assume that there is more to the story. If it's prejudice, then so be it.

I think $250 is exorbitant in either regards.

 

[accumack]

why didn't you bring your guns in your vehicle when you moved?

 

[SC-Texas]

Why didn't you simply have the FFL send it back where it came from and then have it resent to Jenn at Texas Tactical or the Armory in League City?

There is some more to this story.

1. Your ID says you are a Pennsylvania resident
2. Your CHL says you are a Pennsylvania resident
3. You have rent receipts that show that you are current;y living in Texas, but you have not bothered to follow state law and get a TX DL or CHL.
4. You asked the FFL to transfer a handgun to someone who appears to reside in a state that is not contiguous to Texas. This is a potential landmine for the FFL.

All that says that I, as an FFL would be very leery of transferring a firearms to you.

That said, if you didn't like the fee, why didn't you simply 1) have the FFL return it to the FFL that sent it to him.

2) file a suit in small claims court, they do have those in Galveston and it only costs around $50.00.

Just wondering.

 

[bvillars]

wtf

aperson tells his story, gets a rude reply, he answers back in the same tone and then is chastised. hmmm

 

[Kincaid]

I know it's the FFL's job to judge as far as my background, etc. I am a federal employee that has been in TX over a year now. I own a home in PA, but work down here. True, I have not taken the initiative to change my drivers license. There was, no doubt, some extenuating circumstances and challenges - but - I'm a reasonable person and could accept a reasonably conclusion to this episode. But, this owner/FFL was completely unreasonable, abusive in his tone and argumentative as to why I wanted the gun, where I was "from", maybe that's the way you do business in PA, and Obama will change everything if we don't watch out - off the wall - completely off the wall. Finally, I asked him to please call the ATF in Houston. I met the Agent, explained my dilemma and he told me that no laws were broken, and a "reasonable" FFL would have not made a federal case out of this situation. He took all my information, and called me within an hour (30 min drive to store from Texas City) and told me to come get my gun. The owner was there - not at all happy that he couldn't confiscate the gun, ATF even "suggested" charging me $50, to which he replied -- "I'm charging him $250" -- I didn't say a word, paid the charge and got the hell out of his store. But - I filed a complaint with the BBB and I will file a formal written complaint with the ATF.
That's the story. Just a 61 year old guy, wanting his gun. Some curves in the road, yes - but, nothing a reasonable FFL couldn't figure out and handle.

 

[navyguy]

Only a fly on the wall would know what actually happened. I'm not suggesting the OP is lying, but sometimes people don't realize how the tone of their voice, or body posture translates. Apparently something happened between the two people involved.

 

[SC-Texas]

aperson tells his story, gets a rude reply, he answers back in the same tone and then is chastised. hmmm

My reply was not meant to be rude in any manner.

If it was taken as rude, then I apologize.

 

[Kincaid]

I'm not taking any of this as rude exchanges - I'm not a rude or argumentative person. I'm a federal employee that has been on the enforcement side, now in administration. I met a person that is in business to provide a service - I provided a twist to the norm, I admit. But, this business person became very agitated and quite frankly was not rational. Several times I asked him to call the ATF for guidance and a ruling. Several times he told me he was going to confiscate the gun - finally he agreed to call the ATF. The ATF took 30 minutes to bring this to conclusion. Then, he charges me $250. You tell me who's wrong. Is there any justification for that kind of charge? You guys tell me - as FFL's - is there ever a reason (other than retaliation, prejudice, etc..) to gouge for that service?

 

[juwaba98]

Then, he charges me $250. You tell me who's wrong. Is there any justification for that kind of charge? You guys tell me - as FFL's - is there ever a reason (other than retaliation, prejudice, etc..) to gouge for that service?

In my opinion, no. There was no reason for a charge anywhere near that much. I am not an FFL, but I do not see why any FFL would feel justified to charge that even if you were the rudest, most beligirent, foul-mouthed person to ever darken the door.

I'm still not placing blame anywhere though. The situation sucks but I don't feel there's enough info available either. There is a simple matter of claiming residency but not adhering to the laws required to do so i.e. obtain a valid DL within 90 days, vehicle registration is also the same I believe.

Bottom line for me is ATF helped you clear it up, you got your gun and have now raised awareness of possible questionable business practices. All in all that's pretty much all you could hope for.

 

[Kincaid]

Right. That's all I'm raising - questionable business practices. I wasn't the 100% clean business at his doorstep. I had issues and I knew it. A reasonable person would have worked with me even if it meant returning it to Pennsy. ATF cleared up the issue. All's well that ends well - except for the $250 ($270.65 with tax!) transfer fee.