Revolver Shotshell ammo from .357 Maximum cases.

[motorcarman]

Revolver Shotshell ammo from .357 Maximum cases.


I have looked for the plastic shotshell cases (Speer #8780) for a while now and they are all backordered. I have Copperheads in my rural area pretty much all summer. I needed an alternative for the always handy Smith & Wesson Revolver.

I took some .357 Maximum empties because they are near the exact length of a .38 Special cylinder (1.60”). They won’t fit for the same reason that .357 Magnum won’t fit.

.38 Special means the CASE is .380”, the bullet is .357” or .358”.

If I could get a slight ‘shoulder’ to the case it would fit into the cylinder.

I first annealed the case mouth ends.

I sized/deprimed with .357 die but needed any case length past 1.15” (The last .450”) to be less than .360” to fit the cylinder throat.

I have a LEE 32-20 reload die set and the case mouth die (with the case bell mouth insert removed) reduced the case end to about .365”. I only needed to insert the case .450” into the die.

I was getting close but needed a slightly smaller diameter.

The LEE 32-20 bullet seat die from the same die set sized it to just under .360”.

(I inserted the cases into the bullet seat die the SAME .450”).

All the cases now fit the .38 Special cylinder!!!!!!!!!!!!

I primed the cases and charged them with 5.5 gr. of Unique.

Put a cardboard or felt wad on top of the powder.

Pour in #9 shot to within a few millimeters of the top and install a thin cardboard cut with a hole punch.

Add some hot glue level with the mouth and you are done.

The Dan Wesson 360 cases are somewhat shorter and hold less shot but can be used as well.

bob

 

[Dawico]

How did they perform?

Sounds like some good improvising to make what you needed.

 

[motorcarman]

I just finished 20 and I have not seen a Copperhead yet this evening.
Neighbor just shot one yesterday so I guess it's my turn next??
I might just 'pop' one off to see the pattern.

bob

 

[lonestardiver]

It is worth it to set up some paper plates and what you consider normal copperhead distances...

 

[BRD@66]

^ I'd need that Canadian sniper to make that shot.

 

[motorcarman]

I shot a 'test-round' yesterday and got a 6" circle at about 8 feet.
I usually try to get a little closer than that but just wanted a MAX range test.
S&W Model 10-8 with a 4" heavy barrel. Should be good for 'shredded copperhead'.

bob

 

[Dawico]

I shot a 'test-round' yesterday and got a 6" circle at about 8 feet.
I usually try to get a little closer than that but just wanted a MAX range test.
S&W Model 10-8 with a 4" heavy barrel. Should be good for 'shredded copperhead'.

bob

Much better than the shot shells. Sounds like it will work.

 

[Henryseale]

I found this website and thread after doing a Google search for this exact topic. I am interested in making some shot loads for my .357 Mag using .357 Max brass. I have been trying to figure out how to downsize the ends of the Max brass so it will fit in the Mag chamber. I have a Lee .357 bullet sizing die that I tried compressing the ends of the Max brass with. This did not work so well. I also disassembled a Lee .223 sizing die and tried using that as well with unsatisfactory results. I see in the original post it was mentioned annealing the brass first. I have never done that, but it is my understanding that this will make the brass a bit softer and easier to resize. Could you please give some tips as to how to do this properly? Also your thoughts on using the bullet sizing die or the .223 die to resize with? Or, do I need to get a .32/20 die set to do this? Since I have no .32/20, I hate to buy a die set just for this. I checked a few suppliers and was not able to find anyone that sells just the seating die. Any advice/instructions would be appreciated.

 

[lonestardiver]

If you never intend to use the .357max brass for that purpose anymore, you can trim it down a little bit. Likely that little bit or freebore in the cylinder/forcing cone shouldn't be an issue if you used .357mag brass. Using a fast powder should leave plenty of room. I know I had used bullseye with the Speer shot capsules in .38 special brass. Didn't take a whole lot.

 

[motorcarman]

The problem with trimming the brass is that you lose shot capacity!!! The WHOLE IDEA is to have that LONG CASE!!!!!!!!!!!! The Speer/CCI plastic shotshells are NLA (No Longer Available). All the places that list them are "OUT OF STOCK, NO BACK ORDER".

I explained in detail how to 'neckdown' the case end. You do not need to neck the case as much as the .38 Special because the .357 case is 1/10" longer. You will only need to insert the case .350" into a size die because the cylinder will accept the longer case.

You will need to get the last .350" of the .357 MAXIMUM case to just under .360".

A sized .357 MAX case should be around .375" along the entire length. Then size the case mouth down to under .360".

I did it in 2 stages (.365" and then .358") so as not to get a crushed case or get it stuck in a die.

I have about 50 die sets for all my firearms/calibers I reload for so I tried many until I found some that worked.

Here is a LEE die set for sale on the internet.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/90751-LEE-S...182281&hash=item339e678b8b:g:25sAAOSwfpVZEfI2

I have 100 .357 Maximum cases and I converted 20. Once sized, I don't think you will need to size them again because a once-fired shell will not really expand much with the small amount of pressure generated with the poor seal that shot provides. I shot one and the empty case dropped right back in the cylinder. I just reprimed and reloaded it.

You could find someone with a 32 20 set or something similar and borrow it.
You could buy the 32 20 set and resell it (at a loss being USED) and try to recoup some of the investment??

There might be other ways to 'squeeze' the case mouth to just under .360".
I just did it this way.

bob

 

[Henryseale]

I tried my hand at annealing tonight for the first time and afterwards was able to get the .357 Max brass sized down enough using a .357 bullet sizing die to fit in my .357 Mag chambers. I loaded up six shotshell loads using the Max brass, 5.5 gr. of Unique, and some #12 shot - approx 116 gr. I also loaded six .38 Spl. brass with the same powder charge using some Speer shot capsules with approx 108 gr. of #12 shot. I was somewhat surprised that there was only about a 10 gr. advantage using the Max brass over the shot capsules. Hopefully, I will be able to get out to my local shooting range to try them out and compare Sunday afternoon. I am curious if there will be a problem with excessive leading.

 

[motorcarman]

Where did you find the shotshell capsules????
Did you get them lately or were they purchased a while ago?
The 44 and 45 are still available but I cannot find the .38 size (#8780).

bob

 

[Henryseale]

A nice fellow from another message board that I frequent, "24 Hour Campfire", saw in a discussion about this that I was looking for some capsules. I had lamented that I had tried locally to no avail and also tried on line at Graf & Sons, Midway, Mid-South Shooter's Supply, Natchez Shooter's Supply, Bass Pro Shops, Cabela's, Academy, etc., and was so far unable to locate any. He had some stashed from a few years ago and sent them to me. If I could find some for sale, I sure would like to buy a couple of boxes to have on hand.

I was able to get over to the range this afternoon to try them out. I shot two of the loads made from modified .357 Maximum brass with small rifle primer & 5.5 grains of Unique and two of the loaded capsules using .38 Special brass with regular small pistol primer & 5.5 grains of Unique. .37 Maximum brass were loaded with 116 grains of #12 shot. .38 Special capsules were loaded with 108 grains of #12 shot. The .357 Maximum loads patterned well 12-14 inches at 7 yards and the .38 Special capsules patterned well 10-12 inches at 7 yards. This was with a S&W M-19 .357 Mag. with a 4 inch barrel. In my opinion, modifying the .357 Maximum brass to make these is a good way to go after you initially get the brass modified, if you are unable to find the capsules. Having said that, if you can find the capsules, that is by far the best way to go as there is not that much improvement that I see in the pattern size/density. Just loading the capsules are a LOT easier than modifying .357 Maximum brass to only get about 8 grains more shot in the load. On the other hand, once you have the modified Maximum brass, you are set for the future.

BTW - as a tip, I was only able to find .357 Maximum brass online and not locally. Several suppliers have it, but the best deal I found was 100 pieces of Remington brass from Cabela's for about $35 with free shipping.

 

[motorcarman]

Another advantage of the .357 Max cases is that they are LESS FRAGILE!!!!
The plastic capsules can be smashed/damaged with rough handling.

I do keep my eye out for the #8780s and I would buy boxes if I ever found them.

bob

 

[motorcarman]

Stupid Copperhead got too close the house.
My Louisiana Catahoula Leopard Dog found a Copperhead against the wall near the dog door to the house. She did not get bit but my wife saw it and called for the snakeshot revolver.

The .357 Max cases did an outstanding job.

I think the feral cats down at the barn are feasting on the shredded meat.

bob

 

[motorcarman]

Copperhead Hunter!!!!!!

I got my 3rd one last night. Shredded the upper 3" near the head.
Neighbor lady got 2 in the last week. OVERRUN??????

bob

 

[motorcarman]

I think I need to re-reload. #4 around 9 tonite. Running low. Might need to have a copperhead roundup like they do for rattlesnakes in Sweetwater??

bob

 

[robertc1024]

Damn. At least you're getting a lot of good use out of those shotshells.

 

[deemus]

Where did you find the shotshell capsules????
Did you get them lately or were they purchased a while ago?
The 44 and 45 are still available but I cannot find the .38 size (#8780).

bob

https://www.cabelas.com/product/CCI-CAPSULES-W-BASE-PLUG/1883560.uts

 

[jrbfishn]

When they have them, I order several boxes.

Sent by an idjit coffeeholic from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk