Rifle type used in school massacre ‘designed to kill multiple enemy combatants at once’

[avvidclif]

Ar

Never heard of APC before today.

Armored Personnel Carrier

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Ar

Armored Personnel Carrier

See post 71.

 

[karlac]

Sent Cornyn an email reminding him that he was not elected by the Citizens of Texas to join the liberals in their knee jerk pressure to dilute his constituent's Constitutional Second Amendment rights.

Waste of time, but what the hell ...

https://www.cornyn.senate.gov/contact

 

[DwnRange]

See, I told you my keyboard makes mistakes. It has dyslexia.

hummm...., ain't that similar to liberals blaming guns for killing people - instead of blaming the people?

Perhaps ya should just tighten up the loose "nut" between the seat and the steering wheel on that thing, (or take a minute to read what ya wrote by hitting "preview" before hitting the "post reply" button)

 

[Wildcat Diva]

Hey, I learned about the preview button!!!

 

[TAZ]

At what point do we say "Enough!"? When can we as gun owners look at what is available and wonder, is this worth it? Do I think we should have the right to bear arms, absolutely! But when does our advancement in firearms technology need to be reigned in? We don't sell automatic weapons to just everyone, why is that? Why do we then allow the technology to circumvent that restriction?

I'll repeat, the shootings are getting worse, and more frequent. Last I checked we don't have Tom Cruise being able to stop future crime. So what can we do about it? Do we just shrug our shoulders one more time and flip the page?

There are folks here much more learned in the culture than I, and what you think CAN be done?

The majority of questions you post are great. However, when you add questions about limiting firearms, firearms tech, magazine capacity you come across as someone who has already made a decision and are looking to nudge the argument towards gun control.

Why not other actions instead that will have greater impact on all crime (out of which guns aren’t the biggest contributor)? Why did we close mental health facilities and kick the disturbed to the curb and into the criminal justice system? Why do we have a criminal justice system that refuses to remove criminals from circulation? Why do we have an education system that places the needs of disruptive students above regular kids? Why do we have an educational system that has ZERO discipline? Why do we have parents who abdicate their duties as parents to the school? Why do we have a generation if kids who interact via avatars instead of FtF? Why do we have a generation with no compassion? Why do we have violent video games? Why do we have violent “entertainment” everywhere? Why do we have media that glamorizes these abhorrent individuals? Why do we have social media that allows glamorization of abhorrent individuals and their behavior? Why do we have a medical system that behaves more like a pill mill supporting pharmaceutical companies than scientists looking for solutions? Why do we have impotent politicians grand standing instead of looking for root cause solutions instead of symptom chasing?

Guns are a symptom. Guns haven’t changed significantly in close to a hundred years. Automatic and semi automatic guns have been around since turn of the century and people had access to them like ordering tools from amazon. Oddly they didn’t shoot each other to smithereens often. Why? You’d figure that with ANYONE being able to purchase them society would have been a bloody mess. But it wasn’t. Why?

We have a people problem. Until you solve that these crazy people who should have been removed from circulation will figure out a way to act out their crazy ideas. Be that with pressure cookers packed with home made bombs or trucks mowing down shoppers or crashing airplanes into buildings. Solve the people problem and help or address the symptom and loose when the symptom changes.

 

[Charlie]

"Like"

 

[easy rider]

A lot of good questions, unfortunately I think society in general has gotten so far beyond a point of reasoning, that any real solutions would be met with a lot of resistance. Too many thinking about "me" rather than thinking about "us" as a whole.

 

[benenglish]

Guns haven’t changed significantly in close to a hundred years. Automatic and semi automatic guns have been around since turn of the century and people had access to them like ordering tools from amazon. Oddly they didn’t shoot each other to smithereens often.

Interesting (to me) sidebar -

Back 100-120 years ago, armies had switched to bolt action rifles. Like today with ARs, the bolt action had entered the consciousness of shooters as a normal rifle, one they'd been exposed to in the military. When they got out of the military or if they were just plugged into "gun culture", folks started buying bolt action rifles.

No big deal, right?

Nope. What's happening today happened back then.

There are some (in retrospect) hilarious editorials to be found in the archives of New York newspapers from over 100 years ago talking about the fact that bolt action rifles should be banned because they were killing machines, designed for the military, and no private citizen had any need for one.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

 

[seeker_two]

The only necessary feature needed to commit a mass murder is a mass murderer.....the rest can be interchanged with little change in intent.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

 

[jrbfishn]

Or weapon used.

Sent by an idjit coffeeholic from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

 

[CptnRn]

I think some of y'all are talking past each other.

50-100 years ago, "an automatic" was common language used to refer to a semi-automatic pistol. Everyone knew the difference between full- and semi-, even if the terminology was sometimes imprecise.

You'll even run across the occasional oldtimer these days who still calls a 1911 an automatic. They're not wrong; they're just using outdated language that sounds wrong to our modern ears.

Shall we cut each other a break?

Yup! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semi-automatic_pistol#Terminology

Terminology:

The language surrounding automatic, semi-automatic, self-loading, etc., often causes confusion due to differences in technical usage between different countries and differences in popular usage. For example, the term "automatic pistol" technically refers to a machine pistol which is capable of firing multiple round bursts for a single pull of the trigger, although in popular US usage it is also used as a synonym for a semi-automatic pistol. In the case of pistols, an 'automatic pistol', a 'semi-automatic pistol', or a 'self-loading pistol', all usually imply a handgun that is semi-automatic, self-loading, and magazine-fed with a magazine that is removable, producing one shot fired for each trigger pull. The term pistol may refer to handguns in general, or may be used to differentiate (semi-automatic) pistols from revolvers.

I'm sure in 1892 when it first came out it seemed highly automatic in comparison to earlier handguns.

The Schönberger-Laumann 1892 was the first semi-automatic pistol.

 

[avvidclif]

Copied from another forum:

"I was trying to logically investigate what would make these children do such things as these shootings. I would think we could agree that separate from the issue of guns is the fact that the guns did not make these kids kill people, something else did. It is really just another aspect that should be looked at but is never done. Too much heated rhetoric on gums to just look logically."

One of the best responses I've seen in a long time.

 

[Wildcat Diva]

One of the Sandy Hook victim’s mother came up with this program to address the socio-cognitive-emotional problems of children who don’t learn to connect.
https://www.jesselewischooselove.org/
It’s a good idea for a plan. Right idea to target this in a way. Have not seen the details but I bet it’s good. Will probably download it.

Just that I think this concept works better coming from parents at home, (which is where my children stayed.). We took our chances with homeschool and it’s not the best result but I’m honestly really glad we did.

We interface enough with this f-ed up society; think we are better on our own hand-selecting who we (me and ours) want to spend hours and hours learning from and with and who to give up our control to.

 

[CptnRn]

I think we make a huge mistake when we allow these events to focus us in the type of rifle that was used. I doubt the results would have been significantly different had the shooter used a 5 round .30-06 Springflied, which has been in common use since 1903, in WW1 and WW2, or any other hunting rifle. The actual problem we are faced with here is a mental health crises that we are not dealing with. And when alerted to the potential problems, as the FBI was, nothing was actually done about it. If AR-15s are outlawed, the perpetrators are just going to find some other weapon to use, be it an AR-15 or a fertilizer bomb. Until we deal with the mental health problems, these kinds of events are just going to continue.

 

[Dinoble1]

Finally getting to the root of the problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Churchmouse]

Getting to the root cause of societal decline will not further their agenda. You know, the total disarming of the population.
To effect any real change would require well over half the population to admit they are doing it wrong and effect the needed changes. That would be seriously hard. It is far easier to gather in groups and carry signs.

 

[diesel1959]

I think some of y'all are talking past each other.

50-100 years ago, "an automatic" was common language used to refer to a semi-automatic pistol. Everyone knew the difference between full- and semi-, even if the terminology was sometimes imprecise.

You'll even run across the occasional oldtimer these days who still calls a 1911 an automatic. They're not wrong; they're just using outdated language that sounds wrong to our modern ears.

Shall we cut each other a break?

yep. that same oldtimer would also be as likely to refer to it as an autoloader. or somesuch. :cheers:

 

[diesel1959]

Interesting (to me) sidebar -

Back 100-120 years ago, armies had switched to bolt action rifles. Like today with ARs, the bolt action had entered the consciousness of shooters as a normal rifle, one they'd been exposed to in the military. When they got out of the military or if they were just plugged into "gun culture", folks started buying bolt action rifles.

No big deal, right?

Nope. What's happening today happened back then.

There are some (in retrospect) hilarious editorials to be found in the archives of New York newspapers from over 100 years ago talking about the fact that bolt action rifles should be banned because they were killing machines, designed for the military, and no private citizen had any need for one.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Ben, I copied the body of this post on another forum I belong to. :cheers:

 

[Inspector43]

Those driving the political and media agendas refuse address root causes. I think the culture change is driven by the content of TV, movies and video games. Turn on the TV any night and see actors with high volume weapons and explosives shooting up and blowing up entire neighborhoods. NCIS-NO starts with a song boom boom boom boom, bang bang bang bang and bullets fly everywhere. NCIS-LA, SWAT, Hawaii 50, just to name a few, are all about how many bullets can be fired in a 60 minute show. And, how much stuff they can blow up. Let's get our efforts pointed at root causes.