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  • 308nato

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    Iam sorry but that man will never have my respect as he was a part of the corrupt Chicago political machine.
    Thats all I have to say about it .
    Oh and I want to see a genuine legal birth certificate not that Hawian
    piece of paper.
     

    Grog

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    He serves us ... not the other way around. In the military it's different, but this isn't the military. As was said before, he has to prove himself before respect is garnered, but on the same token it's asinine to wish failure on someone with so much control over the country.

    +1

    I agree with that. I wish him the best because his success is my success. If he fails, then it sux for all of us.

    But I'll respect him when he proves his merit.

    So far I haven't had a President in my life that I think did a good job. Or earned my respect.

    Last good one I remember from my history books was Jackson.

    Grog
     

    lonewolf23c

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    Just when I think it's safe to start paying my debt down quicker, stuff like this just reassures me that all my extra money is better spent buying guns and ammo. ;)

    I have the same problem. I paid off my only credit card last summer, and now its close to maxed out again just from ammo and gun purchases.
     

    Gonyea

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    +1

    I agree with that. I wish him the best because his success is my success. If he fails, then it sux for all of us.

    But I'll respect him when he proves his merit.

    So far I haven't had a President in my life that I think did a good job. Or earned my respect.

    Last good one I remember from my history books was Jackson.

    Grog
    Maybe we need to brush up on our history... There have been several amazing presidents since andrew Jackson (although this is just a matter of opinion) in fact some of our greatest Lincoln certainly fits the mold by bringing a torn country back together if Booth wasn't a moron and had to shoot him the reconstruction would have been succesfull and we would not have had to deal with nearly the civil rights issues as we have in the last 140 years to include Plessy V. Fergussen and Brown V Board of education. How about Harry S. Truman not only did he have to make the biggest and one of the hardest single decisions of all time but after WWII he saw out the succesfull reconstruction of all of Europe to include the industrial powerhouse West Germany and he saw out the creation of the Japan as we know it today... The last i will point out is Ronald Wilson Reagan. I really shouldn't have to go into this but i will... Every Piece of gear I use today in the Marine Corps i can attribute to Big Ron all of our advanced weapon systems are from his Star Wars system... He was a huge supporter of the 2nd ammendment... He crushed the Soviet Union... and The flourishing economic boom we saw in the 80's and 90's can be attributed to Reaganomics. Please don't tell me there have not been good Presidents since Jackson if thats the case move to Canada.
    Further More I will say that after meeting Former President Bush... Although his Presidency was tarnished never in my life have I met a more genuine man nor is there someone more humble or moral... I told him where i was from and here is his quote "Oh Hopkins County I love that Area East Texas is beautiful" then I invited him to my parents ranch and he jokingly told me that he had a ranch of his own. A great Man and a great Commander in Chief.
     

    M. Sage

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    Respect for someone that merely has a title is the same mindset behind tyrannical monarchies. Obama is a paid employee of this country, he should respect us for allowing him the position, and he should act on the will of the country.

    He serves us ... not the other way around. In the military it's different, but this isn't the military. As was said before, he has to prove himself before respect is garnered, but on the same token it's asinine to wish failure on someone with so much control over the country.

    I like it!

    I hope the Obama presidency succeeds for the nation. I do feel, though, that to do this, he'll have to fail at all of his personal and party goals (universal health care, tax increases, gun control, fairness doctrine, etc.)

    It scares me that he's been billed as the next Abe Lincoln. Lincoln was one of the worst presidents.
     

    SIG_Fiend

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    How do you figure


    He was responsible for causing the Civil War. Despite what public school history lessons teach our kids, the truth of the matter is Lincoln usurped quite a few consitutional rights and far exceeded his authority with some of the things he did. The fact of the matter is, at the time, the northern states were basically bullying the southern states into falling inline and complying with many things the northern states wanted them to do. Basically the northern states and federal government at the time were trying to tell the southern states how to "conduct business". Because the southern states resisted and wanted to do their own thing, the northern states and federal government basically waged sort of a quiet economical war against the southern states through the use of oppressive tariffs, taxes, and various other things I can't remember. Basically what it all boils down to is the southern states wanted the freedom to run their own respective economies how they saw fit, federal government and northern states didn't like this so they worked towards destruction of the economies of the southern states through political and economical means. Things became bad enough economically in the south that they basically forced us to go to war otherwise the southern economies would have been practically destroyed.

    The sad part is most children in our public school system are lead to believe Lincoln was this great person, the civil war was about ending slavery and nothing else, and that everyone in the south was nothing except for racists and slave owners. I will tell you this much, Lincoln was not a good person, and he was indeed a racist himself. The man was responsible for bringing down our nation's army on it's own people, and there were several incidences where he was ultimately responsible in the slaughter of many innocent people. He violated many civil rights with his actions.
     

    Gonyea

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    These statements are border line of "one mans terroritst is another mans freedom fighter."

    The fact remains although the North was extremly opressive Slavery needed to come to an end for this country to continue and Although yes it resulted in severe bloodshed preserving the Union was more importtant. Also know that the atrocities went both ways and although the North pushed politicly and econimcly it was the South who Seceeded. As far as Lincoln goes he was far from perfect but he did not create the Civil War if you Check the History book A lot of the problems started during the Jackson administration and caried on for several more decades. Furthermore what politician is not corrupt or a scoundrel in some way if they weren't they would not be politicians!
     

    SIG_Fiend

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    The fact remains although the North was extremly opressive Slavery needed to come to an end for this country to continue and Although yes it resulted in severe bloodshed preserving the Union was more importtant.

    So it was necessary for some 620,000+ Americans to die when every other civilized society in the world around that period managed to end slavery through bureaucratic means as opposed to violence? I think not. Please don't misunderstand me, I hate racism and completely agree that slavery was a scourge that needed to be abolished. However slavery was just an excuse used to make the whole war more palatable to the American public.

    Also know that the atrocities went both ways and although the North pushed politicly and econimcly it was the South who Seceeded.
    Yeah, secession became necessary because the northern states were so oppressively waging an economical "war" against the southern states that they were destroying the economy down here. I mean it quite literally amounted to federal extortion, basically as in "side with us or we will destroy your economy". Keep in mind, the whole conflict at the time was NOT over slavery, but rather was a conflict over various economical matters and increasing centralization and power/oversight by the federal government. Honestly it was mainly a battle over states rights basically. The topic of doing it to abolish slavery is simply an excuse used to make the whole thing more palatable to the American public. I mean think about the concept. Killing over half a million Americans, working to destroy the southern economy? All for what? Just because the southern states had some different intentions with their economy? Some northern bankers, business men and other people saw a possibility of manipulating the southern states into doing certain things that would financially benefit them (much to do with rail roads, transport, interstate commerce, etc), however the southern states wouldn't have any of it and wanted to control their own economy? So the federal government steps in to try and force the southern states into falling inline, and when the southern states try to resolve it by any other means (bureaucratic, petitioning, etc, secession) then the government decides to wage war upon them? Yeah, there is a lot more to the story there buddy as opposed to the "story book" version commonly recited that Lincoln was some white knight that rode in, fought evil, abolished slavery, and all was well with the land.

    Furthermore what politician is not corrupt or a scoundrel in some way if they weren't they would not be politicians!
    This is a common apologists excuse for tyrants and other men responsible for despicable acts. So Lincoln was responsible for attacking his own country, the death of over 600,000 Americans, and the answer is "hey, what politician hasn't made a mistake?" Sorry but, that just doesn't cut it.
     

    Gonyea

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    First let me tell you that you make a great arguement and secondly let me remind you that the North did not seceed nor did they fire the first shot Jeff Davis and the rest of the confederacies is just as much at fault for the death of those lives as Lincoln is you act as if the South was completly innocent and they were just lawabiding citizens that got raped and plundered bi the blue coat...If Lincoln just invaded the South without just cause I would agree 100 percent but if you really go back and look he avoided the bloodshed as much as possible... Furthermore the South used states rights as an arguement but only as an excuse to rebel not as a reason for diplomacy... The Souths disdain for government and complete disregard for the constitution was very evident.
     

    country_boy

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    dont forget about the yank's naval blockades. If our government drives us way more than it has, the south will revolt again. I think there should be two america's anyway. That way the conservatives can run things their way and liberals run it their way.
     

    SIG_Fiend

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    First let me tell you that you make a great arguement and secondly let me remind you that the North did not seceed nor did they fire the first shot Jeff Davis and the rest of the confederacies is just as much at fault for the death of those lives as Lincoln is you act as if the South was completly innocent and they were just lawabiding citizens that got raped and plundered bi the blue coat...If Lincoln just invaded the South without just cause I would agree 100 percent but if you really go back and look he avoided the bloodshed as much as possible... Furthermore the South used states rights as an arguement but only as an excuse to rebel not as a reason for diplomacy... The Souths disdain for government and complete disregard for the constitution was very evident.

    This is getting too OT, which is partly my fault. Sorry about that guys. The last thing I will add on the subject is that the Civil War was simply yet another example of people using greed, filtered through the government, to take things that aren't theirs. People in the government or in conjunction with people in the government want control of something they neither have the right nor justification to, so they use any means necessary to obtain it through political, economical, and physically coercive means. The government itself is never corrupt. Far too often we just allow corrupt and moronic individuals to get elected into power.

    Back to the topic at hand, one of the things that really irks me is how the media constantly says things like "high powered" or "designed to kill". It's laughable when they even say that about .22lr firearms. ;) Not so laughable though that ignorant people actually believe it. We need to help people understand in this country that guns actually are designed to do absolutely nothing except KILL, and that killing is necessary for survival in many cases. It just amazes me the multitude of ways that people are able to be influenced in such a manner that they aren't even willing to fight for their own life. People like that are nothing except second class (maybe third class or lower ;)) human beings as far as I'm concerned.
     

    Gonyea

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    Back to the topic at hand, one of the things that really irks me is how the media constantly says things like "high powered" or "designed to kill". It's laughable when they even say that about .22lr firearms. ;) Not so laughable though that ignorant people actually believe it. We need to help people understand in this country that guns actually are designed to do absolutely nothing except KILL, and that killing is necessary for survival in many cases. It just amazes me the multitude of ways that people are able to be influenced in such a manner that they aren't even willing to fight for their own life. People like that are nothing except second class (maybe third class or lower ;)) human beings as far as I'm concerned.

    Finally we come come to agreement I live right outside of D.C. right now and the antigun liberals just drive me crazy I've seen gun protest and demonstrations and even anti-gun t-shirts it really makes me sick when you observe the ignorance of the masses.
     

    SIG_Fiend

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    Finally we come come to agreement I live right outside of D.C. right now and the antigun liberals just drive me crazy I've seen gun protest and demonstrations and even anti-gun t-shirts it really makes me sick when you observe the ignorance of the masses.

    If I didn't say it before, I thought you mentioned somewhere that you're in the Marines. If so, thanks for your service. :patriot:
     

    Gonyea

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    Thank you for your support but keep in mind that I have had alot have friends who didn't make it back from the sandbox and now with this withdrawl I am afraid they will have died for nothing. Please call your Rep. and let them know that America finioshes fights and we fight to win!
     

    robocop10mm

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    If you think for one moment that the Dem-O-Craps give a rats behind about saving cops lives, you are an ignorant fool. This is just a way to ban nearly every rifle on the planet. A .270 will go right through my body armor. How many cops have been killed by a .270 in the last 20 years? ZERO! This is the same "feel good" BS they have been pulling for the last 15 years or more. "Reasonable Laws" aimed at "illegitimate" arms and ammunition. They simply convince the sheeple they are acting in their best interest and ram it down our throats.

    NO NEW GUN LEGISLATION!
     

    thehemi

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    If you think for one moment that the Dem-O-Craps give a rats behind about saving cops lives, you are an ignorant fool.

    When push comes to shove, those with the weapons will prevail.
    I'm sure the Democrats do not wish harm on any police officers,
    but thinking a ban on "cop killer bullets" and "assault weapons" is
    a means to minimize cop deaths and drug cartel violence is being
    seriously naive. They don't want armed civilians because people
    with guns have some control over their final fate. When the govt
    is the only ones with guns you can kiss democracy goodbye.
     
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