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Shoot an Appleseed with me?

Discussion in 'Training & Competition' started by Mreed911, May 15, 2015.

  1. Mreed911

    Mreed911 TGT Addict

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    I've been reading about the Appleseed events and they sound fantastic. There are two coming up soon in Central Texas - two-day events in Fredericksburg and College Station. If you've never heard of them, it's basically a rifle course of instruction to develop/enhance foundational rifle skills and then shoot a modified version of the Army Qualification Test.

    I'm thinking about shooting both of these but will definitely be shooting (and camping! - not required, though) the Fredericksburg event!

    Ayoob talks about it here and here.

    Links are below, but they also said if we note our affiliations in our registration, they'll squad us together.

    Calendar: https://appleseedinfo.org/search-states-display.php?qstate=TX&statename=Texas

    What to bring/expect: https://appleseedinfo.org/as_prepare.html

    Fredericksburg Event (May 23/24): https://appleseedinfo.org/search-states-location.php?locationid=106&id_event=3617

    College Station Event (May 30/31): https://appleseedinfo.org/search-states-location.php?locationid=162&id_event=3653

    Discuss here.
     


  2. ROGER4314

    ROGER4314 Been Called "Flash" Since I Was A Kid!

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    I entered friend Bonnie and myself in an Appleseed and have a few cautionary items.

    Those who shoot BEST have scoped 10-22's. They love the tech sights at AS, but we found them to me too cumbersome, difficult to adjust and ineffective. We were firing into the sun and the Tech Sights sucked.

    Bipods are not allowed. You shoot from NRA positions and drop from standing. If you aren't in good physical shape or may need some extra time to rig slings or gear, the course of fire will eat you alive. There were no re-dos or corrections. If we blew a stage.........you move on. If your clothes are too tight, it just won't work.

    Pace is extremely fast. The kid parked next to me on the firing line, never hit the paper but he had to suck it up and move on. Dad was busy with his own shooting and the kid sunk like a rock.

    When we went, there were NO accommodations for handicapped people. I am partly responsible for and provided input in the development of "Adaptive Appleseed" for handicapped shooters. I'm not sure just how it ended up but I know that it exists, now.

    My idea was to take Bonnie, who was an experienced 200 and 600 yard match shooter to the Appleseed for an enjoyable match. That didn't end well. The pace is BLAZING FAST!

    Do NOT expect time to rig, adjust or sight in your rifle. It needs to be ready to go from the moment you open the box.

    If you aren't familiar with NRA positions with sling, work on that BEFORE the Appleseed.

    Several box magazines are a must.

    Each shooter must have his/her equipment. There is no time to share rifles,mags, etc and all shooting is done on a very rigid stopwatch timing. We got 30 seconds to prepare from the moment we approached the firing line.

    They shoot rain, sleet, snow or hail. For lightning, they take cover.

    The positives:
    We loved the stories about the Revolutionary War.
    People were nice.
    Instructors were good about showing how to rig a sling etc but not good at troubleshooting problems the shooters had. They just moved on.
    You get a T shirt whether you qualify for Rifleman or not.

    I'm sure that a lot of this has changed. I brought a highly modified 10-22 that shot bug holes at 25 yards but the rapid dropping into position shooting sunk my boat.

    Flash
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2015
  3. Bravodigger

    Bravodigger New Member

    Sounds like fun, Ive heard little bits about the Appleseed project over the years.
    id love to go but its happening too soon for me to make it.
     
  4. njrefugee

    njrefugee Member

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    Flash,

    It sounds like you may have been to a 1-day event, rather than a 2-day?

    I have only done the 2-day kind, and they spent a lot of time on Day 1 sighting in and working with slings and everything to get people properly squared away. During that time, they go over MOA adjustments and explain how to really zero in on the targets, using 1" squares on a grid of 1/4" lines (each line is 1 MOA at 25 meters.)

    The first run through the AQT (the portion of the day that is spent under time pressure) did not happen until after lunch on Day 1 at the events I have attended. Getting through the stages of the AQT that require position changes was definitely challenging, as Flash said, especially Stage 2 where you go from standing to sitting, since you don't get a ton of time on to work with. If you have mobility issues or trouble going from standing to sitting or prone, you can request to begin in those positions and skip the transition.

    I showed up at my first Appleseed with a new in the box Marlin 795 with Tech Sights and GI sling and with almost zero previous rifle experience of any kind. (I cleaned the rifle in advance and put just enough rounds through it to make sure it would run and was roughly on paper.) With their help and instruction, I was hitting consistently inside the 1" squares by mid-morning Day 1 and shot a 206 on the second AQT same day. Managed to squeeze out a 210 to get a patch on Day 2 in the rain. I did much better on the AQT at my second event, in good weather rather than rain, again with the Tech Sights.

    About half the shooters use scopes. The volunteers had no problems with them when I was there. Personally, I love the tech sights and can now drill dimes with them at 25 meters consistently (prone). But scopes are great as well and definitely won't stick out at an Appleseed event. It's all about learning the fundamentals, and even with a 20x scope, if you can't keep the crosshairs on the target as you press the trigger, you will miss.

    Like Flash said, you need to have your own gear (no sharing, since everybody shoots at the same time) and make sure it runs. You also need to know your rifle, especially if it is anything out of the ordinary. The instructors and volunteers know a lot about many kinds of rifles and can clear issues with a 10/22 or Marlin or most other common rifles, but they may not be experts in everything out there. Also, bring decent ammo that your rifle likes. CCI Mini-Mags tend to cycle better in most rifles than Thunderbolts and other stuff. You don't want to spend all day dealing with failures to feed.

    The links at the top of the thread are pretty comprehensive and definitely worth a read. Basic gear includes 2 mags and a GI Web Sling. Regular slings that you might use for hiking or whatever will not work well. The Appleseed instruction focuses on using the GI sling that you can use to put around the upper part of your support arm, kind of like a slipknot, to support and stabilize the rifle. The Appleseed store stocks these for like $15. Great investment. Now, if you are bringing an AR, this may not be as important, since you can use your mag as a monopod in the prone position, rather than being up on your support elbow if you prefer. Also, if you bring an AR, especially one with a compensator, please go to one end of the line and give yourself some room. Those suckers are LOUD for the poor guy whose head is 18" away from your muzzle! I know from experience...

    Other important stuff to bring would be plenty of water or gatorade, advil or tylenol (good idea to pop one around lunchtime), chair, shade, food, and a shooting mat or piece of carpet. My wife likes to wear an elbow pad on her support arm as well, so might want to have one handy. Sunscreen and a hat are super-important, and you should have clear and shaded eye protection, depending on the weather. Also, it is a good idea to test your ear protection in advance and make sure you can get a good and consistent cheek weld with what you have. The big cans can get in the way sometimes, depending on the rifle.

    Overall, I would highly recommend and encourage you guys to go. The people running these events are very cool and know their stuff. You won't find a hard-@$$ attitude or anything like that. They do this because they love it and don't get paid or anything. If you have any questions, the volunteers are very nice and responsive at the info email address. I had a few questions before I went and they were right back to me. They can also help with any special needs if you let them know ahead of time.

    Enjoy!
     
  5. Mreed911

    Mreed911 TGT Addict

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    Just registered for Fredericksburg - confirmed! I'll be there with my 10/22.

    Depending on how it runs, I may go to College Station and take some friends later in the month.
     
  6. ROGER4314

    ROGER4314 Been Called "Flash" Since I Was A Kid!

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    Ours was a two day event but Arthritis in my knees and elbows put me out of the game. We skipped the second day.

    I don't want to rag on Appleseed because I endorse what they are doing. Also, it is an organization in transition. They have evolved as time passes. There were problems some years ago and to my knowledge, they have been fixed.

    Bonnie had major back surgery and shoots from a folding table. Before we went, I was assured that she could shoot from her table. When we arrived, they DQ'd her from shooting for record because she couldn't shoot from positions. She could shoot, but none of it counted! GRRRRR!

    I was pissed and spent the next few months in relentless battle over their policies. She was DQ'd for being handicapped! I'm sure they were working on "Adaptive Appleseed" before I came along but I darn sure helped move them on the subject!

    I was crippled up and Bonnie was DQ'd so we packed up and took it to the house. There have been MANY changes in AS since then and I respect what they do.

    Now, we are at peace, transitions have been made and I wish them the best.

    Be in shape, have proper equipment, be familiar with and have a sling rigged for each shooter. Be familiar with NRA positions and make sure all of your stuff works properly! Wear loose clothing suitable for exercise. Bring a ground cloth or shooting mat. You will spend lots of time on the ground! They shoot rain or shine. Be prepared!


    Flash
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2015
  7. Pilgrim

    Pilgrim Well-Known TGT Supporter

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    Went two years ago. 2-day course. Had a blast, literally :) Grueling course of fire but once you get your natural point of aim it becomes a bit easier. They'll teach ya good.

    Scored my Rifleman patch at the end of the meet - on a scoped KIDD 10/22... almost felt like cheating but I'll take it.

    Was the only one in the group that scored Rifleman. Pretty nice recognition.

    Would love to do it again sometime.
     
  8. njrefugee

    njrefugee Member

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    Oct 13, 2014
    Mreed911 -- How did it go? Hope you weren't shooting in a downpour...
     
  9. Mreed911

    Mreed911 TGT Addict

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    Weather kept me away. Going to reschedule for something over the summer.
     
  10. njrefugee

    njrefugee Member

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    Sorry to hear. I'm toying with the idea of attending the one in Waco on June 20. Hopefully it will stop raining by then!
     


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