Targets at indoor range, need info.

[Polarbear6]

I regularly shoot at the south location and never had a problem. Your first target is free and the rest are 50 cents. They have extras right on the line, so you just grab a new one as needed. Its on the honor system when they ask how many extra you used at checkout. You can bring your own targets but drawing from holster isn't allowed or I've never seen it done there. Reload drills will probably be okay as long as your being safe.

There also is The Range, which is helluva a nice facility but also is expensive and every time I've shot there, it's been a shit show management wise. Last time was a few months ago, maybe its gotten better.

I use The Range about once a week as a member. You're right, it is a very nice facility. Far superior to Red's IMO. It did used to be a "shit show" at times at range check-in, but they've done a really good job of working the bugs out. Hourly rates for non members are $25/hour for the 25 yard range and $30 for the 100 yard rifle range. I believe Red's is $15/hour. You can bring your own targets to The Range if you prefer. I practice mag switches there with no issues. No drawing from the holster unless you've been checked off by one of their instructors. http://www.therangeaustin.com/

 

[benenglish]

Personally, I'll shoot the range target they give me. It's free, so why not?

But for any serious work, I bring my own targets. Until you've spent some time practicing on Edelmann or Krueger targets, it's difficult to understand what a joy they can be. I prefer Edelmann but no one seems to be importing them any more so I buy from Krueger.

Everyone owes it to themselves to shoot some proper paper targets, at least once. Then you can go back to Nationals and remain forever irritated that our "gold standard" targets are crap compared to what the Europeans use.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

Ben, have you ever done anything similar to what I stated in post #5?

I have difficulty aiming at a solid black area, which is most targets.

 

[benenglish]

Yes, Cam, I've done that for rifles. However, I rarely do it for pistols.

For pistols when practicing for defensive use, the idea is to shoot the middle of a fairly large target that may be any color and/or irregularly shaped. For that sort of practice, I often just turn the target around and shoot at a blank page. That's a good way to learn that, no matter what the target looks like, the bullets go in the middle.

For pistols when practicing for precision use, I use a sub-six hold, i.e. my sights are aligned about halfway between the bottom of the bull and the bottom of the paper. That sort of shooting requires a single large bull on the target.

For pistols when just plinking, I will do as you describe. That's more of a "burning ammo with buddies" session than a real "training to improve a skill" session. It's a lot of fun.

But you know me, Cam. I generally don't go shooting for fun. To me, it's meditation. It's the only thing that drives all the noise out of my head. All the cares of my life melt away and the only things that exist are hold, press, front sight. 20 or 50 carefully loosed rounds from a single shot .22 will do me more good than an hour on a therapists couch.

For that kind of shooting, one big bull in the middle of one target is all I need.

 

[easy rider]

But you know me, Cam. I generally don't go shooting for fun. To me, it's meditation. It's the only thing that drives all the noise out of my head. All the cares of my life melt away and the only things that exist are hold, press, front sight. 20 or 50 carefully loosed rounds from a single shot .22 will do me more good than an hour on a therapists couch.

For that kind of shooting, one big bull in the middle of one target is all I need.

Good to know I'm not the only one that finds shooting therapeutic. That and riding (wind therapy).

 

[ZX9RCAM]

For pistols when practicing for precision use, I use a sub-six hold, i.e. my sights are aligned about halfway between the bottom of the bull and the bottom of the paper. That sort of shooting requires a single large bull on the target.

Just curious, why do you feel that would be better practice for precision shooting, than shooting at a 1" dot?

 

[zincwarrior]

Thinking about heading to Reds indoor range. Can I bring my own targets? Would regular printer paper, printed targets work? Only recently have I heard about shooting the floor or walls or ceiling. I was also wanting to do some 2 round magazine training... I guess. Load each mag with 2 bullets and shoot two and practice reloading and working the slide pretty much.

I'm being rushed, Thanks,
Higgins909

Apologies for the late post. One poster noted illumination is sometimes a problem. If that is the case for your I would recommend Shady Oaks. I have shot at ranges in California, Houston, and Austin, and this is the best lit one I have found (you can bring your own targets FYI).

https://www.shadyoaksgunrange.com/

 

[benenglish]

Just curious, why do you feel that would be better practice for precision shooting, than shooting at a 1" dot?

Sorry if this is longer than it should be.

First, I should clarify. IF you're doing precision/conventional/bullseye with a red dot sight, then the little dots are perfect. With that sight arrangement, you look at the target, let the dot float right in the middle, and press the trigger. For that equipment, a bunch of dots all over the paper is economical and a perfect training setup.

I, otoh, use iron sights. Irons don't align well with a small dot. The eye and brain have no way to create a regular geometric pattern that feels right.

Center hold on a single large bullseye works a bit better but the same problem exists in a different way. The big bull does create a regular pattern that the brain likes but it's too hard to maintain. Irons float over to one side or the other, the brain tells the hold to correct, and you wind up wandering all over the place with nearly-conscious muscle movements designed to correct an imperfect hold. Where the shot breaks is anybody's guess but it's usually not in the X-ring. The only time that center hold works is on the ISSF Rapid Fire Pistol target because it's not a conventional bullseye; the bull covers the entire target paper.

A 6 o'clock hold is a complete disaster. While it helps maintain consistent elevation it exacerbates all the other problems with helping the brain accept a nice, symmetric sight picture because the sight picture is horrifically asymmetric. I realize that 6 o'clock was taught for decades and many world champions used it but that was decades ago. For at least the last 20 years, cognitive sciences have come into play and no one at the highest levels has won consistently with iron sights on conventional bullseye targets using the 6 o'clock hold.

Precision shooting requires that we accept that the hand is wobbling and do not try to correct it. Just let it wobble. Concentrate on looking at the front sight and pressing the trigger straight to the rear. If there is a printed aiming point on the target, it's impossible to tell your brain to go sit in a corner and leave you alone. It jumps in and tries to correct the hold every time the eye shows misalignment of sights and aiming point.

That's really, really bad. That's the yips. That's the brain getting in the way when real champions, frankly, tend to not even remember their most perfect shot strings because they've successfully turned their brain off.

I don't know how many people I've demonstrated this to but here's what I do when people refuse to accept this. I take a good quality target, one thick enough that it's impossible to see the shadow of the bull through the reversed target. I turn it around and send it downrange far enough that the bullet holes cannot be seen. I then instruct the shooter to "Align the sights in the middle of the big blank space, stare at nothing but the front sight, and press the trigger straight to the rear." The brain appreciates the symmetry of the sights being in the middle of the big blank space so the brain is happy to step aside and stop trying to control things or, to put it another way, the brain stops jumping in and trying to correct an unsteady hold. Remember, an unsteady hold is generally not a problem when trying to shoot a pistol for accuracy.

9 times out of 10, the shooter will shoot the smallest group they've ever shot in their life.

The only way to approximate that, to move visual distractions out of the way far enough that the brain doesn't try to jump in and correct things, in competition is to aim sub-6. By pointing the sights halfway between the bull and the bottom of the paper, you can fool your brain into thinking that there's nothing down there to see; it's just aligned sights in the middle of a blank field.

My eyesight is going to Hades pretty quick. When I finally go over to the dark side and put a red dot on my precision pistols, from then on I'll be shooting at your 1" dots all over the paper. That's a great way to train.

But as long as I'm using irons, I'll do everything I can to remove mental distractions from my field of view. No dots. No bulls for practice. And in competition, where I must have a visible bull, I'll aim where there's nothing to see.

If that doesn't make sense, let's get together at SGA and have a little fun shooting different training scenarios. I'll bring the targets. Deal?

 

[Keyston512]

I use The Range about once a week as a member. You're right, it is a very nice facility. Far superior to Red's IMO. It did used to be a "shit show" at times at range check-in, but they've done a really good job of working the bugs out. Hourly rates for non members are $25/hour for the 25 yard range and $30 for the 100 yard rifle range. I believe Red's is $15/hour. You can bring your own targets to The Range if you prefer. I practice mag switches there with no issues. No drawing from the holster unless you've been checked off by one of their instructors. http://www.therangeaustin.com/

That's awesome to hear, especially the part about allowing to draw from holster if you check out as safe. I've also seen they've waived the ridiculous initiation fee for membership occasionally as well.

They're allowed to charge whatever they want, but I couldn't justify the extra money for how they managed getting people onto the firing line. Staff and the RSO's were always friendly and approachable but some had the deer in the headlights look and clearly lacked a qualified customer service manager. Outside of that, I enjoy shooting there. When Red's (south) is busy, the firing line and the non-existent waiting area is lets say, very intimate.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

A range day would be awesome.
I wouldn't know about this weekend before Friday, but sooner rather than later, absolutely.

 

[Higgins909]

Guess I've been doing it wrong. Uplula, don't leave for the range without it.

I got a maglula uplula a few days ago in the mail from amazon. I have yet to use it or go to the range a second time. Been too tired after work. I managed to buy ear plugs to go under ear muffs, but forgot to get masking tape and a sharpie. Does anyone know what reds does with the brass casing? I might eventually get into reloading, but as far as I know, they were swept by a worker and put in the trash... Think it was the trash. Wanna say it had trash written on it but don't remember if it was X'd out. I put my ammo cardboard box in it if it wasn't...

 

[easy rider]

I got a maglula uplula a few days ago in the mail from amazon. I have yet to use it or go to the range a second time. Been too tired after work. I managed to buy ear plugs to go under ear muffs, but forgot to get masking tape and a sharpie. Does anyone know what reds does with the brass casing? I might eventually get into reloading, but as far as I know, they were swept by a worker and put in the trash... Think it was the trash. Wanna say it had trash written on it but don't remember if it was X'd out. I put my ammo cardboard box in it if it wasn't...

Ranges usually recycle casings.

 

[Polarbear6]

That's awesome to hear, especially the part about allowing to draw from holster if you check out as safe. I've also seen they've waived the ridiculous initiation fee for membership occasionally as well.

They're allowed to charge whatever they want, but I couldn't justify the extra money for how they managed getting people onto the firing line. Staff and the RSO's were always friendly and approachable but some had the deer in the headlights look and clearly lacked a qualified customer service manager. Outside of that, I enjoy shooting there. When Red's (south) is busy, the firing line and the non-existent waiting area is lets say, very intimate.

Yeah, the membership fee is expensive. I got in on a really good special they were running a few months before opening. The location is very convenient for me, so since I'm a member, all I pay for is my ammo, so I go about once a week. They have a lot of really nice amenities there. Very spacious waiting area with lots of comfortable tables and chairs, though I've never had to wait for a lane. A lounge area with TV outside the rifle range. On-site gunsmith, full auto anytime (rent or bring your own). Tons of classes from intro to pistol to advanced combative pistol, carbine, etc. Ladies only classes. First indoor range I've seen that allows buckshot. Vertical firearms display cases are pretty awesome. Each bay has it's own illumination control, so you can make it as dark or bright as you like. Lots of little things like that make for a good experience.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

A range day would be awesome.
I wouldn't know about this weekend before Friday, but sooner rather than later, absolutely.

Hey Ben, I'll be hitting SGA tomorrow if you are interested in meeting up with me.
It will be late morning or early afternoon.
I'm going regardless, I know it's late notice.

 

[benenglish]

I'm sorry I can't make it, Cam. If things change, I'll send you a conversation message, but I don't think they'll change.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

No worries...