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Tips and Tricks for the reloading bench
- Thread starter Dawico
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I was in the process of trimming a bunch of 223 to make 300BO when I decided hand trimming wasn't for me. I already had a Lyman case trimmer with a full set of collets, so I ordered the conversion shaft to a drill/driver. Mounted it to a couple of boards to get it to the right height. It was cheaper than buying the hand held case trimmer for the different calibers I reload. It goes pretty quick.
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memo43
New Member
another bump to keep this thread going.
I keep a small magnet near my progressive, every now an the I get a range pick up that seems odd. A quick touch to the magnet will tell if its metal or brass.
Also in the automotive section those fancy led light strips with the adhesive tape on them. I place them on my press to help illuminate the cases to check for powder.
A wall shelf to mount your beam scale to verify weight at eye level, doesn't get disturbed my bench operations keep a magnifying glass handy to make the marks stand out.
Not only do I keep notes on all my reloads in a composition book, but I also write down on a index card and tape it to the powder bottle itself.
I keep a small magnet near my progressive, every now an the I get a range pick up that seems odd. A quick touch to the magnet will tell if its metal or brass.
Also in the automotive section those fancy led light strips with the adhesive tape on them. I place them on my press to help illuminate the cases to check for powder.
A wall shelf to mount your beam scale to verify weight at eye level, doesn't get disturbed my bench operations keep a magnifying glass handy to make the marks stand out.
Not only do I keep notes on all my reloads in a composition book, but I also write down on a index card and tape it to the powder bottle itself.
I bought one of these after reading this and love it. I have deprimed a load of brass while just sitting in front of the old TV waisting time watching crap!!
I deprime and then throw it in the stainless after washing once! Great tool for not having to sit in front of the press to get alot of brass ready! Do youself a favor and buy extra pins though. I busted one......mostly due to getting use to the thing. I put a couple of little small rubber dot type bumpers where it claps against the brass holder section and this has cut down on metal clapping noise dramatically.......and doesn't pinch my finger anymore!
A few notes:
- No need to TRIM pistol brass. Anything being sold to do so is a waste of money.
- No need to crimp 9mm or .45 acp. Case headspaces to the rim of the case. Anything being sold to do so is a waste of money.
- Anneal rifle brass after the 3rd or 4th reload. Your cases will last longer.
- Try to keep batches of reloadable brass separate for the rifle they were originally shot from. Neck size only, and your cases will last longer.
- I have found that a 75% powder load of the MAX charge is usually the most accurate, and efficient out of Semi-autos.
- Water quench lead bullets. They are harder and don't frost up during the cooling process if the mix was a little too hot.
- By weight, 75% of Stump Killer (KNO3), 15% Alderwood Charcoal, and 10% Sulfur makes one heck of a shotgun propellant.
- Spent primers from the press mixed in with lead shot and melted crayon make an excellent 12ga waxer shell.
- Shot out .308 and .30-06 cases can be cut to make .45 ACP shot shells.
- Add Nu Finish to tumbling media, for a cheap polish.
- Soak tarnished brass in pickle juice or a mix of vinegar and salt overnight before tumbling.
- Out of Alox? Try Johnsons Paste Wax.
- IDEAL 31-358 Wire Pulling Lubricant makes an excellent/cheap case lube.
- Synthetic 5w-20 motor oil is the best firearm lubricant available. Won't rust, high temp, no odor.
- Substitute a $1 toilet wax ring for $20 beeswax if price is an issue.
- 1/4 inch copper tubing, a drill press, and a RCBS primer pocket reamer can convert Berdan brass to boxer.
- No need to TRIM pistol brass. Anything being sold to do so is a waste of money.
- No need to crimp 9mm or .45 acp. Case headspaces to the rim of the case. Anything being sold to do so is a waste of money.
- Anneal rifle brass after the 3rd or 4th reload. Your cases will last longer.
- Try to keep batches of reloadable brass separate for the rifle they were originally shot from. Neck size only, and your cases will last longer.
- I have found that a 75% powder load of the MAX charge is usually the most accurate, and efficient out of Semi-autos.
- Water quench lead bullets. They are harder and don't frost up during the cooling process if the mix was a little too hot.
- By weight, 75% of Stump Killer (KNO3), 15% Alderwood Charcoal, and 10% Sulfur makes one heck of a shotgun propellant.
- Spent primers from the press mixed in with lead shot and melted crayon make an excellent 12ga waxer shell.
- Shot out .308 and .30-06 cases can be cut to make .45 ACP shot shells.
- Add Nu Finish to tumbling media, for a cheap polish.
- Soak tarnished brass in pickle juice or a mix of vinegar and salt overnight before tumbling.
- Out of Alox? Try Johnsons Paste Wax.
- IDEAL 31-358 Wire Pulling Lubricant makes an excellent/cheap case lube.
- Synthetic 5w-20 motor oil is the best firearm lubricant available. Won't rust, high temp, no odor.
- Substitute a $1 toilet wax ring for $20 beeswax if price is an issue.
- 1/4 inch copper tubing, a drill press, and a RCBS primer pocket reamer can convert Berdan brass to boxer.
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You have some interesting opinions on various subjects. I'd like to comment on two or three.
Perhaps I've dealt with too many oversized chambers in my life. I've tried the "no sizing" method and gotten some really lousy results, most notably .44 Magnum revolvers where unsized cases do not fully grip the bullet and they walk out of the cases. Yes, a crimp helps but sizing does, too. I find this recommendation a bit odd since I can think of so many cases where it doesn't work. To cite an example that many on the forum may have stumbled across, failure to size .40 S&W cases fired from semi-autos where the case is not fully supported will almost certainly cause chambering problems.
I generally place little weight on "the wisdom of crowds" but, in this case, I find myself asking why every reloading manual, every how-to article, and every successful shooter I've ever known has always recommended that pistol brass be sized. I kinda think they're on to something.
I've done plenty of "neck size only reloading" for particular handguns that shoot rifle cartridges and some rifles. However, I find that they *all* eventually need a full-length resizing to continue to chamber normally.
I assume that the inclusion of the comma in that sentence is a typo. With the comma, the first part of the sentence applies to all firearms and the second part applies only to semi-autos. It radically changes how the sentence is read.
If you truly intended to put that common into the sentence, I would dispute the first clause as inapplicable to many bolt-actions.
If you did not intend the comma to appear and you wish the entire sentence to pertain only to semi-autos, then I take issue with the notion that a 75% charge is the most efficient from many pistols. Where rifles are concerned, a 75% charge may (for many designs, definitely will) impact functioning.
Since you're including advice for pistols, rifles, and shotguns in a single post, it might be helpful if you'd specify what advice applies to what sorts of firearms. In the case of the last quote I cited, knowing if you're talking about rifles or pistols would be a great help.
Perhaps I've dealt with too many oversized chambers in my life. I've tried the "no sizing" method and gotten some really lousy results, most notably .44 Magnum revolvers where unsized cases do not fully grip the bullet and they walk out of the cases. Yes, a crimp helps but sizing does, too. I find this recommendation a bit odd since I can think of so many cases where it doesn't work. To cite an example that many on the forum may have stumbled across, failure to size .40 S&W cases fired from semi-autos where the case is not fully supported will almost certainly cause chambering problems.
I generally place little weight on "the wisdom of crowds" but, in this case, I find myself asking why every reloading manual, every how-to article, and every successful shooter I've ever known has always recommended that pistol brass be sized. I kinda think they're on to something.
I've done plenty of "neck size only reloading" for particular handguns that shoot rifle cartridges and some rifles. However, I find that they *all* eventually need a full-length resizing to continue to chamber normally.
I assume that the inclusion of the comma in that sentence is a typo. With the comma, the first part of the sentence applies to all firearms and the second part applies only to semi-autos. It radically changes how the sentence is read.
If you truly intended to put that common into the sentence, I would dispute the first clause as inapplicable to many bolt-actions.
If you did not intend the comma to appear and you wish the entire sentence to pertain only to semi-autos, then I take issue with the notion that a 75% charge is the most efficient from many pistols. Where rifles are concerned, a 75% charge may (for many designs, definitely will) impact functioning.
Since you're including advice for pistols, rifles, and shotguns in a single post, it might be helpful if you'd specify what advice applies to what sorts of firearms. In the case of the last quote I cited, knowing if you're talking about rifles or pistols would be a great help.
Ok. Let me elaborate.
- The first question about sizing, I had a typo and meant to trim not size. My fault, and I fixed the post.
- Question 2, correct. On average the 2nd and 3rd reload get tight, and the bolt gets more and more resistance when chambering the case. At this point, a full resize will be needed.
- I stand by my third statement. Obviously, if the difference between the starting load and the max load is less than a few tenths of a grains this will not work as well with the fast burning pistol powders. It is the charge that widely varies where this trick works. For example: Take a 9mm 125gr epoxy coated cast bullet to be used with universal powder. Charge range can fall between 4.0 gr and 5.3 gr. Therefore the total charge between the min and the max = 1.3 grains. 75% of that will make the charge 4.975 or just round up to a clean 5.0 grains of universal. This load will work with the pickiest pistol, and through carbines in my experience. If you find it too hot just dial it down a bit the next time.
This also works for rifles also. Take a 150gr .308 projectile loaded on a .308 case and standard LRP. The charge range varies from 37.6 to 47.5 grains of IMR 4895. The charge range is 9.9 grains. 75% of 9.9 = 7.425. 37.6+ 7.425 = 45.0 grains. Your CETME's will love it..
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The original post was "tips and tricks" at the reloading table. These are the tricks "I" use and may not be for others that must have sub MOA precision. Each item is a mere single sentence statement of the method I do. If you like to get more information on the listed method, I recommend google to search more information on the method and get a more precise/in-depth information on the techniques listed above.
- The first question about sizing, I had a typo and meant to trim not size. My fault, and I fixed the post.
- Question 2, correct. On average the 2nd and 3rd reload get tight, and the bolt gets more and more resistance when chambering the case. At this point, a full resize will be needed.
- I stand by my third statement. Obviously, if the difference between the starting load and the max load is less than a few tenths of a grains this will not work as well with the fast burning pistol powders. It is the charge that widely varies where this trick works. For example: Take a 9mm 125gr epoxy coated cast bullet to be used with universal powder. Charge range can fall between 4.0 gr and 5.3 gr. Therefore the total charge between the min and the max = 1.3 grains. 75% of that will make the charge 4.975 or just round up to a clean 5.0 grains of universal. This load will work with the pickiest pistol, and through carbines in my experience. If you find it too hot just dial it down a bit the next time.
This also works for rifles also. Take a 150gr .308 projectile loaded on a .308 case and standard LRP. The charge range varies from 37.6 to 47.5 grains of IMR 4895. The charge range is 9.9 grains. 75% of 9.9 = 7.425. 37.6+ 7.425 = 45.0 grains. Your CETME's will love it..
________________________________________
The original post was "tips and tricks" at the reloading table. These are the tricks "I" use and may not be for others that must have sub MOA precision. Each item is a mere single sentence statement of the method I do. If you like to get more information on the listed method, I recommend google to search more information on the method and get a more precise/in-depth information on the techniques listed above.
Gotcha.
I found your explanation of the third cite especially illuminating. You're talking about the utility of reducing the powder charge by 25% of the difference between min and max. When I first read it, I thought you were making a blanket recommendation that powder charges should be 75% of total maximum, a completely different thing that often won't work. My bad.
Bottom line - With your further elaboration, it sounds to me like you know what you're doing. Thanks for straightening me out.
I like Dawico and Roger4314's laundry lists, my two things are only use--used dryer sheets and no smell and the non allergenic plain ones. And I hate trimming, deburring after full length sizing, so I had bought Collet neck sizer kits for bolt guns, but got notified on a channel subscription and watched this. With a few changes to how I used what I already had, went and fired two strings across a chrono this evening at an indoor range while it was raining and had an Standard deviation of 3 fps, yes 6fps from high to low on a 30-06 and I'm no professional. Shot for velocity with no rest but I know that will be one ragged hole groups out of a sled.
My Lee case trimmer is wearing my fingers out. If it isn't tight enough the case spins out. Too tight and you can't get it loose again.
Not a big deal for just a handful of cases but I have thousands of 223 cases to trim.
I wanted something to clamp on there that wasn't too big and heavy but added grip. I happened to have an aluminum spring hook handy that fit the bill perfectly.
A few smacks with a hammer and it is locked on there tight.
Not a big deal for just a handful of cases but I have thousands of 223 cases to trim.
I wanted something to clamp on there that wasn't too big and heavy but added grip. I happened to have an aluminum spring hook handy that fit the bill perfectly.
A few smacks with a hammer and it is locked on there tight.
I tried a half dozen different powder measure systems, andin frustration I finally settled on using an electronic dispenser/scale. I'mkind of anal about powder accuracy, maybe because I started with 38 spcl and itis too easy to double charge; and when you're in 2 - 4 grn territory, it's alsotoo easy to make a mistake which can be significant. POWDER MEASURE - For rifle (low quantities) I "dip &trickle" to an electronic scale. To speed itup I make a custom dipper to "dip & trickle" each load. I take an old case, pour in the load and markthe level, dump the powder out, cut the brass a smidgen below the mark, andfashion a wire handle. It's easy to customizeand makes the process fast. I get reallyaccurate with this & practice - but I still use the electronic scale tocheck every load. For pistol I use theauto-repeat dispense - it gives me a lot of confidence, I'm usually doing500-1000 rounds at a time. I have the LymanGen 6, and I get push-button repeat accurately with all powders, even stickpowders. The unit is a bit of pain to clean out after use, but well worth itand that’s why I use the auto-dispense mostly for volume production.
Damn! I just found this thread. I've only read the first page so far. I appreciate the advice.
Several of these I already figured out on my own. I appreciate the thought of having a pan or sheet under my powder measure. My rifle powder is spherical but my pistol powder is a flake and it leaks from my powder dropped. It gets everywhere!
Several of these I already figured out on my own. I appreciate the thought of having a pan or sheet under my powder measure. My rifle powder is spherical but my pistol powder is a flake and it leaks from my powder dropped. It gets everywhere!
Quote "1/4 inch copper tubing, a drill press, and a RCBS primer pocket reamer can convert Berdan brass to boxer."
I know this was posted a long time ago, but I would like more info on converting Berdan to Boxer. I can't picture it in my head.
I know this was posted a long time ago, but I would like more info on converting Berdan to Boxer. I can't picture it in my head.
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After trimming a few thousand .223 cases this is how my equipment ended up. The aforementioned snap hook on the lock ring, Vice Grips on the cutter stud, and a super fancy custom shield to keep the cutter from throwing shaved brass everywhere. If it looks like the top from a water bottle it is not, I assure you. It is a custom piece of my own design.
I found a lot of this information useful, as well as all other info here, too.
I especially like the thoughts on trimming pistol brass though. I have been wondering this because I have gotten into 2nd and 3rd reloads on a few of my 9mm brass. I'll stop worrying.
I will note that I had trouble loading some rounds recently. My case overall length was all over the place. I have found 2 separate issues leading to it. First, my battery was dying and not giving accurate measures. I also found on my replacement caliper I could not zero it properly. I'd thumb it down and it would go to -.0015 sometimes but as soon as I let go it would go back to zero. I found the points had been buggered up somehow. Very light zap with a dremil to knock the warped points down. Works great again.
I also found my expensive $125 calipers to be much less reliable than my $20 home depot ones. Just my experience though.
