Would like to hear your opinion of/about The Oathkeepers Organization?

[breakingcontact]

It often takes the courts YEARS to sort through a particular case and determine the constitutionality of some issue.

And the courts are often wrong.

I appreciate what the Oath Keepers stand for and what they are trying to do. From my limited interaction with them it seems to be more of a bond of mutual frustration with our increasingly unconstitutional gov and less of an effective organziation with sprecific aims and goals to rectify our current gov through the system, you know like...going through the courts.

 

[txinvestigator]

And the courts are often wrong.

Just for the debate, who says they are wrong? I am talking about issues that get to the Supreme Court. If it takes YEARS for these constitutional issues to be decided, how does that effect the guy on street?

I appreciate what the Oath Keepers stand for and what they are trying to do. From my limited interaction with them it seems to be more of a bond of mutual frustration with our increasingly unconstitutional gov and less of an effective organziation with sprecific aims and goals to rectify our current gov through the system, you know like...going through the courts.

So how would I, as a member (if I were still LE), do anything different than a LEO who was not a member?

And just to note; I am not saying anything negative about them, I am just conversing.....

 

[breakingcontact]

Just for the debate, who says they are wrong? I am talking about issues that get to the Supreme Court. If it takes YEARS for these constitutional issues to be decided, how does that effect the guy on street?



So how would I, as a member (if I were still LE), do anything different than a LEO who was not a member?

And just to note; I am not saying anything negative about them, I am just conversing.....

Good question. The bait im supposed to take is that youd be a rogue cop enforcing the laws that you felt were constitutional. Refuse unlawful orders from your commanders. File grievences against your superiors who betray the Constitution. Be the constitutional republican guard my brother!

Ummmm

Thats kind of what i mean about the organization. I need to learn more about their goals and plans, i get and agree with their beliefs on the US Constitution.

 

[Charlie]

Just because the Supreme Court (or a lower court) decides on the constitutionality of something does not make it correct, it just makes it the law (or not). If I disagree on a court decision, it does not make me incorrect. I don't change my basic beliefs based on what other humans decide. That doesn't mean I will disobey the law, it just means I don't agree.

 

[txinvestigator]

Good question. The bait im supposed to take is that youd be a rogue cop enforcing the laws that you felt were constitutional. Refuse unlawful orders from your commanders. File grievences against your superiors who betray the Constitution. Be the constitutional republican guard my brother!

Ummmm

Thats kind of what i mean about the organization. I need to learn more about their goals and plans, i get and agree with their beliefs on the US Constitution.

There was no bait from me. I am trying to have a real discussion here.

 

[breakingcontact]

There was no bait from me. I am trying to have a real discussion here.

From: https://oathkeepers.org/oath/about/

What they are...

1. We will NOT obey orders to disarm the American people.
2. We will NOT obey orders to conduct warrantless searches of the American people
3. We will NOT obey orders to detain American citizens as “unlawful enemy combatants” or to subject them to military tribunal.
4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state.
5. We will NOT obey orders to invade and subjugate any state that asserts its sovereignty.
6. We will NOT obey any order to blockade American cities, thus turning them into giant concentration camps.
7. We will NOT obey any order to force American citizens into any form of detention camps under any pretext.
8. We will NOT obey orders to assist or support the use of any foreign troops on U.S. soil against the American people to “keep the peace” or to “maintain control.”
9. We will NOT obey any orders to confiscate the property of the American people, including food and other essential supplies.
10.We will NOT obey any orders which infringe on the right of the people to free speech, to peaceably assemble, and to petition their government for a redress of grievances.


What they are not...

We are Not advocating or promoting the overthrow of any government whether local, state or national.

We want our governments to return to the Constitutional Republic which the Declaration of Independence and the
Constitution defined and instituted.

We are Not advocating or promoting violence towards any organization, group or person.

We are determined to Keep our Oath to support and defend the Constitution.

We are not advocating or promoting the removal of any person from his or her elected office.

We want all elected persons to live up to their Oath to “support and defend the Constitution” as it is written or to leave of their own volition.

We are not advocating or promoting that anyone in the Judicial Branch be removed or replaced.

We want the Justices in the Judicial Branch to follow the Constitution as written without interpretation.

We are not advocating or promoting any particular form of government other than the Constitutional Republic which the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution defined and instituted.

We are not advocating or promoting the rewriting of the Constitution nor are we asking for an Amendment thereto.

We are insisting on the Constitution being Enforced as it is written.

We are Not advocating or promoting any act or acts of aggression against any organization or person for any
reason including, but not limited to; race, religion, national origin, political affiliation, gender or sexual orientation.

We hope for a return to a Constitutional Republic free from fear and hatred.

We hate only tyranny.

We are Oath Sworn Americans who want the Constitution returned to its legal and rightful place, intact, as the ultimate Law of the Land.

 

[Acera]

They are trying to counter the type of situation where, like in fascist Germany of the 30-40's, people obey orders by those appointed above them regardless whether it's right or wrong.

I feel a lot of current LEO will do just that because they can show a clear path of paperwork to justify their actions, I also feel a lot will not. It comes down the each individuals personal 'line in the sand'.

 

[vmax]

Everyone who took an oath originally made those exact pledges. So what is the purpose of this group? The problem is when THEY as a group start deciding on what is constitutional and what is not. It often takes the courts YEARS to sort through a particular case and determine the constitutionality of some issue.

Does that make sense?

The purpose is right on the website
Oath Keepers reaches out to both current serving and veterans to remind them of their oaths, to teach them more about the Constitution they swore to defend, and to inspire them to defend it."


as to your question about what is or isn't constitutional , the taking of guns from citizens and warrantless searches are pretty easy to understand without years of Constitutional debate