WTH is this sign?

[Renegade]

So, gun buster signs, or the verbiage "no guns", is all that's required?

No. Todd has posted the 30.05 requirements.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

No. Todd has posted the 30.05 requirements.

That's what I thought.

 

[rotor]

No. Todd has posted the 30.05 requirements.

Actually, gun buster sign will be enough for 30.05 unfortunately.

 

[Renegade]

Actually, gun buster sign will be enough for 30.05 unfortunately.

Says who?
Texas Court of Criminal Appeals?
Texas AG?
DPS?
The folks who wrote the bill?

Do tell.

 

[rotor]

Says who?
Texas Court of Criminal Appeals?
Texas AG?
DPS?
The folks who wrote the bill?

Do tell.

I talked to the attorneys at Texas Law Shield about this specifically and because the bill wording is ambiguous (see post 19 and read the sign requirements), a property owner may post about any sign he wants to keep a permitless carrier out. I am not happy about this either so don't shoot the messenger. I thought the wording was explicit but the word may was used instead of shall.

 

[Renegade]

I talked to the attorneys at Texas Law Shield about this specifically and because the bill wording is ambiguous (see post 19 and read the sign requirements), a property owner may post about any sign he wants to keep a permitless carrier out. I am not happy about this either so don't shoot the messenger. I thought the wording was explicit but the word may was used instead of shall.

OK so nobody with legal authority, just it is USCC opinion, and I just also saw it on P15 of their handbook.

So like in the 90s, it will go to TX/AG for opinion, only this time it is Paxton not Morales.

 

[toddnjoyce]

Do we know for certain what notification is required for constitutional carry?

I’m not. What the TPC 30.05 will be amended to say is laughingly vague from an operation of the law perspective. Because an offense can, under various conditions, range from a Class C to Class A misdemeanor, it’s going to be messy across the local courts where it will play out.

Law shield, in my opinion, is taking a very narrow reading and failing to recognize that “oral or written communication” is required for notice to be given. An icon is not written communication.

When I think about this change and how it would impact me personally were I exercising permitless carry, I’m on the from spectrum of discretion is the better part of valor to concealed is concealed.

I expect OCT may do some test cases and that could do more harm than good in the long run. But 30.05 has to be fixed in the next session, otherwise it could effectively neuter the right, which very well could have been Patrick’s intent.

 

[toddnjoyce]

I’m going to amend my previous post. Short of a verbatim 30.05 sign in English and Spanish, I don’t know what else the courts will find acceptable in their local jurisdictions.

 

[rotor]

I’m going to amend my previous post. Short of a verbatim 30.05 sign in English and Spanish, I don’t know what else the courts will find acceptable in their local jurisdictions.

OK so nobody with legal authority, just it is USCC opinion, and I just also saw it on P15 of their handbook.

So like in the 90s, it will go to TX/AG for opinion, only this time it is Paxton not Morales.

Correct and may is not the same as shall. Someone else can be the test case but Texas Law Shield probably won’t defend you when they have interpreted the sign already.

 

[Renegade]

As I stated elsewhere, this bill is no substitute for LTC. For occasional carry at best.

 

[seeker_two]

Saw that sign at Deerbrook Mall. Security has a K-9 that can sniff out gun powder. They go to different malls the corp. owns.

Wonder if the dog can detect a "leak" in my OC spray canister if it gets too close?....

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

 

[Brains]

I saw one of those at Willowbrook mall too.

 

[jamesmrj]

Wonder if the dog can detect a "leak" in my OC spray canister if it gets too close?....

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They threatened to use dogs for room inspections at the A&M corp dorms at on one point when I was there (the never did). I always planned on using cyanne, black pepper, etc. to mess with the dogs ala Cool Hand Luke. Never had anything to hide, but I don't appreciate being strong armed.

 

[Renegade]

They threatened to use dogs for room inspections at the A&M corp dorms at on one point when I was there (the never did). I always planned on using cyanne, black pepper, etc. to mess with the dogs ala Cool Hand Luke. Never had anything to hide, but I don't appreciate being strong armed.

Not the dogs fault

I would drop hoppes, Rem oil, etc wipes etc all over the place. With a dog treat of course.

 

[jamesmrj]

Not the dogs fault

I would drop hoppes, Rem oil, etc wipes etc all over the place. With a dog treat of course.

True. Would sulfur screw up theirs smellers without harm? Mind you this was a 16 year hypothetical dilima on my part.

 

[Renegade]

True. Would sulfur screw up theirs smellers without harm? Mind you this was a 16 year hypothetical dilima on my part.

Hypothetical on my part too. I imagine if some idiot tried to implement this the simplest solution is dog treats everywhere. Hilarity would soon ensue.

 

[BBL]

It basically gives you notice if they find you have a firearm, you will be given 06/07 notice and have to leave. So conceal up.

Right. If you CC, they cannot trespass you for being armed because they won't know. A security guard is just another employee of the mall (or contractor), not a LEO. No threat to you.

 

[rotor]

Right. If you CC, they cannot trespass you for being armed because they won't know. A security guard is just another employee of the mall (or contractor), not a LEO. No threat to you.

If you don't get caught. I am not suggesting that you commit a crime though, better to not enter. This has been the same argument with 30.06, but if you know there is a sign and you enter you are still trespassing even if you don't get caught. We all have to decide for ourselves.

 

[Renegade]

If you don't get caught. I am not suggesting that you commit a crime though, better to not enter. This has been the same argument with 30.06, but if you know there is a sign and you enter you are still trespassing even if you don't get caught. We all have to decide for ourselves.

That sign has no legal meaning wrt to LTC. LTC passing it is not trespassing.

 

[BBL]

If you don't get caught. I am not suggesting that you commit a crime though, better to not enter. This has been the same argument with 30.06, but if you know there is a sign and you enter you are still trespassing even if you don't get caught. We all have to decide for ourselves.

The sign is pointless and useless.
A person carrying a firearm without LTC is breaking the law with or without the sign.
A person licensed to carry a handgun just laughs and ignores this idiotic sign because it has no effect on LTC.
So whether you have LTC or not, this sign is useless anyway. QED