Hurley's Gold

Kel-Tec SUB 2000 for Home Defense.

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  • matefrio

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    Jan 19, 2010
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    Just got back from teaching a "new" shooter how to use his Kel-Tec SUB-2000. They'd only shot .22lr rifles before this outing.

    Privacy sake I didn't take pictures. Some background.

    I was approached by a friend from church and asked to recommend a home defense gun for him and his wife while he was out for an extended time. Most everyone had recommend a shotgun, from 12 gauge to .410. Having shot a bunch of shotguns and introduced new shooters to them I've become hesitant to suggest them for home defense. The other suggestions included a Glock pistol.

    Especially women, I've found that the recoil of a shotgun is distracting not to mention most public ranges won't let the shooter practice on the rifle or pistol range.

    My recommendation was the SUB-2000. A $320.00 carbine that shoots 9mm and takes 33 round Glock magazines. I'd shot one before and was impressed. Budget didn't allow for an AR15.

    Some Advantages of this Carbine.

    • For a person without a CHL this is a compact rifle they can carry almost everywhere in Texas concealed or open carry.
    • Accuracy and control with a carbine is generally better than a pistol.
    • Price point is affordable and allowed some upgrades and extra magazines within budget.
    • The SUB-2000 can be folded in half adding to concealment and safety as it cannot fire in that configuration.
    • Redally available and reliable magazines.
    • 9mm is a common round and can be found almost anywhere ammo is sold.
    • The option in the future of getting a Glock 9mm pistol and the magazines working in either platform.

    After I convinced them this was the way to go the gun was purchased. I did recommend some additions.

    Tacticool Products sells three items that are inexpensive and help the SUB-2000 shine.
    • Buffer Cylinder that reduces felt recoil over 30% $9.50
    • Bolt Tube Cover for a comfortable cheek weld $13.50
    • Operating Handle Cover that reduces finger stress $4.50
    In addition
    • 33 round Glock manufactured magazine. $36.00
    • Picatinny Rail Adapter $20
    • Picatinny Rail Flashlight $30

    At the range we setup on the 25 yard line. We went over some safety rules and then some basics of shooting. (Keep the front sight clear), Trigger squeezing etc.

    I'll mention here that the trigger on these is creepy and stiff. Not horrible but not good either.

    ** Note the safety is operated with the thumb so it's opposite of what most guns use. Right to left is fire. Left to right is safe. It's in a convenient place and functions well where it's at just not the same direction as most safeties operated with the trigger finger.

    We soon were rewarded with some 10 round single hole groups at 25 yards. We put 3 different types of ammo though the gun. WWB 115 grain. Monarch brass 115 grain and some 147 grain Winchester +P hollow points. These functioned perfectly and we didn't have any malfunctions.

    The confidence of this new shooter was very high at the end of the range session in their abilities and in the weapon system.

    There is more training to do but the advantages with the kel-tec SUB 2000 are these new shooters are ahead of the game in confidence and proficiency compared to any other platform I've taught on.

    Photo gallery and commentaries by Oleg Volk has some great pictures of this gun. I used them to show the family what they were getting. In fact go to his sight and look though the many gun related pictures. He's an amazing photographer and a great gun ambassador.

    sub2000_cho_4299.jpg


    discreet-firepower-kel-tec-sub2000-carbine-500x500.jpg


    sub2000_8694.jpg


    sub2000_0048.jpg


    equalizer_8018.jpg


    courtney_sub2000_5454.jpg


    Pictures from:::
    Photo gallery and commentaries by Oleg Volk
     

    Mikewood

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    Jan 8, 2011
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    I always thought they were a great idea. I may pick one up as a truck gun.
    The only deficiency I see is not being able to mount a proper scope even a flip to the side mount won't work. A 45 degree offset might work on a side rail.
    Congrats on getting new shooters out to the range.
     

    CanTex

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    Mar 4, 2009
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    I picked one up shortly after getting a 9mm glock 17. Mags are interchangeable. Figured it was an excellent setup but did not like the sights. So, I took a self closing gate hinge, attached it to the forestock and mounted a scope mount on it and an inexpensive red dot scope. Gun folds same as normal except you have to pull the red dot to the side. It maintains its zero, has no issues with folding and carries in the same gun case.

    Only difference, when you fold it you must pull the red dot to the side, when you open it either you have to hold the red dot and ease it over or it snaps itself over when the spring takes over. I have forgotten a number of times to hold it when opening and again it still holds zero.
     

    Charlie

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    I have a neighbor that is a Constable that recently bought one in .40 cal. to comlement his G22. He folds it up and keeps it up front in his patrol vehicle. He loves it. He says it's more accurate than the pistol and it's super convenient. Wish they had one in .45 ACP!
     

    TheDan

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    Nov 11, 2008
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    The only deficiency I see is not being able to mount a proper scope even a flip to the side mount won't work.
    Keltec makes a flip to side mount: Kel-Tec CNC - SUB-2000 Accessories - Scope Mount
    Never used one myself, tho. I'd be concerned about it holding zero, but at 0-25yds it probably wouldn't be an issue on a man sized target.

    If you're gonna use one for home defense only, the best thing would probably be to just ditch the folding capability and go with the aluminum railed forend and put a red dot on it. I really dig the fact it folds up small enough to fit into a messenger bag, tho.
     

    mkburden

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    Feb 20, 2010
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    I picked one up at the local pawn shop years ago. Actually, I hadnt seen them before that but thought I could utilize it. Myself, wifey and 3 daughters enjoy it. Perfect home defense as you can turn in a hallway with it shouldered. The sights although awkward have been effective for me. I really wish it had a last round bolt hold open feature, and I wish they offered one built on the xd platform (not a glock fan).
     

    M. Sage

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    Excellent.

    Someone ran one at a Texas Tactical match I went to and it didn't hiccup once, which is a lot more than I can say for some other rifles that I've never seen make it through similar matches. I really want one for a backpacking gun, and don't see how it would be a bad choice for a home defense rifle.
     

    Glockster69

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    Someone's hunting a Cabela's card. ;-)

    Good read / info and I appreciate it. Interesting you posted that today, if I make it to the Houston gun show this weekend, a carbine is one of my 2 top priorities. Like Charlie, I would prefer .45 ACP.

    What .45 carbine do y'all recommend? Obviously being a Glock guy, interchangeable mags would be huge plus.
     

    Charlie

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    'Top of the hill, Kerr County!
    ................... Like Charlie, I would prefer .45 ACP.

    What .45 carbine do y'all recommend? Obviously being a Glock guy, interchangeable mags would be huge plus.

    I have the Beretta CX4 in .45 for sale in the classifieds and my understanding is there are conversions for allowing a higher capacity mag. I'm just not ready to do the conversion.
     

    matefrio

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    Current offerings in .45 acp I'm aware of:

    KRISS carbine (Glock 21 Magazines)

    Hi-Point Carbine (Propitiatory Mags)

    HK USC (HK Pistol Mags)

    Beretta CX4 (Beretta Pistol Mags)

    Auto-Ordance Thompson clone (Thompson MG Mags)

    Few 1911 conversions for 1911 frames that turn them into carbines.

    MAC "rifles"

    Feather Arms - Still in business???

    Discontinued

    MSAR in 45 acp? don't know if was ever produced. They took Glock Mags though.

    The Marlin Camp 45 takes 1911 magazines.
     

    shortdogg2k05

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    I have had mine for about 8 years and love it. No problems with it at all. I have not modded it yet but I will be mounting a forend grip top and bottom rails and a quick detach red dot.
     

    M. Sage

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    I have the Beretta CX4 in .45 for sale in the classifieds and my understanding is there are conversions for allowing a higher capacity mag. I'm just not ready to do the conversion.

    I don't know if there are in .45. I only think there are conversions for the 9 and 40 rifles.

    But I could be wrong.
     

    shipwreck

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    Not sure why anyone would go for a bullpup in a pistol cal, when it the rifle cal would be the same size.
    .223 > .45

    Dang, did not know that. Are they still going to continue operations or are they done? I don't really want my STG-556 to become a "collectible"

    I doubt it. They haven't actually made any new guns in a couple of years. The topic has been discussed at length on various forums, but it appears that they cranked out a ton of rifles in a short period of time. Then never made anymore. They also cut the price in almost 1/2. And, this upset many people who had bought the gun previous to that. Plus, tones of gun stores and distributors who had guns at the original price were then stuck with $1700+ guns when you could buy them new, retail for $1k or less.

    Getting parts for them is tough now too. I saw this coming and sold mine in the summer of 2010. The company has been in trouble for a while now.
     
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