Utah CFP and Texas LTC Reciprocity and FFL Transfers

[ScottDLS]

So anyone with a LTC can claim to be a volunteer emergency service personnel and cross 30/06/07 signs with a defense to prosecution, you claim. I would find that may not fly in court but I don't plan on being the test case.

I don't think there ever will be a "test case" as someone would have to be discovered, asked to leave while the management simultaneously calls the police, who arrive in time to evaluate the situation and issue a citation or arrest a person for a class C misdemeanor for which they have a clear defense. Then the city or JP court attorney would have to decide to pursue the case for the $200 / no jail class C. Defendant should ask for a jury trial, and make a motion to raise the defense of being a volunteer emergency services provider. The prosecution would then have to prove to the jury beyond a reasonable doubt that they were not. Of course the case would have no precedential value as it would be held in JP court not in an appellate court. I am a VESP. Prove I'm not... beyond a reasonable doubt...to a jury of my peers.

 

[ScottDLS]

No, Peace Officers aren't carrying a handgun via Chapter 411, Sub-chapter H. also Texas CCP Article. 2.1305. CARRYING WEAPON ON CERTAIN PREMISES. (a) An establishment serving the public may not prohibit or otherwise restrict a peace officer or special investigator from carrying on the establishment's premises a weapon that the peace officer or special investigator is otherwise authorized to carry, regardless of whether the peace officer or special investigator is engaged in the actual discharge of the officer's or investigator's duties while carrying the weapon.

That clause is not in the Penal Code and while it could result in a civil penalty for the business, it would theoretically not protect a peace officer from prosecution if you believe that anyone with a LTC is automatically carrying under authority of same. That premise is absurd, which is why a peace officer or a citizen with a LTC is not carrying under the authority of it, if they do not require that authority to lawfully carry. The alternative would be a situation where a person without LTC could carry in a situation where a person with one could not. That makes no sense. As a practical matter, no one is ever going to find out because no such case on a $200 no jail class C misdemeanor is ever going to go to court.

 

[ldaniel]

Yeah, The CCP thing, the Manager of the premises can tell them to get off their property because of their LTC, then the Officer can start the paperwork to get them fined $1000. Maybe the manager would then say, No need for that, Come on in!!!!. I have a badge and a LTC, even though I can't find anything in the law, I believe the Badge trumps the LTC. As far as I am concerned, as soon as I got the badge, I am carrying under State law regarding peace officers, etc. The law 30.06 and .07 state in the beginning "...under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code..." and I am not. Oh well, No big deal.

 

[Renegade]

Yeah, The CCP thing, the Manager of the premises can tell them to get off their property because of their LTC, then the Officer can start the paperwork to get them fined $1000. Maybe the manager would then say, No need for that, Come on in!!!!. I have a badge and a LTC, even though I can't find anything in the law, I believe the Badge trumps the LTC. As far as I am concerned, as soon as I got the badge, I am carrying under State law regarding peace officers, etc. The law 30.06 and .07 state in the beginning "...under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code..." and I am not. Oh well, No big deal.

Please explain the fine. First I have heard of this.

Texas law allows multiple ways to legally carry - badge, ltc, traveling, etc. There is no written hierarchy, just common sense.

If you have a handgun and a license in your possession, you are carrying under LTC authority that is written. Again common sense needs to be applied.

 

[ScottDLS]

Please explain the fine. First I have heard of this.

Texas law allows multiple ways to legally carry - badge, ltc, traveling, etc. There is no written hierarchy, just common sense.

If you have a handgun and a license in your possession, you are carrying under LTC authority that is written. Again common sense needs to be applied.

There is a civil statute that provides for fining a business for denying service/entry to a peace officer based on the fact that she is carrying a weapon. The civil penalty is $1000.

 

[ScottDLS]

Yeah, The CCP thing, the Manager of the premises can tell them to get off their property because of their LTC, then the Officer can start the paperwork to get them fined $1000. Maybe the manager would then say, No need for that, Come on in!!!!. I have a badge and a LTC, even though I can't find anything in the law, I believe the Badge trumps the LTC. As far as I am concerned, as soon as I got the badge, I am carrying under State law regarding peace officers, etc. The law 30.06 and .07 state in the beginning "...under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code..." and I am not. Oh well, No big deal.

My whole point is that the idea that someone must be carrying under the authority of their LTC, just because they have one, is absurd. If cop has a LTC and carries past a 30.06/7 sign, they are not violating the law.

 

[Renegade]

There is a civil statute that provides for fining a business for denying service/entry to a peace officer based on the fact that she is carrying a weapon. The civil penalty is $1000.

Oh OK I did not see anything like that in the 30.0x section; just they cannot be charged criminally. Was unaware of civil law.

THX

 

[leVieux]

Generally, you are not carrying under authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, if you are not carrying your license.

Sec. 30.07. TRESPASS BY LICENSE HOLDER WITH AN OPENLY CARRIED HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder:
(1) openly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another without effective consent;

<>

Our Legislators continue their servility to industry Lobbyists and special-interest Lawyers, instead of protecting the Constitutional RIGHTS of the American People, their constituents..

Just consider the unwise and irrational restrictions granted our “Hospital Industry”, “Educational Institutions”, or even the Post Office.

When will OUR representatives in Congress & State Legislatures begin representing their constituents ?

leVieux

<>

 

[leVieux]

Please explain the fine. First I have heard of this.

Texas law allows multiple ways to legally carry - badge, ltc, traveling, etc. There is no written hierarchy, just common sense.

If you have a handgun and a license in your possession, you are carrying under LTC authority that is written. Again common sense needs to be applied.

<>

Perchance, is Renegade a Texas Attorney ?

<?>

 

[rogerdmillerco]

Maybe I'm terrible at google and forum search, but it wasn't easy for me to find this information, so I figured I'd post here for anyone that might be clueless like me.

While it seems like it might be common sense, I honestly wasn't positive, so I checked a few places to be sure.

Context: I moved here from Utah and have a Utah CFP. I am now a resident of Texas and have Texas ID.

I was told FFL transfers, transfer fees, and background checks are completely separate things from carry reciprocity laws/regulation. I'll still have to pay for background checks and won't likely get the discounted FFL transfer fees when applicable.

Conclusion: Gonna sign up to get a Texas LTC.

UPDATE: After some discussion in this thread, I believe I still misunderstood things. I was likely assuming I'd have to pay for background checks here because we had to in Utah (unless you had a CFP). Again, thank you TGT community for the back and forth.

if you are applying for a license to carry I Texas you do to have to pay for the background check or the check upon renewing.

 

[ywwuyi]

Conclusion: Gonna sign up to get a Texas LTC.

There's another Utah thing: if you cease to become a Utah resident AND become a resident of a state which honours Utah nonresident CFP (which is the case for TX), you MUST possess home state permit to keep your Utah permit as nonresident - Utah does not want people to use UT CFP to circumvent other state's permitting regulations.

 

[leVieux]

There's another Utah thing: if you cease to become a Utah resident AND become a resident of a state which honours Utah nonresident CFP (which is the case for TX), you MUST possess home state permit to keep your Utah permit as nonresident - Utah does not want people to use UT CFP to circumvent other state's permitting regulations.

<>

Just more ‘’PUNISH THE INNOCENT’’ B-S.

I used to admire Utah; but the Romney/Marriott chicanery has reversed that.

<>

 

[ywwuyi]

Just more ‘’PUNISH THE INNOCENT’’ B-S.

To their credit - they were the only state in the US who lets nonimmigrant nonresidents to possess a LTC just like any other people in the US and they were my only choice.