Utah CFP and Texas LTC Reciprocity and FFL Transfers

[alternative]

In spite of some comments that if you are not actually in possession of your LTC that you are automatically carrying under permitless carry, I haven't seen any definitive proof that such is true. What is true is that the 30.05 "sign" may be an optional sign and that a gun buster may be adequate to substitute for that sign and that permitless carry brought restrictions on long guns that were not present before permitless carry.
Have seen many legal 30.06/07 signs that have included a gunbuster on them now and I assume that these are legal to restrict permitless carry too (Texas Lawshield implies that). Be careful out there as the laws are a mess. A concealed rifle (foldable carbines) fall under no firearms signs now courtesy of permitless carry. No more Keltec sub2000 in a briefcase.

 

[Otto_Mation]

I carry every where that I go. I have an LTC and do not go into establishments that have a 50% alcohol sign or a legal 30.06 sign which is a sign that has at least one inch lettering and is in English and Spanish. I also stay off of Post office and other named prohibited properties. All other signs, I walk right past.

This keeps it simple for me.

 

[ScottDLS]

In spite of some comments that if you are not actually in possession of your LTC that you are automatically carrying under permitless carry, I haven't seen any definitive proof that such is true. What is true is that the 30.05 "sign" may be an optional sign and that a gun buster may be adequate to substitute for that sign and that permitless carry brought restrictions on long guns that were not present before permitless carry.
Have seen many legal 30.06/07 signs that have included a gunbuster on them now and I assume that these are legal to restrict permitless carry too (Texas Lawshield implies that). Be careful out there as the laws are a mess. A concealed rifle (foldable carbines) fall under no firearms signs now courtesy of permitless carry. No more Keltec sub2000 in a briefcase.

If that is the case, then a peace officer on duty or otherwise is violating 30.06/7 if she also has a LTC.

 

[ScottDLS]

I carry every where that I go. I have an LTC and do not go into establishments that have a 50% alcohol sign or a legal 30.06 sign which is a sign that has at least one inch lettering and is in English and Spanish. I also stay off of Post office and other named prohibited properties. All other signs, I walk right past.

This keeps it simple for me.

I have an LTC and I carry anywhere not prohibited by 46.03. 30.06/7 signs don't apply to volunteer emergency response personnel. That term is not defined clearly in TXPC, so I've decided that I am one. Perhaps some city attorney will prove (beyond a reasonable doubt) to a jury that I am not a VERP in my JP court trial for a $200 citation.

 

[jimbo]

Great added info. Thanks!

I think it's up to the FFL on whether or not they want to provide a discount for Texas LTC. For example, LoneStar Handgun has a price for Texas LTC and a separate price for non-LTC.

My FFL guy also gives this discount. Price for LTC holders and Veterans is $15

 

[oldwisemonk]

If that is the case, then a peace officer on duty or otherwise is violating 30.06/7 if she also has a LTC.

I'm guessing there are a couple statutes that just overrule all of these when it comes to peace officers on duty.

I have an LTC and I carry anywhere not prohibited by 46.03. 30.06/7 signs don't apply to volunteer emergency response personnel. That term is not defined clearly in TXPC, so I've decided that I am one. Perhaps some city attorney will prove (beyond a reasonable doubt) to a jury that I am not a VERP in my JP court trial for a $200 citation.

I don't know what you're talking about. I haven't even met you and it seems to me that you qualify, based on both of these:

46.01:
(18) "Volunteer emergency services personnel" includes a volunteer firefighter, an emergency medical services volunteer as defined by Section 773.003, Health and Safety Code, and any individual who, as a volunteer, provides services for the benefit of the general public during emergency situations.

773.003:
(13) "Emergency medical services volunteer" means emergency medical services personnel who provide emergency prehospital care without remuneration, except reimbursement for expenses.

 

[toddnjoyce]

I'm guessing there are a couple statutes that just overrule all of these when it comes to peace officers on duty.


I don't know what you're talking about. I haven't even met you and it seems to me that you qualify, based on both of these:

46.01:
(18) "Volunteer emergency services personnel" includes a volunteer firefighter, an emergency medical services volunteer as defined by Section 773.003, Health and Safety Code, and any individual who, as a volunteer, provides services for the benefit of the general public during emergency situations.

773.003:
(13) "Emergency medical services volunteer" means emergency medical services personnel who provide emergency prehospital care without remuneration, except reimbursement for expenses.

TPC 46.01 is the DTP provided in 30.06/.07. The pertinent text is “and any individual who, as a volunteer, provides services for the benefit of the general public during emergency situations.”

 

[oldwisemonk]

TPC 46.01 is the DTP provided in 30.06/.07. The pertinent text is “and any individual who, as a volunteer, provides services for the benefit of the general public during emergency situations.”

Yes. Considering how vague both definitions are, I think any one of us can claim he/she is a volunteer emergency services person.

 

[General Zod]

TPC 46.01 is the DTP provided in 30.06/.07. The pertinent text is “and any individual who, as a volunteer, provides services for the benefit of the general public during emergency situations.”

Well, then, I'm hereby offering my services as an emergency graphic designer should the need arise. For the benefit of the general public. Visual communication can be the difference between life and death, you know.

 

[MountainGirl]

 

[oldwisemonk]

Well, then, I'm hereby offering my services as an emergency graphic designer should the need arise. For the benefit of the general public. Visual communication can be the difference between life and death, you know.

Dante: "The darkest places of hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

@General Zod : "Consider the design work taken care of."

Everyone: "Thank you!"

 

[Steve In Texas]

Yes. Considering how vague both definitions are, I think any one of us can claim he/she is a volunteer emergency services person.

Your mileage may vary, but I also carry equipment and supplies.

 

[General Zod]

View attachment 413554
Your mileage may vary, but I also carry equipment and supplies.

Yeah, but I could give that certificate a much cleaner layout.

 

[Coiled]

@Coiled - is there carry signage at Florida's?

I dont wanna call and ask - it might spook them that a gang of well armed banditos are gonna show up.

Business Name	Category	Address	City	Type	Location	Valid	Comments	Date	Username
Florida's Kitchen Map Report	Restaurant	796 FM 350 S	Livingston	30.07 Sign	Front door	No	Lettering too small. 2 additional comments	2016-08-25	nunya

I am at Florida's and there are NO gun related signs of any kind.

MG, more info to you later.

 

[majormadmax]

A big one is being able to walk past non-30.06/30.07 anti-firearms signage. The 30.05 law is so vaguely worded a hand-drawn "gun buster" sign might be construed as valid for restricting unlicensed carry. With your LTC, all you have to watch for is the compliant signage.

Plus, it's something that shows up when the police run your license should you be pulled over. I've had interactions with cops go much smoother because I'm a licensed carrier - including one where the officer and I started talking about carry pistols and he lost interest in writing me a citation.

And if you ever get stuck needing to provide more than one form of picture ID...well, your LTC is a state-issued identification card and will fit the bill.

I'm sure there's others, but these factors are enough to make it worth my $40 every few years.

Another big one is reciprocity with other states...

State Reciprocity Information | Department of Public Safety

www.dps.texas.gov

 

[alternative]

If that is the case, then a peace officer on duty or otherwise is violating 30.06/7 if she also has a LTC.

Then EMS are also violating 06/07. No, I don't know if leaving your LTC card at home automatically means you are carrying by permitless carry. I guess we have to wait and see if there is a case. Actually when you think about it, why would you have to leave your LTC at home? No law says you have to have a drivers license on you unless you are driving and supposedly if LEO asks for drivers license you must show LTC as well. Asking for a drivers license if you are not driving does not automatically mean you must show LTC if you are not carrying a drivers license. So theoretically you could be carrying either way with an LTC in your wallet and permitless carry. All theoretical as I don't know if there is established case law.
So, there is an 06/07 sign and I don't have my drivers license but have an LTC in my wallet. Violation or not? I don't know. LEO asks and I say permitless carry and no 30.05 or gunbuster. I don't have to show my LTC. Legal experts? What say you?

 

[majormadmax]

Yes. Considering how vague both definitions are, I think any one of us can claim he/she is a volunteer emergency services person.

I would not be so quick to assume a CPR card makes someone a "volunteer emergency services person" and I sure as hell wouldn't stake my defense on it!

I know the law as written is a bit vague, but I believe the intent is for those who are an actually member of a volunteer group of some sort which provides emergency services (i.e. VFDs, TXSG, etc.).

 

[alternative]

Can volunteer emergency services person carry past 05/06/07 in a non-emergency situation?

 

[oldwisemonk]

Then EMS are also violating 06/07

I think EMS are specifically stated as being defensible in 06/07 (section f-1 in 30.06 and g-1 in 30.07), whereas peace officers are not. That's why I mentioned there are probably statutes pertaining to peace officers that overrule all of these.

But I'm no lawyer, so I could be way off.

 

[oldwisemonk]

Can volunteer emergency services person carry past 05/06/07 in a non-emergency situation?

It's 5:00 an emergency somewhere!