Beretta Haters

[Outbreak]

I got the idea from the Glock Haters thread, when a few people mentioned they hate the Beretta 92 series.

I hear a lot of this at work- I'm Active Duty Air Force.

Someone is always talking about "I love my 1911/Glock/XD/Sig/etc... Way better than that piece of shit M9."

I am primarily a Sig guy, but I really love the 92 series. They're just as reliable as a Glock or one of my Sigs, in my experience. They're good looking, for one- few know how to make a better looking firearm than the Italians. They're quite comfortable, point naturally, and they're plenty accurate. I've run mine in IPSC in West Texas dust storms, magazines dropped in the dust and slammed home in the gun, shooting fast- never jammed.

I've actually heard it said that they're the most attacked service pistol in history, and therefore some of the most tested guns around. Hell, I qualified Expert Marksman with guns that are stored in a 50cal ammo can and cleaned by retards who literally don't know which end of the cleaning rod to use.

I understand some old folks are still bitter the military switched from the 1911, but there can't be many people left in the military that were around when the 1911 was the service pistol, so I can't be hearing them complaining.

So why the Beretta hate?

 

[TexasRedneck]

Because the 9mm is an underperforming cartridge - especially in the military setting. The brass forgot the hard lessons learned on the battlefield many years ago, and made a selection based on politics rather than military need.

Glad ya asked?<G>

 

[M. Sage]

About the only thing I really hate about it is the safety/decocker (you don't need a safety if you have a decocker, and you can't carry the pistol cocked and locked. The safety is pointless). It's location is idiotic and the fact that you push up to fire is equally idiotic.

The original design (which is still produced by Taurus) is superior. Frame-mounted safety that you push down for fire is superior.

They also got a horrible reputation for having weak frames and slides. This has supposedly been rectified, but the earlier M9s were actually dangerous to fire.

 

[Texas42]

I liked Beretta 92FS, but not enought ot keep it. It was a pretty accurate gun. but its a big heavy gun. Probably the main reason I think the Beretta is an inferior choice for the military.
From Glock's website:

"weight. At 21.175 oz., empty, the Glock 17 (referring to its magazine capacity) compares favorably with its competition. The HK P7 weighs 27.5 oz., the SIG-Sauer P226 is 26.25 oz., the Steyr GB is 29.6 oz., the Beretta 92SB is 34.5 oz. and the venerable Colt M1911 A1 is almost twice as heavy at 39.5 oz. Loaded with a full magazine (also made of plastic) of 17 rounds, the Glock pistol weighs only 30.1 oz"

Any Polymer pistol would be a much lighter option, which is important for a secondary weapon.

 

[45tex]

I don't see the need to hate Berretta or Glock. They are different approaches to the same end. Both are fine makers. The one that works for you, or the one you are made to learn is right for you. I agree with the above in that the 9mm leaves much to desire in the life taking department. Its always been said that military weapons were designed to wound rather than kill. Thus the crappy ball ammo. For terrorist fighting this policy needs to be looked at again.
If no other is available I'd be willing to carry either.

 

[majormadmax]

I am a 92F hater, it's too big (especially the grip), heavy, and its round capacity is pretty poor for a pistol of its size.

As for the 9mm, it is the NATO standard which is why (most) US forces carry it. Also, thanks to the Hague Convention of 1896, which made it a war crime to use bullets that expand or fragment within the human body, JHPs cannot be used by the military forces of any of the signatory countries (to include the US).

I was a 9mm hater for many years thanks to the 92F, it wasn't until I traded a Kel Tec P3AT for a Taurus PT111 that I reconsidered my view of that round. I now have a PT709 Slim that is an excellent BUG; but for primary carry I still prefer the .45 ACP in JHP form.

Cheers! M2

 

[Outbreak]

The 9mm part doesn't bother me. I carry 9mm JHP every day, and wouldn't volunteer to stand downrange even with ball ammo. Don't know many who would.

I'll agree it should hold more than 15 rounds, just like the 1911 should hold more than 7.

The weight is something I like. I've carried the M9 deployed. The weight doesn't bother me there, but at the range is where I truly appreciate that big heavy gun. Low recoil, quick follow ups.

 

[shipwreck]

Well, the haters will hate me... I have 5 variants...

My regular 92FS with factory night sights has been my daily concealed carry for the past 14 months. At the 3 o'clock position, it conceals great. I'm not a huge guy either - 180lbs, 6'1"

With Hogue rubber grip panels, the gun is perfect. It is also the only gun that I feel very comfortable with shooting 1 handed.

 

[robin303]

What is the difference in all those there shipwreck.

 

[308nato]

I have a 92 FS in stainless now for many years and would not sell it or trade it for anything out there.
fits my hands just fine , smooth trigger on double or single action.

 

[TexasRedneck]

Try that Inox in a Model 96.....they're SWEET!

 

[cseale86]

I think part of the reason the Beretta 92's caught on so well with the military, law enforcement, etc. is because someone with little or no previous training can learn to shoot the pistol very well in a very short period of time.Due to the relatively low recoil and long sight radius it makes the 92 hit the target with little effort.

 

[shipwreck]

What is the difference in all those there shipwreck.

In that pic above... The one at 12 o'clock is a standard 92FS.

The one at 2pm is a 92A1 - the newest Beretta variant. It has a rail and curved trigger guard. The slide is a little thicker, it has a recoil buffer in the frame, and it has dovetailed sights (no built in frot sight)

At 5pm is a M9A1. A railed Beretta. It also has checkering on the front and backstrap. The magwell is also beveled.

At 7pm is a 90-Two. Same internals as a 92A1. The design came out 4.5 years ago. But, the grip is different. It is a 1 piece polymer grip.

And at 10pm, is a duplicate M9A1. One is for carry, and the other is a range only gun.

I alternate between a 92FS and an M9A1, depending on my mood.

 

[shipwreck]

Try that Inox in a Model 96.....they're SWEET!

I generally prefer stainless or silver finished guns. But the Beretta is the only gun that I only like in black. I owned an Inox once in the 1990s, but the black ones really interest me.

 

[308nato]

I think part of the reason the Beretta 92's caught on so well with the military, law enforcement, etc. is because someone with little or no previous training can learn to shoot the pistol very well in a very short period of time.Due to the relatively low recoil and long sight radius it makes the 92 hit the target with little effort.

And the take down for cleaning is so simple even a cave man could do it.

 

[majormadmax]

No hate for someone who owns and loves the 92F, it's a firearm and variety is the spice of life. If it makes you happy, then everything's cool. I am just saying I don't care for them, never have and probably never will. I will pick one up at a show everyone once and a while and that reminds me why I don't like them.

There are many firearms I am not endeared by, but that doesn't mean they don't appeal to others.

I'm glad you enjoy your 92Fs!

Cheers! M2

 

[Texas1911]

I think they are a decent gun. Long sight radius, fairly reliable, easy to be accurate with, soft recoil, etc. but I have seen our rental 92FS have a number of big parts break, like the slide ... more than once. It would not be my first choice for a military weapon.

 

[IXLR8]

The only 92 I ever shot had constant FTFeed. I was forever shaking it upside down to get the round out. Like 4 out of 10 rounds. It left a bad taste in my mouth. I doubt that any service weapon could perform so poorly and be accepted. The one I used must have had a major malfunction, but it still left me with a very bad impression.
+100 on ease of clearing a round though...

 

[Texasjack]

A gunsmith told me years ago that the Taurus version of the 92 was better than the Beretta because the heat treating on the slide was better. That was back when they were having so much problems with the Beretta slides cracking.

I agree with the other posts about the problem not being the M9 so much as the 9 mm. But the 9 mm is easier for women to qualify with. Besides, the attitude of the military planners has always been that pistols only get used as a last resort.

There may be individual models I don't care for, but I think most of the major manufacturers produce some good quality weapons. Beretta has certainly been in business for a long, long time and there's a valid reason for that.

 

[ROGER4314]

My lady, Bonnie bought a Berretta Tomcat in 32acp. She carried it for a while until I gave her a Glock 26 9MM which is her carry gun, now. We heard all kinds of funky things about the Tomcat including cracking of frames but we never had any problems with it and it's still ticking right along.

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