British Soldier Hacked To Death and Beheaded - in LONDON

[Jakashh]

And don't forget about Muslims who want to kill Muslims who want to kill "Muslims" who want to kill other Muslims and non-Muslims?

You lost me at "And".

The 2nd Amendment does not have a holy book that says:

The Quran's Verses of Violence

TheReligionofPeace - Islam: Taqiyya and Lying

"Taqiyya" was implemented when Muslims were being persecuted and killed by "infidels" way back in the day. Taqiyya basically states that if your life is at risk for being a Muslim, you can either lie and say you're not a Muslim if it can help save your life, or you can admit that you're a Muslim and face the consequences. It's basically saying you can lie about not being a Muslim if it can save your life from oppressors.

For example. I have cousins in Pakistan who are Shi'ite. The extremist Pakistan Taliban threatens them, basically all Shi'ites that if they don't convert, they will be killed.

Shi'ites in Pakistan, such as my cousins, can do "Taqiyya" and lie that they've converted to the extremist ways of the Taliban in order to save their own lives. Or they can fight. If they choose to fight and die fighting for their religion, that is considered true "Jihad", which is to die in the defense of your religion.

 

[Jakashh]

Also, your out of context snippets from that obviously biased website have no backing. Here's a website that explains some of that.

http://www.muslimaccess.com/articles/jihad/kill_the_infidels.asp

Understanding the verses' historical context is crucial, not to confine them to their context, but for a proper comprehension of their implications. Moreover, as shown previously, the verse must be interpreted along with all the other verses explicating how a Muslim should deal with others, Muslim or non-Muslim, including verse (8:61), "And if they incline to peace, then incline to it and trust in God; surely He is the Hearing, the Knowing."

The worst thing to do with the Quran is to approach it seeking confirmation for what one already believes in and turning a blind eye to any evidence that is inconsistent with his/her pre-conceived attitudes and biases. Anyone can find in the Quran whatever he/she wants to prove. Anyone can do the same thing with the Bible. The challenge, however, is to make a judgment only after a thorough and exhaustive investigation of all available Quranic evidence.

The Quranic principle for dealing with the 'other' non-Muslim is clear from verses (60:8-9), "God does not forbid you respecting those who have not made war against you on account of your religion, and have not driven you forth from your homes, that you show them kindness and deal with them justly; surely God loves the doers of justice. God only forbids you respecting and loving those who made war upon you on account of your religion, and drove you forth from your homes and backed up others in your expulsion, that you make friends with them, and whoever makes friends with them, these are the unjust." The Quran does not present Islam as a religion of unquestionable pacifism or relentless aggression. Those who do not transgress should be treated humanely and benevolently with complete respect. Those who transgress should be fought, "And fight in the cause of God those who fight against you, and do not commit aggression. Indeed God does not love those who are aggressors," (2:190). In other words, Islam is a religion of peace, not in the sense that it is pacifist, but in the sense that Muslims can and should co-exist peacefully with others who respect them. Neither transgression is permitted nor forcing others to espouse Islam as the Quran says, "there is no compulsion in religion," (2:256).

 

[Younggun]

I only hope to be able to troll like Hoji someday. It's so obvious that no one could be that narrow minded and arrogant yet he really makes you believe it.

 

[Jakashh]

Lol. And just for the record, here is the rest of the quote from the Quran that most people like to cut up and take snippets out of. The boldened part is what is left out, the part in red is what is usually taken out of the full quote to pass around and make people think that we're out to get them lol.

Does the koran teach to kill, tax or convert infidels?

"And fight in the cause of Allah with those who fight with you, and do not exceed the limits, surely Allah does not love those who exceed the limits. And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from where they drove you out and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque (in Makkah) until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the reward of the unbelievers. But if they desist, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah, but if they desist, then there should be no hostility except against the oppressors." (Qur'an, 2:190-192)

Anyway, this thread has gone WAY off topic, so I am done for now lol.

 

[Glockster69]

The 2nd Amendment does not have a holy book that says:

The Quran's Verses of Violence

TheReligionofPeace - Islam: Taqiyya and Lying

TheReligionofPeace - About this Site

Before I read either of your provided links I went to their About Us page. They're are not objective and therefore not a worthy source of info, IMO.

 

[Hoji]

Where in the Quran does it say to kill the infidels? - Yahoo! Answers


Again, as someone else posted, you can take the Bible and find things that are violent. But then you have the New Testament, where the basic premise is love thy neighbor.

Comments from Former Muslims - WikiIslam

 

[Jakashh]

Where in the Quran does it say to kill the infidels? - Yahoo! Answers


Again, as someone else posted, you can take the Bible and find things that are violent. But then you have the New Testament, where the basic premise is love thy neighbor.

Did you read post #24? This kinda backs it up with actual full quotes from the Quran... Puts it in historical context as well.

Does the koran teach to kill, tax or convert infidels?

 

[recoveringyankee]

Did you read post #24? This kinda backs it up with actual full quotes from the Quran... Puts it in historical context as well.

Does the koran teach to kill, tax or convert infidels?

What are "the limits" refered to in your quote in post 24?

 

[hkusp1]

 

[Jakashh]

What are "the limits" refered to in your quote in post 24?

If I had to guess, i'd say rules of engagement and a code of conduct for fighting against oppressors. Quite contrary to popular believe, we are NOT allowed to burn/kill/rape farmland, livestock, innocents, and women and children, as some would have you believe.

The first battles the Muslims waged were in self-defense. They were disciplined and adhered to strict codes of conduct. Noncombatants, including women and children were not targeted. Furthermore, the Muslims avoided destroying property, livestock, and trees.

 

[itchin]

I believe you. I had 2 Muslim neighbors and they were nice and outgoing. They were huge George Bush fans. The context of that script as read complete from beginning to end IMO is opposite of murdering non believers. It is basically rules of engagement. You take out that key sentence and I can see how it could be misinterpreted.

 

[Das Jared]

Gitem jackass

sent from my dishwasher

 

[Mic]

I believe you. I had 2 Muslim neighbors and they were nice and outgoing. They were huge George Bush fans. The context of that script as read complete from beginning to end IMO is opposite of murdering non believers. It is basically rules of engagement. You take out that key sentence and I can see how it could be misinterpreted.

That's because George Bush funded Osama Bin Laden to support 911. Of course they liked him.

 

[hkusp1]

Saw this coming.

 

[itchin]

Lol naw I believe they were oppressed by sadam Hussein.

 

[Jakashh]

haha Sadam was an ass. Genocide against my sect of Muslims.

 

[RstyShcklfrd]

that's because george bush funded osama bin laden to support 911. Of course they liked him.

lol.

 

[Dcav]

Thats enough of all this then.