Is this a handgun?

Vellcrow

Active Member
Aug 8, 2008
406
18
Pflugerville


According to the BATF, the Mossberg 500 Cruiser pictured above, is a handgun and cannot be sold to people under 21 years of age.

When did this change take affect?
 

Vellcrow

Active Member
Aug 8, 2008
406
18
Pflugerville
WHere does the BATFE say that?
I was reorganizing our overstock room at Red's today, and noticed that all the Mossberg shotgun boxes that contained pistol grip-only shotguns had stickers saying "ATF has classified this as a handgun and cannot be sold to people under 21 years of age".

When I asked one of our managers about it, he said that ATF did rule these as handguns since they cannot be fired from the shoulder.

If you can find me the exact definition that would dispute this, I would appreciate it.

Here is a thread on THR about a similar situation: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=4376537

On another site: http://forum.pafoa.org/rifles-42/47907-need-ask-few-qeustions-about-ak47-pistol-grip-mossberg.html
 

Old Man of the Mountain

Active Member
BANNED!!!
Jan 5, 2009
327
16
If the Illegal Criminal Conspiracy that is called the BATF has ruled that to be a pistol, then have they also dropped the 18" minimum barrel length?
 

Vellcrow

Active Member
Aug 8, 2008
406
18
Pflugerville
If the Illegal Criminal Conspiracy that is called the BATF has ruled that to be a pistol, then have they also dropped the 18" minimum barrel length?
THAT is exactly the question I want to ask the ATF. If it is ruled as a handgun, I can cut the barrel down as short as I want...

Here is another thread: http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-106559.html

Here is a quote from another website:

Shotguns with pistol grips and no
shoulder stocks attached were restricted to
persons 21 years of age or older if being sold by a
Federal firearms licensee. This requirement is
specified in 27 CFR § 178.99(b) and 18 U.S.C.
922(b)(1), which states that if the firearm to
be transferred is is other than a rifle or shotgun.


Then the purchaser must be 21 years of age. The
definition of a shotgun under the GCA [18 U.S.C.
§ 921(a)(5)] is a weapon ieintended to be fired
from the shoulder.ld With the pistol grip in lieu of
the shoulder stock, this weapon is not designed to
be fired from the shoulder, and therefore is not a
shotgun.

AGE RESTRICTION REMINDER
Licensees are reminded that certain commercially
produced “shotguns” do not fall within the
definition of shotgun under the GCA. Firearms
such as the Mossberg Model 500 Camper,
Persuader 500 and all other makes and models,
which come equipped with a pistol grip in place
of the butt stock, are not shotguns under the GCA.
Therefore, they cannot be sold or delivered by a
licensee to any person less than 21 years of age.
 

txinvestigator

TGT Addict
May 28, 2008
14,119
113
Ft Worth, TX
Shotguns with pistol grips and no
shoulder stocks attached were restricted to
persons 21 years of age or older if being sold by a
Federal firearms licensee. This requirement is
specified in 27 CFR § 178.99(b) and 18 U.S.C.
922(b)(1), which states that if the firearm to
be transferred is is other than a rifle or shotgun

Then the purchaser must be 21 years of age. The
definition of a shotgun under the GCA [18 U.S.C.
§ 921(a)(5)]


(5) The term “shotgun” means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of an explosive to fire through a smooth bore either a number of ball shot or a single projectile for each single pull of the trigger.

a weapon ieintended to be fired
from the shoulder.ld With the pistol grip in lieu of
the shoulder stock, this weapon is not designed to
be fired from the shoulder, and therefore is not a
shotgun.

AGE RESTRICTION REMINDER
Licensees are reminded that certain commercially
produced “shotguns” do not fall within the
definition of shotgun under the GCA. Firearms
such as the Mossberg Model 500 Camper,
Persuader 500 and all other makes and models,
which come equipped with a pistol grip in place
of the butt stock, are not shotguns under the GCA.
Therefore, they cannot be sold or delivered by a
licensee to any person less than 21 years of age.
Well lets look at that sections definition of "handgun"

(29) The term “handgun” means—
(A) a firearm which has a short stock and is designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand; and
(B) any combination of parts from which a firearm described in subparagraph (A) can be assembled.

I don't find in that section a definition of Pistol, only handgun. The Mossberg in question certainly is not a handgun.


The law does not make that shotgun a handgun. However it IS Other than a rifle or shotgun; therefore it cannot be transferred to a person under 21. USC Title 18, 922(b)(1) states;
(b) It shall be unlawful for any licensed importer, licensed
manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to sell or
deliver -
(1) any firearm or ammunition to any individual who the
licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe is less than
eighteen years of age, and, if the firearm, or ammunition is
other than a shotgun or rifle, or ammunition for a shotgun or
rifle, to any individual who the licensee knows or has reasonable
cause to believe is less than twenty-one years of age.

Just because it is not a rifle or shotgun does not mean it is a handgun.

So, the ATF has NOT determined that the Mossberg is a handgun. Whoever put that sticker on the box jumped to a conclusion; a bad one.
 

M. Sage

TGT Addict
Jan 21, 2009
16,326
36
San Antonio
txinvestigator is right: It's not a rifle or a shotgun. Federal law only allows transfer of rifles or shotguns to those under 21 (from a dealer, of course). But it's not a handgun.

Unlike a handgun, you can put a stock on it and swap it back again all you want. And you can swap out the stock on your shotgun for a pistol grip like that without running into trouble because something like that isn't a handgun.
 

DCortez

TGT Addict
Jan 28, 2009
6,607
36
Houston, Cy-Fair
Had to be a clerical error or paper shuffling mistake.
 
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