Kel-Tec SUB 2000 for Home Defense.

[M. Sage]

A Kel-Tec Sub 2K isn't going to do you much good at 16" -- it's only 16" if you have it folded in half for storage or transport. Unfolded and ready for use, it's a hair more than 29" --the same length as a pistol grip Mossberg 12 or 20 gauge -- and only a few inches shorter than an M1 Carbine. Don't know how long an M1 w/Paratrooper stock is, but is probably shorter than the Kel-Tec. An underfolded stock AK is definitely shorter than a Sub-2K.

If you want short, then why use a 9mm Sub 2K in the first place? Just use a pistol.

If you want "oomph", then a shotgun will do you better than the Sub 2K. If you want capacity or maneuverability (assuming 8 rounds of 12 gauge won't solve the problem), then consider a pistol.

True, the ballistics of a Sub 2K with a 16" barrel reach the optimum for a 9mm round -- but still far way short of a shotgun. The increased sight radius is a plus for longer distances -- but is moot for home defense ranges.

Again, i'm not knocking the Sub 2K (even though the magazines tend to fall out very easily) -- it's fun to plink with. But, I don't think it's the best tool for home defense.

You can't aim a shotgun that doesn't have a stock, and it's real hard to do with a folded rifle. You want a stock.

The Sub2000 is going to be easier to aim under stress than a handgun. Handguns are the hardest type of modern firearm to operate under stress.

 

[M. Sage]

115 grain Remington UMC
9mm Carbine=1232fps-16 in barrel
9mm pistol=1048fps-3inch barrel

Pistol (115X1048^2)/450400=280ft. lbs
Carbine (115X1232^2)/450400=388ft. lbs

Basically, not enough to matter. Advantage with the carbine is going to be entirely in shooting accurately and at speed, and easier training.

 

[kfc903]

I really doubt a 20" shotgun is no harder to maneuver than a 16" carbine. Just saying. The kel tec weighs 4 lbs.

The only thing that bothers me with this being a SD weapon is that it just looks so cheap. But what do you expect at that price point? Never fired one, but it does intrigue me. I'd agree that a 12/20 gauge or rifle caliber is more effective, but how many bad guys will bust down your door with armor on anyways?

It not only looks cheap, but it acts cheap (jamming) and feels cheap. Steer clear. A pistol in any form, carbine or not, is much less lethal than a shotgun or a rifle. Body armor? I don't care if they're shirtless. I want my shotgun loaded with 6 00 Buckshot rounds. The only situation where I want my pistol is when I can't have my rifle or shotgun.

 

[kfc903]

Basically, not enough to matter. Advantage with the carbine is going to be entirely in shooting accurately and at speed, and easier training.

I agree. The manual from the Sub 2000 claims that it produces .357 magnum energy at 50 yards. LIE!

 

[kfc903]

threads almost a year old.

:P

...and?

 

[TheDan]

It not only looks cheap, but it acts cheap (jamming) and feels cheap. Steer clear.

I've never had any issues with mine. It's setup to take Sig mags. I use the 20rd Mecgar ones. Yes, it is a "cheap" gun, but when you consider it's size, light weight, capacity and interesting design, I think that it's high value for the money. I agree something in a rifle caliber would be better, but you don't need a $1000 AR in order to defend yourself.

I can only make two complaints about the Sub2000: The trigger is pretty terrible, and there's really no good way to mount an optic. Nether are show stoppers.

The manual from the Sub 2000 claims that it produces .357 magnum energy at 50 yards. LIE!

Depends on the load. It's not really fair to compare a .357mag fired from a 6in barrel and 9mm fired from a 16in barrel, tho...

...and?

Seems like you've got a beef with Keltec. The owner hit on your mom or something?

 

[kfc903]

They haven' hit my mom, but they have been beating around the bush about getting my rifle back to me for the last two months. I'm sure they are just going to slap some new parts on it and call it fixed like they are known to do. I'll just talk with my wallet by not buying anymore of their products ever again.

 

[thunderstruck]

They haven' hit my mom, but they have been beating around the bush about getting my rifle back to me for the last two months. I'm sure they are just going to slap some new parts on it and call it fixed like they are known to do. I'll just talk with my wallet by not buying anymore of their products ever again.

Soooo.... $25 sound fair?

 

[kabob]

115 grain Remington UMC
9mm Carbine=1232fps-16 in barrel
9mm pistol=1048fps-3inch barrel

Pistol (115X1048^2)/450400=280ft. lbs
Carbine (115X1232^2)/450400=388ft. lbs

If we're talking home defense, why are you using a statistic for a 9mm pistol with a 3" barrel? That's the size of a subcompact. It'd be more accurate to use a full-size pistol's ballistics characteristics. As an example, I have an H&K USP 9mm w/ a jet funnel kit and the 18-rd JF mags as backup for my .45 pistols and carbine.

 

[CanTex]

Well I have had mine for quite some time, I did modify it to accept a red dot scope and it works just fine. Have had issues with only one mag that I own and it has been marked so it is range use only.

Lots say this gun is a good plinker, It is. Lots say it is no good for home defense. My thoughts are, with limited budget, having a gun that you plink with and therefore use a bit more than say your 12/20ga or your "home defense" gun makes it a slightly better option to grab when you have an issue in the home.

I also like the flexibility that having a carbine and pistol using the same mag allows me.

However, knowing my household, it would be more likely, due to the grand kids and wife's views on guns that any intruder in our home would be beaten to death by her, using a baseball bat.

Have a plan, practice it, and improvise when it fails on contact with the enemy........

 

[London]

I'm interested in buying one of these as a city rifle. Having the ability to use the same mags for my rifle, G22, G23, and G27 is very appealing. Anyone know if the trigger can be worked on to improve it, or is it pretty much un-improvable like the triggers in Kel-Tec pistols?