Lynx Defense

Message to S.A. City Council

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  • London

    The advocate's Devil.
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    6   0   0
    Sep 28, 2010
    6,296
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    Twilight Zone
    A few weeks ago it was brought up that San Antonio has weapons codes which violate State preemption laws. I am sending the following message to city council. They do not have an email address so I will have to do this the old fashioned way.

    I submit the following draft to all of you in order to pick out anything I may have missed. I used links provided by TGT members to gather this information, for which I thank all of you who took the time to provide such. Attached at the bottom of this post is a .doc version which is much easier to read.

    ------------------------

    Good morning. It has come to my attention that several San Antonio municipal codes are in direct violation of the Texas constitution which specifically forbids municipalities from enacting weapons laws which are more constrictive than those of the State. Specifically, Chapter 229 of TX Local Government Code (Misc Regulatory Authority of Municiplities) states:


    Sec. 229.001. FIREARMS; EXPLOSIVES. (a) A municipality may not adopt regulations relating to the transfer, private ownership, keeping, transportation, licensing, or registration of firearms, ammunition, or firearm supplies.
    (b) Subsection (a) does not affect the authority a municipality has under another law to:
    (1) require residents or public employees to be armed for personal or national defense, law enforcement, or another lawful purpose;
    (2) regulate the discharge of firearms within the limits of the municipality;
    (3) regulate the use of property, the location of a business, or uses at a business under the municipality's fire code, zoning ordinance, or land-use regulations as long as the code, ordinance, or regulations are not used to circumvent the intent of Subsection (a) or Subdivision (5) of this subsection;
    (4) regulate the use of firearms in the case of an insurrection, riot, or natural disaster if the municipality finds the regulations necessary to protect public health and safety;
    (5) regulate the storage or transportation of explosives to protect public health and safety, except that 25 pounds or less of black powder for each private residence and 50 pounds or less of black powder for each retail dealer are not subject to regulation; or
    (6) regulate the carrying of a firearm by a person other than a person licensed to carry a concealed handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, at a:
    (A) public park;
    (B) public meeting of a municipality, county, or other governmental body;
    (C) political rally, parade, or official political meeting; or
    (D) nonfirearms-related school, college, or professional athletic event.
    (c) The exception provided by Subsection (b)(6) does not apply if the firearm is in or is carried to or from an area designated for use in a lawful hunting, fishing, or other sporting event and the firearm is of the type commonly used in the activity.
    (d) The exception provided by Subsection (b)(4) does not authorize the seizure or confiscation of any firearm or ammunition from an individual who is lawfully carrying or possessing the firearm or ammunition.

    The following municipal codes from the San Antonio TX Code of Ordinances all violate the previous premption law:

    Sec. 21-16. - Carrying loaded rifle or shotgun.

    It shall be unlawful for any person, other than duly authorized peace officers, to carry a loaded rifle or shotgun on any public street within the city or in a motor vehicle while the same is being operated on any public street within the city.

    Sec. 21-17. - Certain knives prohibited generally; exceptions; penalty for violation.

    (a) It shall be unlawful for any person to intentionally or knowingly carry on or about his person a knife with a blade less than five and one-half (5½) inches in length, which knife is equipped with a lock mechanism so that upon opening, it becomes a fixed blade knife.

    (b) The above prohibition set forth in subsection (a) shall not be applicable to a person carrying such a knife:

    (1) In the actual discharge of his duties as a peace officer, a member of the armed forces or national guard, or a guard employed by a penal institution;

    (2) On his own premises or premises under his control;

    (3) Traveling;

    (4) Engaged in lawful hunting, fishing or other lawful sporting activity; or

    (5) Using such a knife in connection with a lawful occupation, during such utilization.

    Sec. 21-154. - Possession of or access to firearm by person under seventeen years of age.

    (a) It shall be unlawful for any person seventeen (17) years of age or older to intentionally, knowingly, recklessly, or with criminal negligence facilitate, suffer, or permit the discharge of a firearm by any person under the age of seventeen (17) by allowing that person to obtain unsupervised access to the firearm.

    (b) It shall be unlawful for any person seventeen (17) years of age or older to intentionally, knowingly, recklessly, or with criminal negligence facilitate, suffer, or permit the physical possession of a firearm by any person under the age of seventeen (17) by allowing that person to obtain unsupervised access to the firearm.

    (c) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under subsections (a) and (b) that:

    (1) The firearm was possessed or discharged at a firing range or an area designated for target practice and was possessed or discharged under the supervision of any person seventeen (17) years of age or older; or

    (2) The access to the firearm was obtained as a result of the commission of a crime; or

    (3) The possession or discharge of the firearm was justified under the provisions of Chapter 9 of the Texas Penal Code; or

    (4) Reasonable precautions under the attendant circumstances were taken to prevent unsupervised access to the firearm by any person under the age of seventeen (17).

    Sec. 21-155. - Possession of knife.

    It shall be unlawful for any person under the age of seventeen (17) to possess or carry any knife on a public roadway or public right-of-way; on any other property in which a governmental entity has an interest; or on private property without the permission of the owner or the person in control of the property within the city limits of the City of San Antonio.

    Sec. 21-156. - Possession of firearm restricted.

    (a) It shall be unlawful for any person under the age of seventeen (17) to carry a firearm on a public roadway or public right-of-way; on any other property in which a governmental entity has an interest; or on private property without the permission of the owner or person in control of the property within the city limits of the City of San Antonio.

    (b) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution for a violation of this provision that: The firearm is being carried at a firing range or an area designated for target practice.

    (c) Law enforcement officers authorized to enforce this article are hereby authorized to seize any firearms in the possession of any person under the age of seventeen (17) in the city limits of the City of San Antonio where there is probable cause to believe said firearms are being or will be used in the commission of a crime or where they pose a danger to said persons or others. The firearms shall be held by the San Antonio Police Department and released only to an adult who can demonstrate ownership. This provision will serve to prevent those under the age of seventeen from harming themselves or others. Firearms not claimed within ninety (90) days shall be destroyed.

    (d) A letter shall be sent by the Department of Community Initiatives to the parent(s) or guardian(s) of any person charged under this section advising of the charge and asking for their cooperation in better supervising the child.

    Please advise as to what actions will be taken to remove these unconstitutional laws from the Code of Ordinances as well as their enforcement by all law enforcement operating inside the city limits. Thank you.
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    Attachments

    • SA uncons.jpg
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    cuate

    Well-Known
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jan 27, 2009
    1,842
    21
    Comanche Co., Texas
    I wish for your letter to the SA Daddies to bring forth a renewed attention to Texas Statutes and the waste basket with SA's...Leaving ethnic discussion out of this post I would have to assume that gangbangers, punks, and thugs in SA are plentiful as well as a shameful crime rate. This in mind, in all probability the City Fathers being composed by a majority of liberals and anti-gun do gooders, hatched this plan to supposedly combat that crime rate and conveniently ignoring the 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution. Should I ever visit SA again, I will carry anything that is legal by definition in the Texas & US Statutes. But I won't wave it in their faces unless to protect, life, liberty, and my property !
     

    txinvestigator

    TGT Addict
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    0   0   0
    May 28, 2008
    14,204
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    Ft Worth, TX
    I would change my intro to eliminate the word "weapons" and substitute "firearms and explosives."

    Also, I would remove all the comments and quotes of laws pertaining to knives, as the Texas preemption law has nothing to do with knives.
     
    Rating - 100%
    9   0   0
    Aug 17, 2010
    7,576
    96
    Austin
    I would change my intro to eliminate the word "weapons" and substitute "firearms and explosives."

    Also, I would remove all the comments and quotes of laws pertaining to knives, as the Texas preemption law has nothing to do with knives.

    +1 The knife ordinance is legal, just really stupid.
     

    London

    The advocate's Devil.
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Sep 28, 2010
    6,296
    96
    Twilight Zone
    The mention of knives has been removed. Anyone have any ideas about how to get that thrown out, too?

    The operator at City Hall told me to phone the City Clerk tomorrow about this. Hopefully I will have time. Here is the contact info in case anyone else wishes to express their concern:

    (210) 207-7253
     
    Rating - 100%
    9   0   0
    Aug 17, 2010
    7,576
    96
    Austin
    The TSRA has been active in dealing with municipalities to remove outdated ordinances. I'd try to get them involved also.
     

    London

    The advocate's Devil.
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Sep 28, 2010
    6,296
    96
    Twilight Zone
    Just an update-

    I finally got around to calling the City Clerk's Office yesterday. No one there knew who could handle this for me sonce I don't live in city limits an have no representative council member. I was told to call the Mayor's Office. The Mayor's Office told me to call the County Commissioner's Office. The County Commissioner's Office said they don't know who could handle this but twill try to get back with me today. It's 3:38 P.M. and I guess that's not going to happen.

    My neighbor told me to just lie and say I live in district five to get a city counsel member on the phone. I guess it's worth a try if this doesn't start going somewhere soon...
     

    jsimmons

    Active Member
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    0   0   0
    Sep 6, 2009
    505
    1
    San Antonio
    It shouldn't matter where you live. the law is unconstitutional. Find out who San Antonio's rep is in Austin, and tell them about it. It is ultimately the state's responsibility to uphold the constitution. Send an email to everybody involved:

    Gov Perry
    County Commissioner
    San Antonio reps
    San Antonio mayor
    ALL San Antonio city council members
    Local news media

    And make sure all recipients see that the local news media has been informed
     

    London

    The advocate's Devil.
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Sep 28, 2010
    6,296
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    Twilight Zone
    I'm trying to work my way up the chain of command as any higher offices are likely to tell me start small anyway. I'm in contact with another person who has the connections to get this rectified. We can use all the help we can get. Remember- this isn't just my battle. If you guys dislike the law then by all means make some phone calls about it!
     

    RiverCity.45

    Member
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    Nov 7, 2010
    79
    11
    San Antonio
    Other problematic sections:

    Sec. 21-153. - Carrying a firearm prohibited; exceptions.
    (a) It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a firearm within the city limits of the City of San Antonio at:
    (1) A public park; or
    (2) A public meeting of a governmental body; or
    (3) A political rally, political parade, or official political meeting; or
    (4) A nonfirearms-related school, college, or professional athletic event.
    (b) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution for a violation of this provision that:
    (1) The firearm is being carried by a certified peace officer; or
    (2) The firearm is being carried by a certified security officer in the performance of his employment.

    and

    Sec. 21-157. - Carrying of weapons, including concealed handguns, on city-owned premises prohibited; posting of notice.
    (a) It is the intent of the city council to prohibit any person other than a commissioned security officer employed by the city and licensed peace officers from carrying or possessing weapons including concealed handguns on city-owned premises, including city-owned buildings, parking garages, lots, and other parking areas but excluding city-owned or operated public parks, streets and sidewalks.
    (b) It is the intent of the city council that the term weapon shall include a firearm, handgun, club, illegal knife, knife, and any prohibited weapon listed in Texas Penal Code Section 46.05(a) and have the same meaning as said items are defined in Section 46.01, Texas Penal Code.
    (c) The city council directs the city manager, or his designee to post the appropriate signs and such other notice, in accordance with Section 30.05 of the Texas Penal Code (the Criminal Trespass Law), to carry out the city council's above-stated intent.
    (d) The city manager is authorized to take all steps reasonable and necessary to deny entry or continued presence on city-owned premises to all such persons possessing weapons including concealed handguns, including prosecution of such violators for the offense of criminal trespass.

    What are your thoughts about this order prohibiting concealed handguns on city-owned property in accordance with 30-05?
     

    txinvestigator

    TGT Addict
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    May 28, 2008
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    Ft Worth, TX
    Just an update-

    I finally got around to calling the City Clerk's Office yesterday. No one there knew who could handle this for me sonce I don't live in city limits an have no representative council member. I was told to call the Mayor's Office. The Mayor's Office told me to call the County Commissioner's Office. The County Commissioner's Office said they don't know who could handle this but twill try to get back with me today. It's 3:38 P.M. and I guess that's not going to happen.

    My neighbor told me to just lie and say I live in district five to get a city counsel member on the phone. I guess it's worth a try if this doesn't start going somewhere soon...

    Be sure you understand the government structure. The County Commisisoners have nothing to do with city ordinances. Only the SA city council can change these ordinances.
     

    Buck Nekkid

    Member
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    0   0   0
    Sep 30, 2009
    147
    11
    San Antonio
    Good luck on this. Several years ago I attempted to do what you are in Las Vegas. We had considerable community support, but the NRA wouldn't touch it. I wound up getting form letters from the City Attorney denying that they were violating state law and that was it.
     

    Matthew2000tx

    New Member
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    0   0   0
    Nov 27, 2010
    31
    1
    Helotes, TX
    I violate the knife law my carrying my Kershaw Skyline?? what the heck!

    I'm very active on the light pollution fight here in Texas (I'm an astronomer). I have know a few people to get city light ordinances passed in Helotes by claiming they were living within Helotes... even though they were lived in San Antonio. I don't agree with the practice.

    I agree that these city ordinances are wrong... I'll start barking up some trees about this when I get the time.

    I had good results when I e-mailed some random city counsel members and Mayor Castro about the need to stop cars from parking in bike lines within the city after a friend died because the lane was blocked. The law hasn't changed but I did get a phone call returned for the City bicycle official.

    Keep us posted.

    Also I seem to get better results when I hand write letters and sign them concerned registered voter.
     

    Texan2

    TGT Addict
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    2   0   0
    Nov 8, 2008
    7,932
    21
    South of San Antonio
    Just an update-

    I finally got around to calling the City Clerk's Office yesterday. No one there knew who could handle this for me sonce I don't live in city limits an have no representative council member. I was told to call the Mayor's Office. The Mayor's Office told me to call the County Commissioner's Office. The County Commissioner's Office said they don't know who could handle this but twill try to get back with me today. It's 3:38 P.M. and I guess that's not going to happen.

    My neighbor told me to just lie and say I live in district five to get a city counsel member on the phone. I guess it's worth a try if this doesn't start going somewhere soon...
    One...I wouldnt lie. When they find out it just make you and your cause look bad.
    Two...They are jacking you around. Passing you off to other offices just to broom you.
     

    London

    The advocate's Devil.
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    Sep 28, 2010
    6,296
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    Twilight Zone
    TxCop2 - I figured as much. Be they the ones I want or not, I WILL get answers. Finals are next week so I will have very little time to dedicate to this for a while. Honestly, I'd rather spend my free time drinking beer with my neighbors so I can have some form of stress relief. I will NOT drop this, though.

    Rivercity.45 - I don't find the exceptions to be problematic to my immediate cause at all. Just stupid.
     
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