Would you carry?

[Torkey]

Hello all, been lurking on the site a while and decided to post up as I would like to get some opinions on a CHL issue that I have debated with a few people.

I am a current CHL holder. I am an overnight employee for a large retail drugstore. My question is this: It is AGAINST company policy to carry a firearm at work. It is not legally prohibited for a non-working member (ie no statute posted), but I feel like it creates a tough situation. The overall likelihood of a situation to arise where it would be necessary to have a firearm is, I feel, very plausible (people hopped up on drugs wanting narcotics, 24hr accessiblity, limited employees etc). My argument is always "if it comes down to my life or my job, the decision is easy" and the argument always comes back, yes but if you're ever in that situation where you needed your firearm, it would end in lawsuits galore and you still have the very real possibility of going to jail even if you were in the right for the duration of the situation at hand.

A similar situation occured here: Michigan Walgreens Pharmacist Jeremy Hoven Fired After Shooting at Robbers - ABC News - (not saying this is my specific company), but I feel like this man is possibly alive because he was carrying.

So in a similar situation, would you carry? Thanks for any and all opinions. (before anyone starts in with the "you should go back to CHL class", I will say I do know that when it is against company policy, you are not to carry- as instructed in the CHL courses. But when the company fails to provide adequate measures of security and its just you and a perpetrator it seems difficult to just allow a situation like that to develop without any defense)

 

[TexasRedneck]

First off - welcome!

Would I carry? In a word, yes. I'll find another job - be difficult to get another life. Having said that, I'd draw ONLY if MY life were on the line, or that of a bystander. They can have all the money, drugs, etc.

 

[txinvestigator]

In my opinion you should find another job if you cannot follow the rules of the man who pays you.

 

[Glockster69]

Kinda surprised at your reply TI. If it was a small business I'd agree 100% - his business, his rules. All indications are the OP works for a large, multi-location company with all the lawyers and HR people telling employees to do what's best for the companies bottom line, your personal safety be damned.

Torkey: you got a follow up for what happened to Jeremy?

 

[TXARGUY]

I would work very hard to stand out. Become the best employee the company has ever had. Then I'd find a job with a more firearm friendly company and cite my reason for leaving when I put in my notice.

 

[Dreamliner787]

Just my opinion but if they say you cannot carry at work then how is it that they will provide you with protection or security while at work? The same applies to "gun free zones" that we should all question. If they are going to disarm you with a CHL then how will they provide you with security or protection and in most case they do not or will not; you'll have to do what you think is best for you. IMO.

 

[scap99]

First off - welcome!

Would I carry? In a word, yes. I'll find another job - be difficult to get another life. Having said that, I'd draw ONLY if MY life were on the line, or that of a bystander. They can have all the money, drugs, etc.

+1
On all counts.




"Those who appease a tiger do so in hope that the tiger will eat them last."
-Winston Churchill

 

[Army 1911]

If any shooting was justifiable, then there are no law suits in Texas. You can keep your gun in your car, regardless of what an employee manual says. If your company has an employee manual that states no guns at the workplace, then you need to obey that or get another employer.

You could ask what the company policy on employee protection is for employees on late shifts. Cite the fact that some drug user may want to rob the store and resupply his stash. Offer to take a class and get a CHL. Don't tell them you hsve one. If they agree get it in writting.

 

[tmd11111]

Its not your store. Crack heads want to rob you give them what they want. Or you can take TI's advice and go find employment elsewhere. Outside of law enforcement there isn't too many companies that allow workers to carry on the job. Oh and you can blame employers all day long but its their insurance companies and lawyers who make these rules not your employer.

 

[Texan2]

Are you more worried about being dead or being sued?

 

[txinvestigator]

If any shooting was justifiable, then there are no law suits in Texas.

Common misconception, but completely untrue.

You can keep your gun in your car, regardless of what an employee manual says.

Yeah, not true either. The law prohibits most employers from having such a policy, but there is no penalty for employers having the policy, nor is there a remedy for employees terminated under such a policy.

 

[Mic]

Carry. Screw corporations, their lawyers, and their insurance companies.
Do not draw your weapon to protect the company from robbery. Only draw your weapon to protect your life.
If you have to use your weapon, you won't care about the consequences.
.

 

[matefrio]

Everyone has an unalienable right to life, liberty and a pursuit of happiness. Know the risks and decide what ones you care to take.

 

[Younggun]

Just read the Question and skipped most of the other answers.

The point of conceiled carry is that people can't see it. My company has a policy against it, my job requires at times that I go in to some rather unsavery neighborhoods all hours of the day and night. Most know I have my CHL and when one of my crew members asked if I carried I just told them that it is not allowed by company policy and they accepted what they heard.

Be safe and keep it to yourself.

 

[Younggun]

Carry. Screw corporations, their lawyers, and their insurance companies.
Do not draw your weapon to protect the company from robbery. Only draw your weapon to protect your life.
If you have to use your weapon, you won't care about the consequences.
.

This.

 

[Old Timer]

Prior to my final retirement (I retired first from the military then from law enforcement) I was chief of security for a major defense contractor. One of the rules was "no firearms allowed on company property." Employees all parked in company owned parking lots that were inside the protected area so leaving their firearms in their cars was not an option. I did not like the rule, and never enforced it, but my department also provided armed security in the form of 175 armed security officers (not your run-of-the-mill rent-a-cops - all of them were former combat arms vets, or former law enforcement officers - some were both). The point is, you agree to certain rules as a requirement of employment. If you can't obey the company's rules it is probably unethical to take their money.

 

[mikeofcontex]

If I was considering breaking workplace rules... I sure as heck wouldn't leave tracks on an online forum.

 

[35Remington]

I would work very hard to stand out. Become the best employee the company has ever had. Then I'd find a job with a more firearm friendly company and cite my reason for leaving when I put in my notice.

This is brilliant. Plan A should be to get a new job that lets you carry, but TXARGUY suggested an incredible Plan B.

 

[txinvestigator]

Carry. Screw corporations, their lawyers, and their insurance companies.
Do not draw your weapon to protect the company from robbery. Only draw your weapon to protect your life.
If you have to use your weapon, you won't care about the consequences.
.

If does not have to use his weapon, he might care about the consequences.

 

[majormadmax]

The point is, you agree to certain rules as a requirement of employment. If you can't obey the company's rules it is probably unethical to take their money.

This, in a nutshell, is the correct answer.

And I don't blame a company for firing an employee for breaking their rules, regardless of the situation; which is why I still shop at Auto Zone.

I work on a military installation, and personally-owned firearms are not allowed on base. I don't agree with it, but since I know my job entails having to work on the installation, it's something I accept or as others have said, I can find work elsewhere.

Remember that Texas is an 'At-Will' state when it comes to employment, meaning an employer doesn't even have to give a reason when an employee is let go. All it would take is one person reporting that you have a firearm on their property, and you can be fired; and I am not exactly sure of this but there may even be a chance that you can be charged with criminal trespassing by a CHL holder (§30.06) because by being given the company guideline that firearms are not allowed, you have essentially "received notice" that "entry on the property by a license holder with a concealed handgun was forbidden" (§30.06(2)(A)) as long as the written communication was identical to that in that statute ("“Pursuant to Section 30.06...").