AR47 Pistol / SBR ?

[TX69]

Anyone know if one has ever been made to run reliably? I have been looking into an SBR and would like something in either 556 or 7.62 10" barrel.

Found this: http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/com...-62x39mm-pistol-flat-top-detail.html?Itemid=0

 

[oldag]

Can't say about that particular model. The PTR PDW .308 pistols work well. No buffer tube, but you can get a model which comes with Sig Brace and special adapter to accept the brace.

Sig makes a 5.56 pistol (SG553P) which is Swiss Arms built and an incredible beauty. No buffer tube. But expensive and hard to find as they only imported a couple hundred to the U.S.


PWS Diablo is in 7.62x39 and runs well. Buffer tube and works well with the Sig Brace. A little hard to find and not cheap.

 

[TX69]

Good info! I have a stripped lower from Runner Runner that is a Texas Flag lower. It would be a great candidate for a build like this. I did find this upper which has the 10.5" barrel I was thinking about. Reason for the 10" barrel is getting as much as I can out of the round with this length. I looked at some chronos for the x39 round and the 7.5 barrels are getting 1900fps and the 10" are at 2200fps. Gives me a little more grip room as well.

https://www.hardenedarms.com/ecProduct_315_32

 

[oldag]

That does look like the foundation for a nice build. May want to consider a brake to tame muzzle rise, made a significant difference on mine. Used the PWS brake.

 

[TX69]

I want something super short like this. This one is from CNC Warrior and has three different thread patterns. I'm not sure what is available for the x39 barrel in terms of threads?

 

[TX69]

Model1 kit includes everything I would need. What's the industry rep for Model1? I would change A LOT of stuff on their kit so it may not be worth it but I would have a running gun doing it that way and could make changes as I went along. Would want a 9" YHM Hand guard with end cap, different muzzle device, CH, trigger, everything lol

https://www.model1sales.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=242

I would need to find someone to paint the Texas flag on my lower too.

Like this:

 

[oldag]

If I recall properly, the PWS Diablo had 5/8x24 thread. But I don't know about the Hardened Arms.

 

[TX69]

If I recall properly, the PWS Diablo had 5/8x24 thread. But I don't know about the Hardened Arms.

All of this stuff is new to me so I haven't a clue. Sure would like to get off the fence and do a custom build like this.

 

[oldag]

Do you know how the lower was classified on the ATF form when you purchased it? You would want to ensure it was not classified as a rifle. It should not have been, but sometimes mistakes are made.

 

[grumper]

The SG553P is really nice but hella expensive and the barrel is only 9", not 10. Swiss magazines are expensive, $40 a pop for the 30 rounders. Depending on whether you believe in complying with that 922(r) garbage US made parts can be very hard and/or expensive to find. The US made 556xi, 551A1 clone stocks will not fit on the 553 so you gotta get an original one. The Swiss stocks are sort of uncommon but I have seen a few up for grabs on various sites. I got a brand new one and a used one for a spare. Paid $250 for the new stock and $150 for the used one. Ordering a new one from Switzerland costs about $400.

The good news is some of the other Sig 556 and 556xi parts will work in the SG553. I have a US made Shooting Sight match hammer and sear in mine and it makes the trigger pull better than the original Swiss parts.

The one in that thumbnail picture has a standard 1/2x28 threaded barrel and not the goofed up metric threads like the Euro versions have. So if you want to mount a suppressor and lower the foreign made parts count it's easy to replace the muzzle device.

The cocking handle is kind of a pain to operate on the 553 due to how close it is to the top rail. I got an Aimpoint Micro on mine and it will pinch the crap out of your hand if you aren't careful. With a bigger optic like an EOTech there's barely any charging handle to hold onto unless you want to draw blood when you pull it back.

Prices have actually come down on the 553P's. They used to be $3000+ but I've seen them on GB for about $2700 now. Guess they aren't very hot sellers so dealers are slashing prices just to clear inventory. Once the supply is out they probably won't be bringing any more over. So these most likely gon be good collection pieces.

I've only brought mine to the range once but it's unbelievably accurate for a gun with a 8.9" barrel.

 

[TX69]

Do you know how the lower was classified on the ATF form when you purchased it? You would want to ensure it was not classified as a rifle. It should not have been, but sometimes mistakes are made.

Dunno? Guess I would have to call Runner Runner?

 

[oldag]

As I understand it, once a lower is identified as "rifle" if a short barrel is installed it is a short barrel rifle. It cannot be classified as a pistol. An SBR requires a special permit (stamp).

If the lower was identified properly (can't recall the exact term at the moment), then it can go into either a pistol or rifle. An AR pistol does not require a stamp, as it is not an SBR. I would recommend a little research on this to be sure you stay clean.

 

[grumper]

As I understand it, once a lower is identified as "rifle" if a short barrel is installed it is a short barrel rifle. It cannot be classified as a pistol. An SBR requires a special permit (stamp).

If the lower was identified properly (can't recall the exact term at the moment), then it can go into either a pistol or rifle. An AR pistol does not require a stamp, as it is not an SBR. I would recommend a little research on this to be sure you stay clean.

A stripped lower receiver should have been marked as an 'Other firearm' on the 4473 instead of long gun or hand gun.

 

[oldag]

a
The cocking handle is kind of a pain to operate on the 553 due to how close it is to the top rail. I got an Aimpoint Micro on mine and it will pinch the crap out of your hand if you aren't careful. With a bigger optic like an EOTech there's barely any charging handle to hold onto unless you want to draw blood when you pull it back.

Griffin Tactical SIG 55X Series Ergonomic Charging Handle (#PRT SSI-0250)
http://www.cogunsales.com/product/griffin-tactical-sig-55x-series-ergonomic-charging-handle/

This takes care of the clearance problem. Angled down instead of up. Works well.

 

[grumper]

Griffin Tactical SIG 55X Series Ergonomic Charging Handle (#PRT SSI-0250)
http://www.cogunsales.com/product/griffin-tactical-sig-55x-series-ergonomic-charging-handle/

This takes care of the clearance problem. Angled down instead of up. Works well.

Unfortunately those don't work on the SAN guns. According to Manticore Arms, it's something about the angle and thickness of the cocking slot is different on the Swiss guns than the US 556s. The US charging handles will tear the rubber gaskets out of the Swiss guns when you cock the weapon and it costs $500 each to rivet replacement condoms back into the upper.

 

[oldag]

A stripped lower receiver should have been marked as an 'Other firearm' on the 4473 instead of long gun or hand gun.

Thanks for the exact information, grumper. You are on top of this. OP, this is what you want to confirm. This is how it should have been recorded, but sometimes mistakes are made. And you don't want the potential (no matter how remote) to get crosswise with the ATF. The seller should be able to confirm.

Also, I found that Diablo users report that the C Products magazines work best. They do seem to work well. As you know, mags have been a weakness with the 7.62x39 AR's.

 

[oldag]

Unfortunately those don't work on the SAN guns. According to Manticore Arms, it's something about the angle and thickness of the cocking slot is different on the Swiss guns than the US 556s. The US charging handles will tear the rubber gaskets out of the Swiss guns when you cock the weapon and it costs $500 each to rivet replacement condoms back into the upper.

Works on my Swiss made SG 553P just fine. The difference in this and the original is merely the angle outside the bend. Just looked again and there is no damage to the rubber gasket.

 

[grumper]

Works on my Swiss made SSG 553P just fine. The difference in this and the original is merely the angle outside the bend. Just looked again and there is no damage to the rubber gasket.

Oh, I'll have to check into it then. When I emailed Manticore about their 552 style charging handle they told me flat out not to use 556 handles or it would damage the gaskets. Did you have to modify your handle any?

The desc on that website says the down angled one interferes with the folded stock, that's a shame. I'm good with the factory charging handle as long as I stick with the Micro but maybe I'll pick up one of those Griffin ones to experiment with.

 

[oldag]

Oh, I'll have to check into it then. When I emailed Manticore about their 552 style charging handle they told me flat out not to use 556 handles or it would damage the gaskets. Did you have to modify your handle any?

The desc on that website says the down angled one interferes with the folded stock, that's a shame. I'm good with the factory charging handle as long as I stick with the Micro but maybe I'll pick up one of those Griffin ones to experiment with.

I did not do any mods. Plug and play. Again this is on an SG 553P, no stock on a 553P. So I could not say about interfacing with a folding stock.

 

[grumper]

I did not do any mods. Plug and play. Again this is on an SG 553P, no stock on a 553P. So I could not say about interfacing with a folding stock.

Good point. Lol I'd just assumed most ppl that bought one were filling out the forms to put a stock on it.

I read Griffin actually made a few handles that stuck out straight instead of bending down or up. Those will supposedly not block a folding stock. Wonder if I could score one of those from somewhere.