Reloading necked cartridges for the first time

[robertc1024]

Starting the reloading process for the 223. This is a much slower pace than I am used to lol. Was able to resize and trim a few hundred pieces of brass. About 90% of my brass is Lake City so I'm at a stand still for priming until I get a primer pocket reamer.

I have a Forster bench rest full sizing die. Anywhere from 3-15 rounds in, the decapping pin would stay stuck in the primer and fall out. Extremely frustrating. Is there a trick to this or could it be due to the crimped primer pockets being harder to remove?

Also plan on loading berrys 55 grain BT bullets with Winchester 748 powder. The Modern Reloading manual has it at 26.2gr min AND 26.2gr as the max load at 2.165oal. Lymans 50th has it as 25.0gr min and 27.8 max at 2.260oal. Anyone have any recommendation for starting? I'm thinking to do 26.0gr at 2.260oal?

Don't worry about the speed of reloading, you should only worry about the accuracy and consistency. Lake City is fine. I've used swagers and reamers to deal with the crimps.

As far as the de-capping pin goes - that's weird, what die are you using for that? I gave up on the de-capping when full length sizing my brass. There is a separate universal de-capping die I use - you just have to be careful because the flash holes are different sizes between things like small primer and large primer brass.

As far as the powder loads go - yep. Different manuals have very different powder loads. It's a process for sure. If you're shooting for accuracy, load some rounds at the minimum level and go up. I usually look at 3-4 different reloading manuals and start in the middle of their recommendations. Guns are strong - if you don't do anything idiotic, you're probably going to be fine.

 

[deemus]

Thanks for the feedback all! Will probably have a question or two as I get started into it.

Ordered a hand primer, charge funnel, some case gauges and some lube. Still working through which trimmer to purchase but that is next on the list. Reading giraud makes a really good one. Thinking buy once, cry once on that but don't know if that's overkill.

I’ve used this one for a couple decades. Usually while watching tv. I have all the case prep done, then prime while watching a movie. It’s nice to not have to be glued to the bench while getting some work done.

Lee Precision, Inc.. New Auto-Prime

Lee Auto Prime hand priming tool is a fast, safe, and effective way of priming cases. Lee Auto Prime uses inexpensive Lee Auto Prime shell holders only.

leeprecision.com

 

[Deavis]

Dillon's super swage is a nice way to remove the crimp and a little more controllable than many of the reamer options out there. Hold onto that brass and don't accidentally mix it with anything you may buy or pickup, that way you don't end up having to ream/swage twice.

Crimped primers are tough to remove, a spring loader decapper is really useful. The FW arms one works really well but if you aren't doing a lot of brass it is probably overkill. If you don't go that way, make sure that your decapping pin is well rounded, sometimes an edge on the end will drive into the anvil and not release. A cheap alternative that works well is the Lee Universal decapper, it will drive out crimped primers very well. Also, make sure your pin is pushing the primer out completely and not just barely clearing the primer, on crimped they will suck back, bind, and pull non-headed pins free. Lastly, watch out for the import brass in that last 10%, particularly Igman and Norma, they run a reduced size flashole and they don't play well with standard .070"+ decapping pins.

On your OAL, you are running Berry's and they put a cannelure on their projectile. If you run them "normally" you will seat to the far end of the cannelure and crimp there. That's what it is there for and you will probably not be at 2.260". Depending on your trim to length, you will probably end up at about 2.220" for the OAL if seating into the cannelure correctly. You might be as short as 2.200 if you trim aggressively and depending on the projectile lot's cannelure position. Remember many loading manuals show the max OAL, which may not be where you end up seating for a variety of reasons. Shouldn't be an issue for you but if you ever want to load long (for 68gr+) don't forget you have a magazine length restriction that needs to be considered for your specific platform.

Good luck

 

[xkon]

Using Forster FL sizing die. Think I'll get a RCBC or Lee decapping die for just depriming first.

Ordered a handheld Lyman handheld primer pocket reamer last night on Amazon and got it this morning. Took the bit out and put it in a power drill and it did the trick on the primer pockets. Think I will look at the dillon super swage though.

Loaded up 20 rounds at 26gr win 748, 2.260 only with the 55 gr berrys bullets. Was able to keep them all in a 2 MOA diamond at 100 yards out of my ar15. Didn't get to check the target for exact grouping size but it shot pretty well.

Deavis, the berrys bullets at 2.260 are not seated in the cannelure groove. I thought the manuals state minimum overall length? Seating deeper should equate to higher pressures? Think its okay to push these a bit deeper and set in the groove?

 

[Deavis]

xkon, manuals vary in how they list OAL. Some of them simply load their test rounds at the maximum OAL for the cartridge and others load at a length they've chosen for practical reasons. The latter, for instance, would be 9mm loaded to the maximum OAL possible wouldn't feed in a lot of firearms out there. For rounds with a cannelure, this choice the manuals make becomes apparent really quickly.

You can load that Berry's projectile out to 2.260, no problem, but your cannelure probably isn't lined up on the mouth. The cannelure is there for you to crimp into for a few good reasons but not everyone cares. If you want to use the cannelure, make sure you trim consistently, seat into the cannelure, and crimp firmly (.242-.245 for 223/556). If you are running the absolute maximum load and go from 2.260 to 2.230 to hit the cannelure then there will be some pressure rise and you should (theoretically) back off the powder charge slightly to compensate for that change.

 

[MrRobot]

Can't believe someone forgot the most important one lol... brass annealer .

I just started using one and so far it's been good. I myself started like you with the Forster press RCBS dies / RCBS powder dispenser. I have the Hornady bullet comparator but plan on upgrade that one down the road.

One other things I thought I would never need was a brass pullers from the DIE... I had one that got stuck because didn't apply enough lube on it. Plus get yourself a bullet puller as well .

Working on my 223 load myself but it's been raining that I can't go out and test my load. One more thing a least 2 reloading books or even 3 in case you can't find the bullet in one book.

 

[xkon]

I think I will try loading them not in the cannelure first, load a full magazine and see if by the end of the magazine any of the rounds have a bit of set back from recoil. If so I'll move them down a bit and start crimping.

What brass annealer did you go with? I briefly looked one up before but it was very expensive and not sure if the benefits would be justified.

 

[DFW_Warrior]

You say benchrest rifle, but then you are loading 55's for an AR. Not to be snarky here at all, but what kind of accuracy are you really hoping to get? If you are wanting 1moa and SD's in the low teens, I would just ditch the single stage stuff and go back to progressive. Something like a 550, or even better, just get a 750 and call it done.

I know, I know... I'm a total black sheep in the reloading world. I don't anneal brass, I use a progressive press on all my ammo, I don't sort by headstamp, I don't crimp a darn thing even though I have shot 10's and 10's of thousands of rounds through semi-auto's per year in competitions.

I've found there are some simple and easy things you can do to get to 95-98% of the accuracy of the guys that are doing ALL the things, by only doing 2-3 of the things. And in the interim, it takes me a fraction of the time to do it, and for what I shoot (3-gun) it doesn't matter.

Now, if you are really wanting to get SD's down into low single digits, and get down into 1/4moa stuff, then by all means, you need to do all the things. But then you won't be running a regular ol' AR, you will be running a custom built benchrest thing, and you will be using a $4000 Prometheus powder measure, an annealer, and all the toys to get from very low teen SD down into the singles. I just hate to see folks go down the path of single stage reloading for this kind of thing, if they really aren't worried too much about that kind of stuff.

And I'm surprised no one has mentioned a chrono yet. Kind of hard to get serious about rifle reloading without one of those if you ask me.

 

[xkon]

223 rounds are to get familiar with reloading rifle rounds which was pretty quick. Long term will probably move to a dillon 550 for them.

I mentioned benchrest for when I start loading the 308s for my bolt action, after I learned any nuances for loading rifle rounds.

But I agree, there are probably some stages that would be unnecessary or more time consuming if just cranking out range plinking ammo.

 

[DFW_Warrior]

It all depends on what you want to do with them. My "long range" ammo for 3-gun is .223 and .308 (I shoot two different divisions) and both are sub moa at 200yds, and are in the very low teens for SD's. Those are loaded on a Dillon 650 with a powder drop.

Now, if I want to get to sub-half moa and single digit SD's, like I said before, things get expensive and VERY time consuming very quickly. Just something to think about.

Side note... I had a Dillon 550 and it was the worst decision I ever made on a loading press for the types of things I do. I am very time poor so I needed something to get quality ammo made with the least amount of time. The 550 isn't that.

 

[Dawico]

I think I will try loading them not in the cannelure first, load a full magazine and see if by the end of the magazine any of the rounds have a bit of set back from recoil. If so I'll move them down a bit and start crimping.

What brass annealer did you go with? I briefly looked one up before but it was very expensive and not sure if the benefits would be justified.

You don't need a brass annealer. 223 brass is cheap enough that you'll never see the return on investment.

You really don't need most of the BS shoveled in this thread. These guys don't need to be pushing a bunch of expensive equipment on you.

Get a cheap Lee trimmer for 223. It's two pieces so get both and a chamfering tool. $20 total or so.

Some lube. $5

Load some and go for it.

You don't need a FCD, case gauges, an annealer, chronograph, or any of the other crap these guys are pushing. Brush up on the process in your manuals and go.

 

[Lonesome Dove]

You don't need a brass annealer. 223 brass is cheap enough that you'll never see the return on investment.

You really don't need most of the BS shoveled in this thread. These guys don't need to be pushing a bunch of expensive equipment on you.

Get a cheap Lee trimmer for 223. It's two pieces so get both and a chamfering tool. $20 total or so.

Some lube. $5

Load some and go for it.

You don't need a FCD, case gauges, an annealer, chronograph, or any of the other crap these guys are pushing. Brush up on the process in your manuals and go.

 

[Deavis]

You don't need a brass annealer. 223 brass is cheap enough that you'll never see the return on investment.

Truth

Get a cheap Lee trimmer for 223. It's two pieces so get both and a chamfering tool. $20 total or so.

Disagree, RT1500 or dont load 223!. Worth every penny for trimming 223. Cheap trimmers suck and running a drill gets old. SIZE AND TRIM in one step? Yes, please.

You don't need a FCD, case gauges,

You should own a case gauge. First thing you use to find problems and to set the shoulder properly on rifle for beginners. They are cheap and help set your ammo to a standard, which can be useful.

 

[Two Gun Bob]

New to reloading rifle/necked cartridges. I have however loaded tens of thousands of straight walled pistol rounds on my dillon square deal b reloading presses. Looking at starting to reload rifle rounds for 223 to get the basics down and then move over to working up some 308 rounds for some benchrest shooting.

Coming from an auto indexing progressive press with proprietary dies to a single stage press with a few additional steps, what items am I missing to get started? I have a micrometer, scale, tumbler that I use for the handgun rounds that obviously can be used for this. For new equipment, currently have:

-Forester Coax Single stage press
-RCBS Chargemaster Supreme powder dispenser
-Forester Bench Rest Full Length Sizing die 223
-Forester Bench Rest Seater die 223
-Reloading trays

Swapping to a single stage you'll probably want to rearrange the steps somewhat, add a dedicated deprimer step with appropriate die. RCBS has a replacable pin that makes it worth having in your single stage process. They come in a pack of 5 for a reason

 

[Dawico]

Disagree, RT1500 or dont load 223!. Worth every penny for trimming 223. Cheap trimmers suck and running a drill gets old. SIZE AND TRIM in one step? Yes, please.


You should own a case gauge. First thing you use to find problems and to set the shoulder properly on rifle for beginners. They are cheap and help set your ammo to a standard, which can be useful.

There you go, a $450 trimmer for a beginner to load some 223 plinking ammo? Nope. Not necessary for the situation at all.

I agree that case gauges are cheap enough but not necessary. Beginners don't need to worry about setting the shoulder properly. Full length size and be done with it.

When the OP starts reloading for long range or high volume competition then we can reevaluate.

 

[Deavis]

There you go, a $450 trimmer for a beginner to load some 223 plinking ammo? Nope. Not necessary for the situation at all.

I agree that case gauges are cheap enough but not necessary. Beginners don't need to worry about setting the shoulder properly. Full length size and be done with it.

When the OP starts reloading for long range or high volume competition then we can reevaluate.

Just curious, how do you define full length size and be done with it for a beginner? That's interesting and I'm curious why you describe a critical part of rifle reloading that most beginners don't understand so casually.

$450 for a lifetime tool that makes loading every volume ammo caliber a breeze is a small investment, what 22.50 a year for 20 years? The span of reloading for good gear. Then again, if plinking mean loading a thousand rounds a year of 223 then maybe you are right.

 

[xkon]

I ended up getting and using the Henderson Precision case trimmer. Works extremely well. That was one I figured to get top of the line to save on time as it will be used frequently.

The case gauge I think was a good recommendation. Went with the LE Wilson gauges. It was very useful when setting up the sizing die.

For the Dillon 550, what is the recommendation for the 750 over that? From what I read, a lot of people prefer the 550 more. I'm assuming to for the 750 it shines if you want to get into automating case and bullet feeders?

 

[alternative]

I don't know how anyone can argue against having a case gage. Tells you if your resizing die is set up correctly and if your cases need trimming. Nothing could be easier than popping a case into a case gage. Out of all the things we do with reloading this must be close to the easiest.

 

[deemus]

I’ve reloaded since 1990ish and I’ve never used one. And never had a problem with my rounds.

 

[mongoose]

I have reloaded since the late 80s. I was taught by an old Hornaday factory shooter. Never have used one and I have loaded some tack driving rounds.