Traffic Stop Story - Happy Ending
- Thread starter 40Arpent
- Start date
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With all due respect sir, you need to "brush up" on your rights. For pete's sake!!
As a former state trooper and a supervisor, albeit in the liberal state of California, which wasn't always dark blue, if a private citizen would have filed a complaint, and the circumstances existed as the OP described, that state trooper would have been reprimanded.
Yes I am biased, but state troopers are usually the most "professional" of all state LE, of any state, particularly when you compare it to local sheriff and most city PDs.
Were you required to show your CHL? Louisiana is an open carry state. Since you did not have a weapon concealed on your person, it should not have needed to be done. I am glad everything worked out well. If a weapon were to become visible during the stop, and the CHL was not volunteered then things may have ended differently. Your observation of the demeanor of the officer was probably good clue to the pending outcome of the event. Thanks for posting your observations!
It sure seems like a lot of firepower for a simple Mardi Gras celebration...
It sure seems like a lot of firepower for a simple Mardi Gras celebration...
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The presence of an occupant, also a person now "detained" in the stop, increases the risk to the officer and gives the officer the ability to remove, identify and frisk the occupant as well under Arizona v. Johnson. With the choice of leaving the occupant in the vehicle, Terry rules may apply again/still at this point and allow a frisk of the vehicle if the officer intends to have the occupant remain in the vehicle during the stop while he's working with the driver outside the vehicle. It all comes down to how the officer articulates belief about weapons, danger, etc. during the stop (and assumes the officer doesn't sidetrack into a separate investigative line of discussion with the passenger, which would likely "end" the traffic stop portion under Mimms and/or Johnson.
It's complex case law, varies by state at this point, and may even come down to local policy or local court rulings in absence of regional case law.
To be clear, that's manure. You are assuming much more in "fact" than the OP has described. I would argue if the LEO had a reasonable suspicion his safety was in jeopardy maybe that would be a better foundation for his actions, but based on what the OP has described you are off base. The OP provided the LEO with his CHL and told the LEO about the firearms for pete's sake. Just stop. The LEO was out of line and I am a retired state trooper saying that. Folks have got to know and exercise their rights. Pathetic.
All well and good, but current case law absolutely allows officers to request drivers AND occupants exit the vehicle. Beyond that, YMMV, but even though Terry has been significantly pared down in recent years, I know of no ruling that would determine as unreasonable a frisk of a vehicle in which an officer elects to allow a passenger to stay in, ESPECIALLY once the driver has (required or not) informed the officer that weapons are present in the vehicle.
LEOs to order drivers and occupants exit the vehicle I agree if officer safety and control of the scene are issues, and the driver and/or occupant is not put in danger, as for example along the shoulder of a freeway. Yes, much latitude in search of person on a traffic stop is afforded an LEO in regard to officer safety, but the gathering of weapons and running the SNs, as in this case, to identify whether contraband or not does not suggest the intent of gathering weapons was due to officer safety or controlling the situation. Again, what was the state of mind of the LEO in his behavior is what I would question. All I will say is that I would have handled this in a much more professional way, but then I am a former state trooper and not some "podunk" PD officer. I know that sounds arrogant but it is what it is.
Were you required to show your CHL? Louisiana is an open carry state. Since you did not have a weapon concealed on your person, it should not have needed to be done. I am glad everything worked out well. If a weapon were to become visible during the stop, and the CHL was not volunteered then things may have ended differently. Your observation of the demeanor of the officer was probably good clue to the pending outcome of the event. Thanks for posting your observations!
It sure seems like a lot of firepower for a simple Mardi Gras celebration...
I presented my CHL voluntarily, as I did have a concealed handgun on my person. I was gonna be hunting that weekend, hence one of the rifles and a shotgun. The other 6 weapons, including the one on me, are my normal "travel" weapons. ;-) LOL about Mardi Gras..good one!
Thanks, i'm glad it turned out well also!
Good thread..... guess I'll throw my .02 cents in.
I'm assuming the traffic stop was on I-10? If not, can you elaborate on what hwy/Interstate you were traveling and the city the LEO worked for?
I worked as a LEO for a department in Lake Charles, and you have to understand if it was on I-10 that is a major drug corridor. Out of state vehicle on a traffic stop at night.... well I'll let you ponder that one for a few. I don't see a problem with the way the officer handled the stop other than leaving an occupant in the vehicle while he retrieved the weapons.
Also I'm aware that it's been 10 years since I worked as a LEO and laws change. But even as growing up I know once I acknowledged there was a firearm in the vehicle they asked if they could see it. Run the S/N and then BS about guns for a min or so.
Louisiana is an open carry state, however it's not as well recieved as you might think. It's B.S. as most cops will hassle anyone that open carry's. Unless that has changed in the past 4 years?
Also, during Mardi Gras time you get an increase in.... strange activity.
Cool story.
I'm assuming the traffic stop was on I-10? If not, can you elaborate on what hwy/Interstate you were traveling and the city the LEO worked for?
I worked as a LEO for a department in Lake Charles, and you have to understand if it was on I-10 that is a major drug corridor. Out of state vehicle on a traffic stop at night.... well I'll let you ponder that one for a few. I don't see a problem with the way the officer handled the stop other than leaving an occupant in the vehicle while he retrieved the weapons.
Also I'm aware that it's been 10 years since I worked as a LEO and laws change. But even as growing up I know once I acknowledged there was a firearm in the vehicle they asked if they could see it. Run the S/N and then BS about guns for a min or so.
Louisiana is an open carry state, however it's not as well recieved as you might think. It's B.S. as most cops will hassle anyone that open carry's. Unless that has changed in the past 4 years?
Also, during Mardi Gras time you get an increase in.... strange activity.
Cool story.
Craftkr, it was on Hwy 8, coming into Leesville, otherwise known as Meth Highway (so yeah, a Texas truck with that many guns probably raised some suspicion). And it was Leesville PD, well known for its "speed traps"....the limit drops from 55 to 45 pretty unexpectedly.
Thanks for your insights!
Thanks for your insights!
Makes sense, hwy 171 is a well traveled route north and south and hwy 8 ties right in, and Leesville aka "Sleezeville" has it's own problem of drugs and other crap.
email\paypal address. I don't even intend to molest your cat.
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