Active shooter at Baptist Church

[Kar98]

Kar98,

You may want to write the following on the palm of your hand, so that you won't forget that: When a person starts complaining about "name -calling" that "the complaining person" KNOWS that they have irretrievably LOST the argument & that they aren't big enough to admit (often even to themselves) that they are simply: dead wrong.

Btw, such complaints are a "patented" technique of the MORON LEFT to try to shut down conversation & to try to cover-up their KNOWING spewing of foolishness & "leftist talking points".

yours, satx

Keep telling yourself that, sweetie. And statements like yours are why I don't trust cops in first place. Their level of knowledge on any particular subject is only underpassed by news announcers.

 

[GeorgeandSugar]

If the FBI wants to try and unlock DPK phone more power to them. They will just have to find a way without any help from the phone maker. However, I am sticking by the Bill of Rights. Liberty (my right to defend myself) over security (over those who would like to restrict that right over collective security). No thanks! I'll take my chances.

Benjamin Franklin famously said, "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

The context of this statement revolved around taxes too raise money for defense against the French and Indian attacks. Nevertheless, seems relevant to our current debate.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[zincwarrior]

Wanna ease up a little on the name calling and hyperbole, satx? And how do you not see that "people shouldn't have un-decryptable phones!" is the same as "people shouldn't have high capacity assault glock rifles"?

There is no reason under the Constitution for all our communications

Younggun,

PITY that you are trying to equate the LEFTIST MORON position on "gun control" to crime control.

Moreover, I presume that you know that Apple finally admitted in a sworn court document that their GOAL was solely to protect their "corporate secrets" (read: PROFITS) & that another company DID decrypt the San Bernardino terrorists cellphones. = Thus the decryption was unlikely to have been that difficult to do.

Fwiw, a person need NOT be an expert on computers/similar systems to know that Apple was LYING when they claimed that they had "no ability to comply with" a federal judge's court order, given the admission that was made in a different sworn document that was filed in another appearance.
(Long ago, I was "fair to middling investigator" & could tell when I was being lied to 90+% of the time.)

yours, satx

To be clear are you arguing the government should be able to access this without a valid warrant?

 

[satx78247]

You're not seeing the big picture. Think about how this can be MISUSED and ABUSED, rather than how it may or (more likely) may not help provide some more context in this particular case. It's like a really, really awesome impenetrable lock that can only be opened if you have the exact key. The key died with the owner, but that doesn't change the fact it's a really good lock. You have an identical lock protecting your personal information on your phone, things you may really want (and have the legal right) to keep 100% private.

But surprise, there's a super-secret master key that can be used "if there is a sufficient need."

Question: What, and more appropriately WHO, decides what "sufficient" means?
Question: What happens if someone who is charged with protecting this master key decides to share it?
Question: What happens when the key is used, if it isn't properly protected?
Question: What happens if somehow the key is found and publicly disseminated, quietly and without common knowledge, and is used to collect yours and millions of others' sensitive data?

These reasons (and more) are why Apple outright refuses to implement a skeleton key of sorts. It's a ride down a slippery slope with a really unpleasant stop at the bottom. There's a lot of things I disagree with Apple on, but they get it right with privacy protections.

Brains,

So you would support ANY commercial company refusing to release relevant records to LE, IF (God forbid) that it was YOUR wife/children who were raped/robbed/tortured/kidnapped for ransom/murdered.
(It seems to me that it's really different when it's NOT some "nameless person" & IS one of "your nearest & dearest".)

A PERSONAL NOTE: When I was an undergraduate long ago, my "college little sister" was kidnapped/raped/tortured to death (over a 4-5 day period, according to the ME's office - Among other things, she was covered with cigar burns from neck to bellybutton.).
Truthfully, I would have done ANYTHING right or wrong for VENGENCE on the man (or men) who did that to "Danni".
(The criminal(s) were never apprehended & the "river park torture case" remains open.)

youjrs, satx

 

[zincwarrior]

Kar98,

You may want to write the following on the palm of your hand, so that you won't forget that: When a person starts complaining about "name -calling" that "the complaining person" KNOWS that they have irretrievably LOST the argument & that they aren't big enough to admit (often even to themselves) that they are simply: dead wrong.

Btw, such complaints are a "patented" technique of the MORON LEFT to try to shut down conversation & to try to cover-up their KNOWING spewing of foolishness & "leftist talking points".

yours, satx

That does not follow logic.

 

[satx78247]

There is no reason under the Constitution for all our communications


To be clear are you arguing the government should be able to access this without a valid warrant?

zincewarrior,

Do you perchance have "a reading comprehension problem"?? = Everybody here seems to understand that we are talking about access WITH a valid court order.

yours, satx

 

[zincwarrior]

zincewarrior,

Do you perchance have "a reading comprehension problem"?? = Everybody here seems to understand that we are talking about access WITH a valid court order.

yours, satx

It is a 40 page thread and your posts do not use grammar or punctuation. I was merely asking what your stance was. Given your reply, you might revisit fourth grade textbooks on sentence structure and punctuation.

 

[Brains]

Brains,

So you would support ANY commercial company refusing to release relevant records to LE, IF (God forbid) that it was YOUR wife/children who were raped/robbed/tortured/kidnapped for ransom/murdered.
(It seems to me that it's really different when it's NOT some "nameless person" & IS one of "your nearest & dearest".)

Again, you aren't understanding. If you can calm down and open your mind, I'd love to help you.

There is NO universal key to the encryption on an iPhone. I really hope you can grasp why it would be a very bad thing for one to exist. Until you can get this point, and understand how it nearly certainly would be misused, any further understanding cannot happen.

So, knowing there's no skeleton key, the only ways to open the lock are have the key or to pick the lock. The key died with the perp, but the LEO's are IN NO WAY prohibited from trying to pick it. The problem, is picking the lock HAS to be difficult. Not to sound like a prick, but if the cops could do it? I could do it with my eyes closed, while people who crack encryption for fun could do it drunk, stoned, under water, and with their hands tied.

A PERSONAL NOTE: When I was an undergraduate long ago, my "college little sister" was kidnapped/raped/tortured to death (over a 4-5 day period, according to the ME's office - Among other things, she was covered with cigar burns from neck to bellybutton.).
Truthfully, I would have done ANYTHING right or wrong for VENGENCE on the man (or men) who did that to "Danni".
(The criminal(s) were never apprehended & the "river park torture case" remains open.)

youjrs, satx

I completely empathize with you, and I cannot imagine how difficult that is. I'm not a vengeful man, but I cannot guarantee I would remain that way in a similar situation.

Unfortunately, regardless of how heinous the crime, it doesn't change how or why we still need the protections mentioned above. To make a back door quite literally means to take the front door off the hinges. For everyone.

 

[satx78247]

That does not follow logic.

zincwarrior,

Perhaps not but this axiom is generally TRUE. = You are quite well known here for being one of our "house LIBs" & not being any great fan of LE.

yours, satx

 

[Vaquero]

Chill out.
Especially satx78247.
I'll open this thread for civil discussion after a while.

 

[Younggun]

SATX will not be back till Monday. Reopening the thread.

If you can't make a point without throwing insults at other members I recommend steering clear.

 

[zincwarrior]

Is it appropriate to discuss the topic that arose about encrypted phones and mandatory backdoors here, or is that better in another thread? its a fascinating topic.

To the direct one, am I incorrect in that the piece of shit escaped temporarily from a mental facility and was convicted / served a year from domestic abuse-aka beating the living shit out of his wife and stepkid. How on earth this guy passed an NICS test. It does raise the issue of what to do when someone is convicted of this stuff but already legally owns firearms.

Horrific just horrific. Station was going through a list of the victims and little bits about them.

 

[jeepinbanditrider]

Is it appropriate to discuss the topic that arose about encrypted phones and mandatory backdoors here, or is that better in another thread? its a fascinating topic.

To the direct one, am I incorrect in that the piece of shit escaped temporarily from a mental facility and was convicted / served a year from domestic abuse-aka beating the living shit out of his wife and stepkid. How on earth this guy passed an NICS test. It does raise the issue of what to do when someone is convicted of this stuff but already legally owns firearms.

Horrific just horrific. Station was going through a list of the victims and little bits about them.

The Air Force dropped the ball big time on reporting his status to the Feds. It never happened so his NICS check was clear. The system is only as good as the info feed into it. Or not fed into it in this case.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Double Naught Spy,

In other words, you don't think that the FB page's SUDDEN DISAPPERANCE had anything to do with the Facebook's well-known leftist "DIMocRATS" political agenda??

yours, satx

No. I thought I was clear on that. It would have happened with a rightest website as well. They would have done it to save their assess as quick or quicker.

 

[Dirt n Dust]

LOL! The comments are hilarious for this post.
https://twitter.com/USATODAY/status/928343873000054784

 

[Southpaw]

The Air Force dropped the ball big time on reporting his status to the Feds. It never happened so his NICS check was clear. The system is only as good as the info feed into it. Or not fed into it in this case.

It's funny.. I was listening to a known liberal radio show yesterday and they just couldn't understand how the chances of being denied and lying on a federal form didn't stop him from purchasing. Talk about a rose colored world.

 

[Dirt n Dust]

I need one of these. I can open carry AND trim the hedges. Cutting firewood while being prepared for any threat? Yes please.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Double Naught Spy,

And you believe that the mass murder's cellphone carrier REFUSING to let the DPS to have access to his encrypted cellphone is "just coincidence", too??
(The carrier said that their "company policy is to protect the privacy of our customers".)

Since he is DEAD, the mass murderer has NO "privacy" rights to protect.

yours, satx

So shortcut your inane accusatory queries, I am not a conspiracy theorist. I do understand what it means to have a business. DPS can get a warrant. It should be no problem.

 

[Southpaw]

LOL! The comments are hilarious for this post.
https://twitter.com/USATODAY/status/928343873000054784

Thanks for the laugh....

 

[Dirt n Dust]

Thanks for the laugh....

View attachment 125008

There are a lot of funny takes on that picture.