Veterans against the 2nd amendment. Check this out

[MTA]

Glad to see that so many "veterans" still support and defend the Constitution of the United States. Well atleast the parts that google, facebook and the rest of the global elites agree with... for now.

 

[BRD@66]

The 1st phrase that comes to mind is "stolen valor".

 

[benenglish]

They all express an opinion except for Corporal Aiken. She's the one who tells the outright lie that an AR is the same as an M4 or M16.

Has anybody called her out on it? I kinda doubt it.

 

[TheMailMan]

I couldn't get through the first minute.

Nothing but uninformed sheeple. I'd guess almost everyone of them would have a hard time shooting a Garand. The recoil would break their shoulder.

 

[busykngt]

They are absolutely correct; it is meant for one thing.

That thing is: protecting the rest of us from tyranny represented by the likes of folks like you. (Said by me... also an Army veteran).

 

[Ole Cowboy]

Here is one of the jokers:

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/broward/article205955159.html

He is a lawyer, implies he was a hard hitting Infantry officer..well kinda, sorta. US Army RESERVE, JAG office (ALL JAG's go thru Infantry Officers Basic, then onto the JAG corp.. My BET other than IOBC he has never stood in front of a platoon. The training your get in IOBC is far less than what they get (GOT??) in Basic for enlisted. To say he is highly trained is weak at BEST!

Just another slime ball lying lawyer

 

[Bozz10mm]

Comments have been disabled. I wonder why.

 

[Big Green]

When I was stationed in NY a few years ago I had a USMC Major tell me he didn't believe civilians should have ARs. He said only people properly trained should have those types of weapons.

Ironic thing is that he is Native American. The fact that the government can easily control an unarmed populace was completely lost on him.

 

[motorcarman]

 

[MTA]

When I was stationed in NY a few years ago I had a USMC Major tell me he didn't believe civilians should have ARs. He said only people properly trained should have those types of weapons.

Ironic thing is that he is Native American. The fact that the government can easily control an unarmed populace was completely lost on him.

Those are the types of people they love to fill the military with now. I bet he would have a hard on if he could massacre a bunch of civilians for not bending over for the government. Especially if they were "evil crackers"

 

[Darkpriest667]

Gonna say something not popular here. I've always thought we deified veterans to a point that is unhealthy. I appreciate the volunteer armed forces, but just because someone chose to join does make them morally, intellectually, ethically, or physically superior to those that have not. When it comes to firearms I've found most veterans know less than I do and I consider myself a novice.

 

[MTA]

Gonna say something not popular here. I've always thought we deified veterans to a point that is unhealthy. I appreciate the volunteer armed forces, but just because someone chose to join does make them morally, intellectually, ethically, or physically superior to those that have not. When it comes to firearms I've found most veterans know less than I do and I consider myself a novice.

I agree 100%. I am willing to bet all of these people sat behind a desk and they only used a rifle to qualify once a year.

I was an armorer and I saw stunning examples of retardation on behalf of infantry and non infantry Marines on a daily basis. I could only imagine what the other branches were like when it comes to a complete and utter lack of firearms knowledge

 

[TheMailMan]

Gonna say something not popular here. I've always thought we deified veterans to a point that is unhealthy. I appreciate the volunteer armed forces, but just because someone chose to join does make them morally, intellectually, ethically, or physically superior to those that have not. When it comes to firearms I've found most veterans know less than I do and I consider myself a novice.

I agree. When I went in I went in with a guaranteed Infantry contract. My ASVAB scores were 99.9%. If I hadn't taken that contract I'd have become a HAWK missile tech. Infantry didn't know what to do with me. They stuck me with a 0351 MOS. Dragon/TOW gunner. I would have rather humped a Pig, that's an M-60 machine gun to those outside of the suck. Even back in the dark ages most of the Marines I met knew nothing about firearms.

I read an article last year that showed that the average IQ of an Army infantry platoon was 75. I guess that butter bar with an IQ of 100 feels pretty damn smart when dealing with them.

I've met way to many SNCOs who got where they were because of what they were as opposed to what they know, but because they have rockers they think that their shit doesn't stink, I met a few E-6 to E-8 that were functionally illiterate. I think it was Commandant Gray that instituted the Commandant's Reading List. I'm pretty sure that caused a lot of consternation in the ranks.

I'm convinced that anyone who can graduate college can become an officer in the military these days. Sadly the services aren't looking for leaders, they are looking for followers, even in the officer ranks.

 

[busykngt]

...just because someone chose to join...

You’re showing your age. Some of us didn’t exactly “choose” to join. Local Draft Board #27, long time ago. I owe the little old silver (purple)-haired lady a debt of gratitude to this day. The advice she gave me was “golden”.

 

[Big Green]

Gonna say something not popular here. I've always thought we deified veterans to a point that is unhealthy. I appreciate the volunteer armed forces, but just because someone chose to join does make them morally, intellectually, ethically, or physically superior to those that have not. When it comes to firearms I've found most veterans know less than I do and I consider myself a novice.

I say it all the time, some fellow vets have gotten butt hurt but it's true. Everyone wants to call us all heroes. In my 12 years I never did anything heroic. I flew around in the back of a Herc loading Marines and cargo.

As far as firearms, we had a pretty small group that was, and is, pretty big into firearms. The rest were pretty dangerous and made me nervous with them on the range. When I was a Sergeant we had a Gunny in the S4 shop load the rounds in her M9 mag backwards.

 

[Ole Cowboy]

Those are the types of people they love to fill the military with now. I bet he would have a hard on if he could massacre a bunch of civilians for not bending over for the government. Especially if they were "evil crackers"

I can tell you for a FACT they are booting out from West Point to Active duty anyone who is outspoken Conservative, Christian, rural background, hunter, NRA member. And they are NOT recruiting them either.

I just met a guy in civy clothes as I was walking in for some lunch and he noticed the 1st Cav patch on my cap. We sat down for lunch together. He as AD 28 years E-8 on Recruiting Duty. Just a good old boy, for E Tx, hunter, life NRA, TRUMP man. Commander suggested he get "those stickers" off his truck as they were NOT appropriate. He told me it was an 'under your breath', don't recruit the rural country boys, look to see what they are driving, take note of trucks and jeeps, looks for NRA stickers or other controversial bumper stickers. Don't ask if they own guns, ask if they are hunters feigning and light hearted talk well you will find basic easy as a good shot.

I was stunned in that 45 min discussion.

Gonna say something not popular here. I've always thought we deified veterans to a point that is unhealthy. I appreciate the volunteer armed forces, but just because someone chose to join does make them morally, intellectually, ethically, or physically superior to those that have not. When it comes to firearms I've found most veterans know less than I do and I consider myself a novice.

Let run this again in HOPES that some of your read it.

If, IF by some chance you come across a for real combat veteran, suggest you talk long with him if he is willing to talk as there are so few, they are RARE to ever meet.

2.55 M attendees to Vietnam '65-'75 Out of almost 10 MILLION who served in the military from '64-'75.

SO only about a 25% chance of going to Vietnam, only 1 out of 4 went. I knew plenty of soldiers that never went to Vietnam over my 26 years ending in '94.

IF you were Infantry you spent an average of 240 days outside the wire, however that is a very misleading number. Many units bused their Infantry out at first light and brought them back at night, this was done generally in low chance of contact and what was believed to be safe or cleared zones. So the days were counted, but few ever fired their guns.

We have 3 worlds in the Army:
Combat: Air Defense Artillery, Armor, Aviation, Engineers, Field Artillery,
Infantry, and Special Forces.

Combat Support: These folks provide direct support to the combat units. Intel, Commo, Chemical etc.

Combat Service Support: Finance, Dental, Logistics etc.

In other words it takes a LOT of folks to insure I have beans and bullets, in fact, all total, outside the wire over the Vietnam timeframe about 350,000 folks MAX, the rest were juggled beans and bullets.



FACT JACK: Very few vets ever carried a gun outside of basic training, rare to find one that carried a gun on their person 24x7. When I made Major in '85 I never touched another gun till I retired. My time before that I had a LOT of contact with gun(s), almost daily albeit in garrison we did draw them except to clea. In Vietnam when I arrived at my unit I was issued a gun and I did not turn that in for over 12 mo and only then did I turn it over to the unit Armorer as I got on the helicopter to fly to Cam Rah Bay to catch a plane for home. I had him my steel pot, my flak jacket and my M 16. I arrived in Cam Rah with out a shirt or hat on, unshaved, unbathed what little I had was stuffed in my pockets of my jungle fatigue pants...only that morning I had been on the DMZ.

No, most are not knowledgeable about guns or anything else pertaining to combat, tactics, guns or anything else, they did not need to, it was not part of their job, there was no requirement other than to be a good: Clerk, Supply, truck driver, dental assistant, finance clerk and the other tens of thousands of jobs in the military.

ONLY the Infantry has the mission 'to close with and engage the enemy'. To hunt the bastard down on the killing fields and kill him before he kills me or any of us.

 

[Darkpriest667]

You’re showing your age. Some of us didn’t exactly “choose” to join. Local Draft Board #27, long time ago. I owe the little old silver (purple)-haired lady a debt of gratitude to this day. The advice she gave me was “golden”.

There hasn't been a draft since December 7 1972 which means that the youngest draftee from Vietnam (who never would have been shipped to SE Asia) would be 64... The youngest members who were actively drafted and served in Vietnam would be 66 now. I'm not saying I disrespect veterans, I'm saying younger veterans (under 60) are all volunteers.

 

[Younggun]

Hmmm.

I deployed as support. Ground maintenance in an AviM unit. I carried my rifle everywhere, every day. This was in Balad, '04-'05. Biggest threat for most of that time was getting hit by randomly fired mortor rounds or RPGs. But we still carried an M16 everywhere we went. So I don't know if that "fact" about not carrying a rifle is accurate @Ole Cowboy.

That said, most of those I've met in the military were firearms illiterate and couldn't even zero with instructions printed on the paper.

I went to Basic in March 2003. We learned that blood makes the green grass grow and learned to "kill kill kill, woth cold blue steel". We sang cadence about dying in combat, killing people, and the smell of burning napalm. I've got a guy working for me, army engineer that did route clearance in Afghanistan and operated the CROW system. He went to basic in 2007 and all of the stuff I remembered had been removed. His lawn doesn't get watered with blood, they don't kill kill kill with cold blue steel, and the cadences were lame. I was amazed at how much it had changed in a short time. He knew next to nothing about civilian firearms and only the operational basics of those he used.

The last unit I was in before I time ended was a training unit. They went to Ft Hood to train deploying units. Only me and another guy from 3rd ID had actually been deployed in a combat zone. Well, one other old Vietnam vet who's probably long since been retired. He was great. Otherwise it was a gaggle of NCOs and COs with absolutely no experience who couldn't understand why I declined BNCO training, or worrior leadership training, or whatever it's called now. I watched an E6 start to chew out a combat vet suffering from PTSD for "not talking to him" and he only backed off after he threatened to take me in front of the CO for getting involved and I offered to lead the way. He then told me I needed to check my attitude and walked away.


The Army, and military is general, is changing. Still lots of good people but lots of douche bags and they are making it more comfortable for them.

I also agree with the hero thing. I've always been uncomfortable with people thanking me for my service and what not. That said, wouldn't mind if I got off for veterans day.

 

[TexasBrandon]

I was in Baghdad at FOB Falcon for all of '06. I knew as much about my M16 as I could at the time without being given the range time needed to really hone in the skills. I carried my rifle everywhere as Younggun did. Goin to the shitter? Take your rifle. Goin to the DFAC? Take your rifle. That being said, I also was familiar with the civilian side of firearms.

I don't blame military personnel for not knowing their weapon as well as they should. I blame their leadership for not getting them the range time. For not letting them fail at adjusting their rifles at zeroing. I guess the other side of things is the soldiers complaining about getting up at 0400 to weapon draw at 0530 to go to the range at 0800 to go hot at 0900. That is still a leadership thing though. I remember one guy we had that was at another FOB who would frequently convoy to our FOB for various reasons. He had his M14 with his "own" red dot on it. I'm not sure why his platoon sergeant, team chief, or even any other NCO didn't say anything to him. He had this thing duct taped to his damn rifle. I never wanted to be in a combat situation with him and luckily never was.

As a NCO, I made sure my soldiers knew how to operate their weapon at a proficient enough level without going to the range to experiment. You don't get "practice" time at the range in the signal corps. We went to qualify and what was it. If I happen to be sent to the range to oversee soldiers needing to qualify I took my own rifle too. We always had excess ammunition that seemed to be easier to just expend then take back. That's how I got to the point of shooting 38,39, or 40 of 40.

It wasn't until after my return from Iraq that I got extremely acquainted with bullet grains, powder grains, case lengths, etc. I've spent more time at the range than I can even try to guess now.

So as far as veterans not knowing the weapons. I would have to agree with that the majority of them don't. Some of us did, the rest, not so much. While I don't ask for a "thanks" I won't disregard someone telling me it either. I definitely don't go looking for attention but I do wear the veteran hat with pride, it is part of who I am and laid the structure in my life. I would have probably been vastly different without the world experiences I have had.

 

[karlac]

Those who have lost a comrade in combat had something taken away that never gets put back.
You might thank a thousand for both of them, but that's the chance they took.
So go ahead, thank them all.