Any News on the dreaded ATF ruling re: Saiga shotguns???

[SC-Texas]

Well they are coming after grandad's pump now.

So 3 Gun and 2 gun isn't sporting?

Every gun owner should email the BATFE and their congressional reps immediatly.

 

[SC-Texas]

And it isn't just about importation.

This is what happened a few years before the AWB of 1994.

They are going after the "EVIL" featyres and ignoring the reality of modern sporting purposes.

Now what does this mean for us?

It means that the ATF can simply declare that your grand daddy's pump is a Destructive device if it has rails, pistol grip long tube, etc.

Hell, these bastards are ignoring the sporit of hog hunting at night where you need rails for lights and red dot sights!

Look, this is where the bastards are going!

They did it in 1989 and then in 1994 for domestic shotguns!

this time they will do it without Congres by declaring shotguns with these "EVIL FEATURES" to be destructive devices!

NEver forget!

NEVER forgive!

 

[M. Sage]

And it isn't just about importation.

This is what happened a few years before the AWB of 1994.

They are going after the "EVIL" featyres and ignoring the reality of modern sporting purposes.

Now what does this mean for us?

It means that the ATF can simply declare that your grand daddy's pump is a Destructive device if it has rails, pistol grip long tube, etc.

Hell, these bastards are ignoring the sporit of hog hunting at night where you need rails for lights and red dot sights!

Look, this is where the bastards are going!

They did it in 1989 and then in 1994 for domestic shotguns!

this time they will do it without Congres by declaring shotguns with these "EVIL FEATURES" to be destructive devices!

NEver forget!

NEVER forgive!

You're letting them dictate the debate when you get sucked into arguing about sporting purposes. We need to dominate and dictate the debate.

The whole premise of sporting purposes is flawed. What is sport to one man is scary military type militia training to another. It's subjective. It's also flawed because it has nothing to do with the root argument against gun control. The obvious purpose of the Second Amendment is not to protect our right to own toys for sport. It protects our right to own weaponry. For what purpose? To use against any enemy that threatens our safety, foreign or domestic, including our own government.

This involves being damn unsporting.

Interestingly, some of my activist buddies have been fairly silent about this. Something tells me it might wind up being good for us from a long-term strategic standpoint if BATFE does go after these.

 

[matefrio]

Well they are coming after grandad's pump now.

So 3 Gun and 2 gun isn't sporting?

Every gun owner should email the BATFE and their congressional reps immediatly.

Not only having something declared "not sporting". How about having something in your collection declared a "Destructive Device" overnight?

Those who think the panic\frenzy is funny and laugh at reactions every time the ATF even starts to speculate have very short memories.

 

[matefrio]

Just wondering if an anti-Saiga shotgun ruling happened today. A lot of internet chatter, and panic buying due to an alleged move by the ATF to classify the Saiga a destructive device.

Thanks,

ATF may not have ruled on the shotguns but the plant has stopped making them due to QA issues and focus. There'll be a shortage restocking. Importers have been shaken up a bit with a reorg of their own and the Discovery Channel has a new show featuring the Saiga shotguns very prominently.

I think the investment may have been sound.

 

[M. Sage]

To the point of what I just posted. This comes from the ATF memo (I'm just skimming it for now):

Further, both studies concluded that the scope of “sporting
purposes” did not include all lawful activity, but was limited to traditional sports such as hunting,
skeet shooting, and trap shooting. This effectively narrowed the universe of firearms considered
by each study because a larger number of firearms are “particularly suitable for or readily
adaptable to a sporting purpose” if plinking4 and police or military-style practical shooting
competitions are also included as a “sporting purpose.”

What did I just say about practical shooting sports? I'm actually scared at how right I was.

For reference, this letter keeps talking about 925(d)(3). That particular part reads thus (with some context included):

(d) The Attorney General shall authorize a firearm or ammunition
to be imported or brought into the United States or any possession
thereof if the firearm or ammunition -
<snip>
(3) is of a type that does not fall within the definition of a
firearm as defined in section 5845(a) of the Internal Revenue
Code of 1986 and is generally recognized as particularly suitable
for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes, excluding surplus
military firearms, except in any case where the Attorney General
has not authorized the importation of the firearm pursuant to
this paragraph, it shall be unlawful to import any frame,
receiver, or barrel of such firearm which would be prohibited if
assembled

More context - Revenue Code 5845(a):

(a) Firearm The term ''firearm'' means (1) a shotgun having a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length; (2) a weapon made from a shotgun if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length; (3) a rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length; (4) a weapon made from a rifle if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length; (5) any other weapon, as defined in subsection (e); (6) a machinegun; (7) any silencer (as defined in section 921 of title 18, United States Code); and (8) a destructive device.

Read more: 26 USC 5845 - Sec. 5845. Definitions - US Code - Title 26: Internal Revenue Code - Part I - General Provisions . - vLex
​

What these mean together is that you cannot import a firearm if it falls under NFA (that Revenue Code section just listed all the NFA goodies), or if the AG thinks it doesn't have a sporting purpose. And previous studies say it has to be a traditional sport like skeet or hunting. If it's a "military or police style" sport like 3-gun or any other practical shooting, it's not considered a sport (elitist pricks).

Complete bullshit statement:

Unlike sporting shotguns,
military firearms are larger, heavier, and generally more rugged.

Yeah, 'cause a goose gun won't have a 26" barrel, and military shotguns are never 10-12" barreled breachers. Lying assholes.

Under "General Firearm Statutes by State" they cherry-picked and added one statute I know is not lawfully enacted - a San Diego ban. CA is a preemption state. Localities may not make ordinances regarding firearms.

I had a giggle at the tards thinking that the Steyr AUG is a shotgun, though. They don't even know what they're talking about... and we have to listen to them!?

Oh. My. God. They made a PDF file with an extra page at the end labeled "intentionally left blank". Dude... just leave that one out of the PDF.

I cannot believe how stupid our government is.

I have to admit, it's crap like this that makes me hate our government.

 

[Texan2]

I thought the Obamanation administration was coming to the center?

 

[TexasRedneck]

I thought the Obamanation administration was coming to the center?

Define "center"......