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Attitude Adjustments Needed...it's OUR money!

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    West Texas

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    Attitude Adjustments Needed
    Posted by Ron Miller on October 10, 2010 at 7:30am

    I was on the train ride home after my Sunday morning appearance on Fox and Friends, and sitting in the “quiet car”, which gives me time to think and reflect, or sleep.


    One of the things that hit me as I was recalling the comments made by my fellow panelists that morning about the inaccurately named, wrong-headed, government-expanding, union-appeasing and vote-buying $787 billion monstrosity called a stimulus package, is how successfully the political elites have brainwashed us about tax revenues and their role in spending them.


    I made the comment at the conclusion of the segment that the administration would have been better off just cutting every man, woman and child in the United States a check and letting them stimulate the economy. For what it’s worth, that would work out to roughly $2,957 a person.


    Our host indicated that the nice young woman sitting next to me was shaking her head in objection to my statement, and we would have to leave it at that. But I don’t think we should.


    Her objection to my comment illustrates a complacent and dangerous attitude about the government’s use, more accurately their misuse and abuse, of tax dollars. I’m not willing to let it pass without establishing some basic facts that should inform any discussion we have about taxes and spending.


    The most fundamental fact that government seems determined to erase from our collective memories is this: It’s our money. Say that out loud, and let it reverberate in the air for a moment, then say it again, louder and with more determination. IT’S OUR MONEY.


    Not a single government employee, from the town clerk to the president of the United States, created the wealth that pays their salaries. If every private sector employee in America disappeared from the face of the planet tomorrow, they wouldn’t have two pennies to rub together to heat the Capitol building.


    When I suggest that the money spent to date on the stimulus package would have been better off in the hands of the American people, I do so with the firm conviction that it belongs to us in the first place.
    That is why the debate over the expiration of the tax cuts put in place by President George W. Bush is so maddening to me. They’re referring to the tax cuts as “welfare for the rich” and an additional burden on the federal budget deficit, one that has to be “funded” through some kind of offset, which is a another word for reducing government spending.


    Get it through your heads, people! It’s not welfare if it’s ours in the first place! A tax cut is letting people and businesses keep more of the money they earned through their willingness to take risks, their skills and knowledge, and their exertion. It’s not a government program, and it’s not an expense. IT’S OUR MONEY.


    I know the concept of earned money is foreign to most liberals, who think people don’t deserve what they make because they won’t “do the right thing” with it, or it was fraudulently gained, or it is the result of some historical inequity. They are idiots.


    If Michael Moore or Oliver Stone, Hollywood’s twin terrors of capitalism, think they are worthy of the money they’ve earned, more power to them. If they don’t think they deserve the money they’ve earned, then give it to charity or go seek counseling. But leave the rest of us alone.


    I have read that the reason celebrities are virulently anti-capitalist is because they don’t consider what they do for a living to be worth the millions many of them make. To them, their good fortune is simply the result of luck, fate, karma or crystals, and there are professions out there, such as teachers and social workers, who offer more value to the world and should be paid accordingly.


    To those celebrities, I say this: you were sleeping off a cast party during the lesson on principles of economics, assuming they teach economics in school anymore. Value is a subjective determination, and its definition is variable depending on who you ask. One man’s value is another man’s vanity.


    Free enterprise is driven by people who create something the world wants, and the more the world wants it, the more of it people create, and the wealthier they become.


    Both buyer and seller get what they want. The buyer wants what that person created more than the money in their hands. The seller wants the money in the buyer’s hands more than what they created. The exchange is made and everyone wins. The seller then takes the money and uses it to buy things created by others that they want more than the money they just earned.


    It is an elegant system with limitless production capacity, both for wealth and material goods, because it capitalizes on the one thing for which humans are made; to create.


    Capitalism is practical because it expands wealth and material goods so there is more for everyone who works for it. It is moral because it gives every human being the freedom to create and the opportunity to be rewarded for their creativity. Despite the liberal shibboleth of the rich benefiting at the expense of the poor, the facts show that wealth has increased for everyone, not decreased or remained static. The rich get richer and the poor get richer.


    There is no coercion or involuntary action at work here, unlike the government when it uses its power to tax us and give our money to someone or something else not of our choosing.


    That brings me to my second fundamental fact; neither government nor business are charities.


    Our Constitution is clear on the role of government, and when government crosses the line from protector and enforcer to provider, they are breaking the law of the land. The fact they do so with impunity is more a reflection on what we have permitted out of fear and uncertainty. The renewed emphasis on the 10th Amendment by the Tea Party movement is perhaps a start toward reversing government’s usurpation of roles designed for private institutions and individuals.


    Similarly, people who think businesses ought to give more, or have more taken from them, to fund humanitarian causes or government aid programs fail to understand why they are in business in the first place.


    A few weeks ago, AFL-CIO president and thug Richard Trumka – I don’t use the term “thug” as hyperbole, given his history – blasted businesses for holding back on spending money, and therefore exacerbating the economic slowdown and the resulting unemployment numbers. Tell me, to whom is a business, a private enterprise, accountable? Is it government? Is it the labor unions? Is it “the economy” or some other broadly defined entity?


    Or is it the shareholders, board of directors, and stockholders, which include scores of everyday Americans?


    The purpose of business isn’t to create jobs or boost the economy. That is a desirable outcome, but ultimately a business exists to turn a profit for its shareholders and stockholders. There is no other role for businesses than to create wealth. If demand for their products or services is down, or if the taxation and regulatory climate is unstable or uncertain, a business is obligated to cut expenses and mitigate risk to protect the people who own their stock.


    Liberals who want to coerce government and business into performing acts of charity are notoriously stingy when it comes to personal investments in charitable organizations, according to multiple studies. Perhaps they ought to give more of their time, talent and treasure to charities and churches which are closest to the needs of the community, and deliver services more efficiently, and with greater compassion, because they’re helping their neighbors.


    My point is that every institution has a role, and when they step outside of those roles and stomp all over the prerogatives of another institution’s role, systemic failure is guaranteed. Government protects and enforces, individuals and businesses create wealth, and families, communities, and houses of worship administer care.


    One would think these highly intelligent people should understand how the world works, which brings me to my third point; “they” are not better than “us”.


    One of the attitudes I detected in the panel discussion was haughtiness, especially when I suggested the people could have stimulated the economy much more effectively than government. You could almost hear the “harrumphs!” as elites rejected the very notion that the unwashed masses could do anything better than them. “Why, they don’t have the pedigree to make such weighty decisions!,” they harrumphed. “Best to leave those to us!”


    I see and hear it all the time – people who think that education or wealth or status or celebrity somehow makes them more qualified to speak and act on our behalf. Sometimes, their haughtiness leads to name-calling and mockery, and they can become downright mean. Yes, we can be mean, too – it’s frustrating when people with power and influence, and their followers, look down their collective noses at you.


    Remember this, however. Everyone falls. No one is protected from the troubles of this world, and prideful people are at a disadvantage when hard times come. Not only is their knowledge, intellect, station or fame useless, they have set themselves apart from their fellow man, and help won’t be there when they need it.


    We are in hard times right now, individually and as a nation. Those of us who wake up every morning thankful for another day of life, who work hard to serve our families, who reach out to neighbors in need, who put others before ourselves, who see in each other the very image of God – we are the ones who will save this country. While the elites try to manipulate forces that are beyond their control because they think they’re smarter and better than God, if they even believe there’s a God, it is humility, generosity and grace that will sustain the rest of us.


    One of my favorite Bible verses is Ephesians 2:10, “For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.” Those words govern my attitude toward others. Think about it. God prepared good works in advance for us to do. Then he set about designing each of us to do the specific work he prepared for us. That means each one of us has a God-given task that belongs to us and no one else. How can I possibly look down on God’s workers? You are uniquely designed to do something I can’t do, and no one can do what I can do. It is my acceptance of that fact that makes it easy for me to, in the words of the apostle Paul, “consider others better than yourself.”


    Consider what kind of nation we would have if we demanded good stewardship of taxpayer dollars by our elected officials because IT’S OUR MONEY, if government stuck to its role as a protector and enforcer, and let other institutions perform theirs, because neither business nor government are charities, and if we demanded the respect of our elites because “they” are not better than “us”. It’s time for us to change our thinking, and those of the people we designate as our public servants. Whatever it takes, our nation needs an attitude adjustment – today.

    Capitol Armory ad
     

    skinman

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    I have been staying away from the political forums because it was just not a pleasant place to discuss and debate differing opinions. Things seem to be better now so I wanted to offer a few counterpoints to this essay.



    "Her objection to my comment illustrates a complacent and dangerous attitude..."
    Since she was not allowed to rebut the comment, then how could the author possibly know what her attitude might have been? However, it did make for a launching pad for an opinion essay.


    “IT’S OUR MONEY.”
    It is tax revenue that is mostly paid by the middle class. That is fact and is not going to change. What does change is who gets to decide how to spend it, and how that decision should be made. Since we are a democrat republic, we elect people to represent us in a large government body called a congress. Ours is a bi-cameral body with an elaborate system of checks and balances to make sure that all voices have an opportunity to be heard. It is that body that makes those decisions for us. If we do not agree with the decision of the majority, then we have a right, and obligation, to vote for a representative who will support our views and if our views represent the views of the majority, then we will have succeeded in having our views implemented. If not, we have a right to complain when things do not go the way we want and vote for change. But, in the end, it is still a system that represents MANY views about how things should be done and if you get your way, someone else is not getting theirs.

    The Stimulus Package

    The author intentionally fails to point out that the stimulus package was Bush’s baby in the first place because this opinion offered in this essay is clearly directed against the current administration and Congress. Also, the successes or failure of this policy are not presented and discussed because it would show that there have been more success with this policy than failures. This goes against the basis of the author’s rant and shows this essay is more of an emphasis on inflammatory politics and fear-mongering than an interest in presenting fact.

    Tax Cuts

    An equally valid question is why should those who earn more expect to pay less tax on their disposable income? A family of four earning $50K annually pays far more of their income in taxes than an individual earning $250K annually. What is unfair about expecting those who can afford to pay more while keeping up their standard of living having to do so? We all equally share in the benefits; why not also equally share the expense?

    Traditionally in hard economic times wealthy individuals do not invest, they save. Saving and not investing does not stimulate the economy. While I certainly agree that putting more in the hands of the people, it needs to be put in the hands of the people who will spend it and immediately stimulate the economy, not necessarily those who will just put it in an offshore bank and wait for a better investment climate.

    “I know the concept of earned money is foreign to most liberals..."
    Ah, here it is…liberals are clueless. Make a blanket statement and toss in an inflammatory comment up front. This is what this entire conservative rant is all about. There is very little individual thought from the author here, just a mindless parroting of the conservative mantra on about how some disgruntled folks are justified in not wanting to pay a fair share; not wanting to help those who need help..."I got mine, so screw off." What if those who need help are our elderly, children, sick, and those who have just fallen on hard times and need a helping hand. This attitude is what they are saying today but what will they say when they are the ones needing help? They are going to depend on the same system that they are condemning today to be there for them but if they have their way, there will be nothing there for them.

    Celebrities

    Celebrities would not matter if people did not make them matter. As long as there is a controversy with what they say, then they are getting attention. And attention is what keeps them relevant in the entertainment world…just like conservatives such as Sarah Palin, Rush Limbaugh, Newt Gingrich, et al…same song, same chorus.

    Free Enterprise and Capitalism

    The author is demonstrating an extremely naïve and myopic view of capitalism that shows a fundamental lack of understanding of how the forces of micro and macro economics work on a national and global level. The current situation is that the wealth has not increased for everybody and the wealthy are indeed benefiting at the expense of those who are working harder and earning less. The fact is that in this country when the conservatives are in control, the gap between wealthy and poor increases. Today, as a direct result of the last decade of the same conservative policies called out for in this essay being implemented, that gap is at historic proportions.

    "Neither government or businesses are charities..."
    Really? Every time a business is given a tax break or exemption from regulations that is a form of charity. And, an assumption is demonstrated by the author in the comment that some people may believe that governments are charities is simply inflammatory rhetoric meant to drive a nonexistent point. I do not believe that any American believes that the government is a charity. However, I do believe that some liberals and conservatives believe that the government owes them.

    Our Constitution

    Yes, our Constitution is clear…but it is important that we understand how it works and why it is so successful…clearly the author is either lacking in understanding or preying on the ignorance of those who do not understand how our Constitution works. Our Constitution is not a smorgasbord where we get to pick and choose what parts we agree with to embrace and toss out those we disagree with. Those who favor private gun ownership must live with the restrictions of what is responsible gun ownership and those who want to practice their religion unencumbered must also respect those who do not believe in any religion. Everyone has basic civil rights even when they might not deserve it…because even if one person is denied what we all take for granted, then all of us are in danger of loosing it all. It was designed that way and it works well but only if we fight to protect it in its entirety and not just what we want from it.

    "...People who think businesses ought to give more, or have more taken from them, to fund humanitarian causes or government aid..."
    An example is called for here because the author has made a reckless claim without providing even one example. What businesses have been FORCED to fund humanitarian causes or government aid programs? If so, then what were the reasons? Should BP be forced to fund economic recovery programs as a result of their negligence with the massive oil spill this past summer? Should businesses be forced to clean up the toxic waste left over from the production of their product and pay restitution to those who were harmed in situations like the Love Canal? Should auto manufacturers be held unaccountable for injury and loss of life because they knowingly put out a dangerous product because it was too expensive to fix?

    " “They” are not better than “us”."
    And, yet this author clearly demonstrates that he believes that conservatives are better than liberals yet fails to grasp that the majority of the conservative power base comes from the elite and wealthy, and politicians on both sides of the isle are overwhelmingly representative of the elite and wealthy. Even the Tea Party power base is not the rank and file conservatives as they would have us believe…

    “Everyone falls…”
    Yes indeed! But, clearly the author does not grasp the meaning. The old saying goes, “There, but for the grace of God, go I.” At any time, any one of us can be there and if we fall for the siren song of the Tea Party and conservatives, we will end up wrecked and there will be nothing there to help us back on our feet.


    “It’s time for us to change our thinking”
    Yes, it is time for a change in thinking…but do we really want to go back to the same thinking that got us into this mess in the first place? Are we going to be hypnotized by the charismatic serpent of the right again and fall victim to the same old conservative policies of the last decade that the Tea Party espouses? The Tea Party is just the GOP wolf wearing a sheep skin. We have not given the current administration’s plans time to work. Changing now would be a huge mistake and a disaster of epic proportions. If you don’t think things could get any worse, then put the conservatives back in power and watch it happen.
     

    texas skeeter

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    Somewhere here nor there....
    I have been staying away from the political forums because it was just not a pleasant place to discuss and debate differing opinions.
    well when most your points are wrong most of the time i could see why you would stay away.

    It is tax revenue that is mostly paid by the middle class.
    boy aint this the truth!!

    why not also equally share the expense?
    Oh you mean like the "POOR" pay their share??? cause i know NUMEROUS people that continue to STAY at the poverty line ON PURPOSE to collect more "FREE" money from our Gvnmnt!!!!!!!!!

    "I got mine, so screw off."
    and here I DO believe they have EVERY rite to make this choice since they EARNED the money THEMSELVES!!! but you'd rather take it away!!
    Celebrities would not matter if people did not make them matter. As long as there is a controversy with what they say, then they are getting attention. And attention is what keeps them relevant in the entertainment world….
    this I agree with 100%.

    We have not given the current administration’s plans time to work.
    and this one is LAUGHABLE!! as Im laughing at you not with you!!
     

    MR Redneck

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    Here's my idea. If someone is selling me something, I want some proof that it will work before I buy it! I dont need to give anything a chance! Show me some science behind the machine! History shows us what happens in politics. When the government starts "correcting" issues, they only get worse.
    I think the only way to economic growth is to leave the people alone!!! I for one will not spend a dime if the government want to controll what im spending it on or where I spend it!
    The government cant fix the economy! All they can do is creat more debt! Capitalism is the only answer. When the people have a chance to capitialize on their spending, they will get the money moving! Government money is as worthless as the people that get it!!!
     

    skinman

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    well when most your points are wrong most of the time i could see why you would stay away.

    Right or wrong, it is my opinion and I enjoy defending it with passion. The reason I stayed away was that I do not enjoy having to deal with the same old insults and personal attacks. It is too easy to get caught up in that kind of crap. I do not think that this kind of thing is a healthy exchange of opinions. And, it certainly makes these forums less inviting.

    Oh you mean like the "POOR" pay their share??? cause i know NUMEROUS people that continue to STAY at the poverty line ON PURPOSE to collect more "FREE" money from our Gvnmnt!!!!!!!!!

    There are leeches everywhere. Fewer of those folks are on the poverty line out of choice than you think. While some are content to live at the government tit, most just don't know of a different way. Corporate welfare will be with us as long as corporates are allowed to buy politicians and there are politicians with their hand out. The will always be wealthy and privileged using their wealth and status to find ways to exclude themselves from the rules and regulations the average person has to contend with.

    Did you see the article in the Houston Chronicle recently about how some very wealthy folks were drawing unemployment benefits?

    and here I DO believe they have EVERY rite to make this choice since they EARNED the money THEMSELVES!!! but you'd rather take it away!!

    Yet they will expect the government to help them when they don't have it anymore. It is an, "I want mine...and yours also," mentality.


    and this one is LAUGHABLE!! as Im laughing at you not with you!!

    Things do not turn around in a couple of years. It took more than two years of a do-nothing government policy to create the current mess, it will take more than two years of fixing to turn it around.

    I do not know what you do for a living, but if you are retired or dependent on service or sales, you will not be laughing if we ignore history and return to the failed policies of this past decade.
     

    texas skeeter

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    Somewhere here nor there....
    I do not know what you do for a living, but if you are retired or dependent on service or sales, you will not be laughing if we ignore history and return to the failed policies of this past decade.
    everything previous to this statement is the same blah blah blah from the left. I on the otherhand still work 70-80 hrs a week in the RECESSION PROOF Refrigeration trade cause i choose to. life is good for me in this horrible economy but not cause it was given to me but because i researched carefully what i wanted to do for a living to provide for a family. other than most sucking off the taxes we all pay cause they are TOO LAZY to actually research a good recession proof job!!!! and their are plenty of recesssion proof jobs out there!!! and as far as the past policies previous to O-IDIOT, I'll take the good 6 yrs of Bushes 8 than your lil buddies first 2 DISASTEROUS FOOLISH yrs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     

    Jeff B

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    Yes, it is time for a change in thinking…but do we really want to go back to the same thinking that got us into this mess in the first place? Are we going to be hypnotized by the charismatic serpent of the right again and fall victim to the same old conservative policies of the last decade that the Tea Party espouses? The Tea Party is just the GOP wolf wearing a sheep skin. We have not given the current administration’s plans time to work. Changing now would be a huge mistake and a disaster of epic proportions. If you don’t think things could get any worse, then put the conservatives back in power and watch it happen.

    What "Conservative Policies" of the last decade. George W. Bush governed as a moderate and spent like a liberal. There was almost nothing connected to his term in office that could be construed as conservative.

    As far as the politics of "change", I want nothing to do with them. I have seen or heard NOTHING from the current Administration that I accept or support. What I want to see is the emasculation of the Federal Government and for it to return to the role outlined for it in the Constitution. Significant reductions in the size, scope and spending of the federal government will put us in a position to return to a prosperity created by the availability of capital that is currently being sucked up by the sponge of government.

    And, your correct, you have a right to your opinions and thoughts. We all do. What I resent is that many on "the left" want me to pay for their ideas and beliefs which I an antithetically against.

    Jeff B.
     

    Texas1911

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    An equally valid question is why should those who earn more expect to pay less tax on their disposable income? A family of four earning $50K annually pays far more of their income in taxes than an individual earning $250K annually. What is unfair about expecting those who can afford to pay more while keeping up their standard of living having to do so? We all equally share in the benefits; why not also equally share the expense?

    At $30K for me, I am going to pay $2,279 in taxes at the 2010 rate, estimated. That is 7.6% of my income.

    At $50K for a family of 4, would pay $3,058 in taxes at the 2010 rate, estimated. That is 6% of their income.

    At $250K a single income earner would pay $64,531 in taxes at the 2010 rates. That is 25.8% of their income.

    You can't claim that the $250K person isn't paying their fair share. They are paying over 4 times the tax rate, and 21 times the tax.

    If there quality of life isn't that great, then maybe they should have sought better jobs, job training, not had 2 children, etc. That's the reality of life. Giving them a 1% tax cut isn't going to change their quality of life. I know it wouldn't change mine.

    I am not a fan of punishing success via socialism.

    Traditionally in hard economic times wealthy individuals do not invest, they save. Saving and not investing does not stimulate the economy. While I certainly agree that putting more in the hands of the people, it needs to be put in the hands of the people who will spend it and immediately stimulate the economy, not necessarily those who will just put it in an offshore bank and wait for a better investment climate.

    You could not give a substantial enough amount of money to the middle class that would stimulate the economy. If you raised taxes on the wealthy, summated $50 Billion dollars, and doled it out to the middle class, you would give every man / woman / child a whopping $163. Tell me honestly, would a single time payment of $652 be a permanent life changing event for the family of 4? No. Would it stimulate the economy for the long term? No.

    Proof is in the first bailout. It was a short bump, nothing was substantiated in the long term.

    In fact, the one thing that Bush did to float the economy for a number of years was go to war. War is the only long term economical revitalization method the Government directly controls. The amount of domestic spending during wartime is unrivaled. Many people overlook this aspect of the war. However, spending has to be offset with growth, and in the case of this war, it wasn't.

    Ah, here it is…liberals are clueless. Make a blanket statement and toss in an inflammatory comment up front. This is what this entire conservative rant is all about. There is very little individual thought from the author here, just a mindless parroting of the conservative mantra on about how some disgruntled folks are justified in not wanting to pay a fair share; not wanting to help those who need help..."I got mine, so screw off." What if those who need help are our elderly, children, sick, and those who have just fallen on hard times and need a helping hand. This attitude is what they are saying today but what will they say when they are the ones needing help? They are going to depend on the same system that they are condemning today to be there for them but if they have their way, there will be nothing there for them.

    It was never the perogative or job of the US Government to force people to be philantropic. This is contrary to American belief, and is rooted in a master-slave mindset of the US Government. It is the sole duty of every American to insure their own survival and success. That is how the American system works, it rewards those that achieve, and that has been the core of why the United States of America is so powerful and cutting edge. We recruit the best in the World because of our reward system for greatness.

    Now we seek to punish those that are successful via taxation and ad hoc socialism.

    The author is demonstrating an extremely naïve and myopic view of capitalism that shows a fundamental lack of understanding of how the forces of micro and macro economics work on a national and global level. The current situation is that the wealth has not increased for everybody and the wealthy are indeed benefiting at the expense of those who are working harder and earning less. The fact is that in this country when the conservatives are in control, the gap between wealthy and poor increases. Today, as a direct result of the last decade of the same conservative policies called out for in this essay being implemented, that gap is at historic proportions.

    That gap is largely the result of international trade differences since the Clinton-Era. Namely China.
     

    MR Redneck

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    The wealthy are the people who create jobs, spend the money in order to make more money. If the wealthy can spend it to make more of it, then the middle class will be screwed!
    Tax the ritch to feed the poor??? That only works in Socialism!!
    Im all for a Flat Tax!! It gives better options.
    The wealthy american is not the bad americans!! Its everybodies desire to have wealth! Some people are just too helpless, and wond make any effort to get there. I've been trying for a long time. Today, Im still trying.
     
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    Tax Cuts

    An equally valid question is why should those who earn more expect to pay less tax on their disposable income? A family of four earning $50K annually pays far more of their income in taxes than an individual earning $250K annually. What is unfair about expecting those who can afford to pay more while keeping up their standard of living having to do so? We all equally share in the benefits; why not also equally share the expense?

    I agree we should all share equally in the expense, because as you say we all share equally in the benefits. This means we all pay the same amount in taxes. Currently a successful person pays 10 or 20 times as much as the average taxpayer (as Texas 1911 pointed out), and many citizens pay nothing, yet all these people are "entitled" to the same benefits.

    Why do you think someone with a better job should be forced to pay 20 times as much money for the same services?
     

    skinman

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    I agree we should all share equally in the expense, because as you say we all share equally in the benefits. This means we all pay the same amount in taxes. Currently a successful person pays 10 or 20 times as much as the average taxpayer (as Texas 1911 pointed out), and many citizens pay nothing, yet all these people are "entitled" to the same benefits.

    Why do you think someone with a better job should be forced to pay 20 times as much money for the same services?

    Not so. Look at the math. The family of four bringing in 50K annually will spend a far greater percentage of this income on taxes than the single individual who earns 250K. Not only is there the federal/state/local (in some states) income tax, there are sales taxes, property taxes, auto registration taxes, and a myriad of other taxes and fees. While the single earner who brings in 250K pays essentially the same tax, it is a far smaller percentage of total income than it is for the family of 4 bringing in 50K. So, the greater income earner is getting the same benefits for a far smaller portion of income.

    Those who can afford to pay more and continue with their standard of living should expect to pay more. They really don't today and that is the reason the greatest tax burden is placed on the middle class.
     

    skinman

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    because in a LIBS mind, the Over Achievers HAVE to pay for the UNDER achievers!!!!! thats just "FAIR" you know!!!!

    You are sarcastically painting with a broad stroke and totally missing the point.

    I am a teacher. I graduated Magna Cum Laude from the University of Houston. I could have done almost anything but I CHOSE to become a special education teacher earning less than 50K a year instead of going into the private sector where I could earn far more. Does that make me an under achiever? Our military men and women who CHOOSE to make a career out of protecting those same Over Achievers for less than 40K a year...do you consider them under achievers? Some folks have a different calling, a different motivation than simply earning a 6-figure income. That does not make them, "UNDER achievers."
     

    Willy

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    You are sarcastically painting with a broad stroke and totally missing the point.

    I am a teacher. I graduated Magna Cum Laude from the University of Houston. I could have done almost anything but I CHOSE to become a special education teacher earning less than 50K a year instead of going into the private sector where I could earn far more. Does that make me an under achiever? Our military men and women who CHOOSE to make a career out of protecting those same Over Achievers for less than 40K a year...do you consider them under achievers? Some folks have a different calling, a different motivation than simply earning a 6-figure income. That does not make them, "UNDER achievers."


    Good for you. If I had some money left over after paying taxes, I'd buy you a cookie. Your missing the point. The Feds take all of this money from us and spend it on things that are none of their business. Where in the Constitution is authorization for a Department of Education, Department of Energy, HUD, and 3/4 of the other alphabet soup programs they spend OUR money on? It's social engineering and it's wrong. Read the 10th Ammendment and your signature while you are at it.

    P.S. I'm also a veteran.
     

    Texas1911

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    Not so. Look at the math. The family of four bringing in 50K annually will spend a far greater percentage of this income on taxes than the single individual who earns 250K. Not only is there the federal/state/local (in some states) income tax, there are sales taxes, property taxes, auto registration taxes, and a myriad of other taxes and fees. While the single earner who brings in 250K pays essentially the same tax, it is a far smaller percentage of total income than it is for the family of 4 bringing in 50K. So, the greater income earner is getting the same benefits for a far smaller portion of income.

    Those who can afford to pay more and continue with their standard of living should expect to pay more. They really don't today and that is the reason the greatest tax burden is placed on the middle class.

    And I quote again:

    At $30K for me, I am going to pay $2,279 in taxes at the 2010 rate, estimated. That is 7.6% of my income.

    At $50K for a family of 4, would pay $3,058 in taxes at the 2010 rate, estimated. That is 6% of their income.

    At $250K a single income earner would pay $64,531 in taxes at the 2010 rates. That is 25.8% of their income.

    You can't claim that the $250K person isn't paying their fair share. They are paying over 4 times the tax rate, and 21 times the tax.
     

    Texas1911

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    I am a teacher. I graduated Magna Cum Laude from the University of Houston. I could have done almost anything but I CHOSE to become a special education teacher earning less than 50K a year instead of going into the private sector where I could earn far more. Does that make me an under achiever? Our military men and women who CHOOSE to make a career out of protecting those same Over Achievers for less than 40K a year...do you consider them under achievers? Some folks have a different calling, a different motivation than simply earning a 6-figure income. That does not make them, "UNDER achievers."

    There is nothing wrong with choosing a profession and sticking to it as your calling, but one has to be honest with his reward. Money isn't everything in life, and frankly you accepted your calling with the responsibility and financial shortcomings as well. No one is entitled to their cake, and the luxury of eating it too.

    Ultimately, if local, state, and federal government was doing it's job as originally intended, we would have sufficient budget means to pay teachers a better wage. Instead, decades of bullshit have created a money devouring monster that wastes tax moneys faster than they can be printed. We need a black period, we need to focus on waste mitigation, accountability, and fiscal conservatism. We can start by pulling social issues out of Washington.
     

    West Texas

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    And I quote again:

    At $30K for me, I am going to pay $2,279 in taxes at the 2010 rate, estimated. That is 7.6% of my income.

    At $50K for a family of 4, would pay $3,058 in taxes at the 2010 rate, estimated. That is 6% of their income.

    At $250K a single income earner would pay $64,531 in taxes at the 2010 rates. That is 25.8% of their income.

    You can't claim that the $250K person isn't paying their fair share. They are paying over 4 times the tax rate, and 21 times the tax.

    Don't try to use FACTS for Gods sake...that only confuses him. It really is scary that with no better math skills than he seems to have that he would be teaching school...
     
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