Legal knife?

[matefrio]

I would think the maker/manufacturer specs are the best evidence of blade length.

Knife makers do not make laws. You're wrong in your assumption that manufacturers of any product are aware of local, state and even federal laws or there are standards that are accepted.

Take Kershaw for example. Assisted blade open knives were sold in TX for years and assumed legal before case law threw someone in jail and made assisted open knives a switchblade.

Now, if you were the person who'd assumed Kershaw knew the laws, and got arrested, then in the opinion of the judge, a Kershaw knife was a switchblade you'd be convicted even though Kershaw thought their knives were not switchblades and it wouldn't be Kershaw's fault.

TX legislator, with the help of several knife lobbyists, changed the law to define assisted blade opening legal. Too late for the guy who got convicted.

http://www.texaschlforum.com/download/file.php?id=115

http://www.lexisone.com/lx1/caselaw...=eSDY.hUQa.UYGX.YdaS&searchFlag=y&l1loc=FCLOW

 

[txinvestigator]

I would think the maker/manufacturer specs are the best evidence of blade length.

See a few post prior. Case law is shown

 

[Harley Rider 55]

Knife makers do not make laws. You're wrong in your assumption that manufacturers of any product are aware of local, state and even federal laws or there are standards that are accepted.

Take Kershaw for example. Assisted blade open knives were sold in TX for years and assumed legal before case law threw someone in jail and made assisted open knives a switchblade.

Now, if you were the person who'd assumed Kershaw knew the laws, and got arrested, then in the opinion of the judge, a Kershaw knife was a switchblade you'd be convicted even though Kershaw thought their knives were not switchblades and it wouldn't be Kershaw's fault.

TX legislator, with the help of several knife lobbyists, changed the law to define assisted blade opening legal. Too late for the guy who got convicted.

http://www.texaschlforum.com/download/file.php?id=115

Gabriel THOMAS, Appellant v. The STATE of Texas, Appellee - Texas

I posted nothing about a manufacturer or any laws. An engineering spec for a product, especially one with a patented design, holds more weight than any evidense than may be shown in court. The ARE federal laws concerning how a blade is measured because edged weapons (within mil-specs) are issued to military folks.atriot:

P.S. The guy that got convicted, could own Wal Mart if he bought the Kershaw there. It's not hard to see an assisted-blade knife does not fall within the Texas definition of an automatic knife. Beside, the law is archaic. A 2" auto is illegal but a 5.5" hunting knife, a concealed handgun, and open carry of long guns are legal?

 

[matefrio]

I posted nothing about a manufacturer or any laws. An engineering spec for a product, especially one with a patented design, holds more weight than any evidense than may be shown in court. The ARE federal laws concerning how a blade is measured because edged weapons (within mil-specs) are issued to military folks.atriot:

P.S. The guy that got convicted, could own Wal Mart if he bought the Kershaw there. It's not hard to see an assisted-blade knife does not fall within the Texas definition of an automatic knife. Beside, the law is archaic. A 2" auto is illegal but a 5.5" hunting knife, a concealed handgun, and open carry of long guns are legal?

Wow, I'm not trying to bash but you really don't know how the legal system works. I hope it doesn't burn you.

Thomas Gabriel got convicted of a crime in TX because he had in his possession an assisted open knife. Kershaw, Wal-mart and the casher assumed, as did a bunch of folks, it was not a switch blade. ONE rulling of the courts turned that definition on it's ear and convicted Thomas Gabriel. At that time everyone caring an assisted opening blade did so with case law held against them and the possibility of being arrested. See article below.

It wasn't till later that the state legislator added an exception. But read the law, I think they made it worse.

http://www.blademag.com/article/howtoturnabombshell

 

[txinvestigator]

I posted nothing about a manufacturer or any laws. An engineering spec for a product, especially one with a patented design, holds more weight than any evidense than may be shown in court. The ARE federal laws concerning how a blade is measured because edged weapons (within mil-specs) are issued to military folks.atriot:

Negative. Texas courts are not held to federal laws in enforcing Texas laws. And there is no legal precedent that would make a manufactures or engineering spec be the standard a court muct adhere to. In fact, Texas HAS case law on this.

P.S. The guy that got convicted, could own Wal Mart if he bought the Kershaw there. It's not hard to see an assisted-blade knife does not fall within the Texas definition of an automatic knife. Beside, the law is archaic. A 2" auto is illegal but a 5.5" hunting knife, a concealed handgun, and open carry of long guns are legal?

How is Wal Mart responsible for his unlawful possession?

Not only did a court of original jurisdiction find Gabriel guilty, but upon his appeal to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals on the grounds that the knife was NOT a switchblade, the appealate court upheld the conviction. That appealate court decision became case law. That is the reason the legislature changed the law.

 

[matefrio]

Also note that it's not illegal to sell a switch blade, balisong dagger etc. it's only illegal to posses them. Now figure out that difference and you'll have a better idea how laws work. :-)

 

[txinvestigator]

Also note that it's not illegal to sell a switch blade, balisong dagger etc. it's only illegal to posses them. Now figure out that difference and you'll have a better idea how laws work. :-)

The sale of switchblades, including balisongs, is unlawful.

A dagger is not unlawful to possess, only to carry on or about your person. However, for the dagger and other illegal knives; that does not include on your own premises or premises under your control, or inside of your own motor vehicle or one under your control. Also, if you are carrying a concealed handgun of the proper category and a CHL it is not unlawful to carry a dagger.

 

[matefrio]

The sale of switchblades, including balisongs, is unlawful.

Guess it's my turn to learn something. EDIT: balisongs are switchblades under TX law.

- 46.05. Prohibited Weapons. (a) A person commits and offense
if he intentionally or knowingly possesses, manufactures,
transports, repairs, or sells... (5) a switchblade
knife... (d) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution
under this section that the actor's conduct: (1) was
incidental to dealing with a switchblade knife,
springblade knife, or short-barrel firearm solely as an
antique or curio...

 

[Harley Rider 55]

Negative. Texas courts are not held to federal laws in enforcing Texas laws. And there is no legal precedent that would make a manufactures or engineering spec be the standard a court muct adhere to. In fact, Texas HAS case law on this.

How is Wal Mart responsible for his unlawful possession?

Not only did a court of original jurisdiction find Gabriel guilty, but upon his appeal to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals on the grounds that the knife was NOT a switchblade, the appealate court upheld the conviction. That appealate court decision became case law. That is the reason the legislature changed the law.

If all the Wal Mart employees are not in jail, they should be. Ignorance of the law in selling a certain knife is no excuse. Bottom line is Wal Mart has lawyers.

 

[Harley Rider 55]

The sale of switchblades, including balisongs, is unlawful.

A dagger is not unlawful to possess, only to carry on or about your person. However, for the dagger and other illegal knives; that does not include on your own premises or premises under your control, or inside of your own motor vehicle or one under your control. Also, if you are carrying a concealed handgun of the proper category and a CHL it is not unlawful to carry a dagger.

Then why are there not tons of arrests of knife dealers at the gun shows?

 

[txinvestigator]

Then why are there not tons of arrests of knife dealers at the gun shows?

You'd have to ask any LE who is aware and does not arrest. It is a fact that the sale is unlawful. I can show you the law, if you'd like, or just look at post #28 in this very thread.

 

[txinvestigator]

If all the Wal Mart employees are not in jail, they should be. Ignorance of the law in selling a certain knife is no excuse.

I agree with that premise

Bottom line is Wal Mart has lawyers.

How does THAT matter. What matters is that no LE officer decided to pursue the person who sold the knife to him.

 

[matefrio]

If all the Wal Mart employees are not in jail, they should be. Ignorance of the law in selling a certain knife is no excuse. Bottom line is Wal Mart has lawyers.

Remember the law changed. Assisted open knives are now legal and are written exempt from being switchblades in the law. Also, Ignorance of the law in buying or possessing a certain knife is no excuse.

 

[Texan2]

same reason there are hundreds if not thousands of other laws that are strictly enforced. simply not enough courts or cops or jails, not to mention its just a low priority. its one of the laws that gets used when the opportunity jumps in front of LE but they really dont go out hunting down illegal knives

 

[Farmboy Marine]

The sale of switchblades, including balisongs, is unlawful.

I call shenanigans. I see balisongs and various types of switchblades for sale at gun shows, retailers (Bass Pro Shops, Cabela's, etc), and magazines all the time. I've even bought a couple. I thought it was just illegal to carry them on your person.

 

[Texan2]

I call shenanigans. I see balisongs and various types of switchblades for sale at gun shows, retailers (Bass Pro Shops, Cabela's, etc), and magazines all the time. I've even bought a couple. I thought it was just illegal to carry them on your person.

The fact that they are for sale at gun shows does not mean they arent illegal. When you bought one and carried it out of the store you were breaking the law. 46.05. Prohibited Weapons. (a) A person commits and offense
if he intentionally or knowingly possesses, manufactures,
transports, repairs, or sells... (5) a switchblade
knife... (d) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution
under this section that the actor's conduct: (1) was
incidental to dealing with a switchblade knife,
springblade knife, or short-barrel firearm solely as an
antique or curio...

 

[matefrio]

I call shenanigans. I see balisongs and various types of switchblades for sale at gun shows, retailers (Bass Pro Shops, Cabela's, etc), and magazines all the time. I've even bought a couple. I thought it was just illegal to carry them on your person.

Speeding is also. Why don't they ticket everyone? We brake laws every day we either know about and choose to ignore or more than likely in our ignorance will never become aware of. It's a scary thing and makes us subjects IMHO.

 

[Farmboy Marine]

The fact that they are for sale at gun shows does not mean they arent illegal. When you bought one and carried it out of the store you were breaking the law.

Ah, I see. Well that sucks! Haha, and switchblades aren't covered under the NFA.

 

[Farmboy Marine]

Speeding is also. Why don't they ticket everyone? We brake laws every day we either know about and choose to ignore or more than likely in our ignorance will never become aware of. It's a scary thing and makes us subjects IMHO.

I can see why that is, but speeding tickets and the selling of goods are completely different issues. My question is why don't they crack down on big distributors like Galls, Academy Sporting Goods, or GT Distributors? Being large, centralized corporations they'd be much easier to regulate, as opposed to the eleventy-billion independent gun shows across the nation.

 

[Texan2]

So you're saying anyone who possesses automatic or short-barreled weapons, as well as silencers/suppressors, are also breaking the law. Because those are also included in sections (a)(2-4) of the same law.

I think you are confusing the fact that some laws are not strictly enforced with the fact the behavior described is still illegal.

There are lots of laws that rarely get enforced....doesnt mean the actions described in those laws are still not illegal