Ohio IRS Security Guard Draw Gun in Uniformed Sheriff’s Deputy

[benenglish]

Who is doing the interpreting?

In the moment, whoever's there. Ultimately, a court.

Is the IRS going to use their own enforcement arm to affect an arrest post incident after an investigation?

No, since the IRS doesn't have anything to do with enforcing those laws.

They gonna pass it onto the FBI?

Generally, no. The Federal Protective Service usually takes incident reports from contract security if there appears to be an offense worthy of investigation. Of course, given a blatant enough violation, you never know who will want to get involved.

Maybe the guards should have detained him for clearly violaitng Federal Law and then called local police to arrest him?

As I stated previously in this thread, that was probably what the guard was trained to do (although the guard, if properly trained, would know to call a federal dispatch number to get someone to make the arrest. In these cases, 911 is only useful if things have gone south badly and quickly). That would explain why he got blinders on and failed to take a step back and realize how ridiculous he was acting.

Maybe, just maybe, the security guard stepped in it and the company failed to train him properly?

For sure.

Oh, wait. Were those questions supposed to be rhetorical?

 

[Reinz]

I think Ben’s observations are on point. The guard should have turned off his nerd switch to turn on the common sense switch. Or- just slow down for a more harmonious outcome.

 

[jetcycles]

So you never handled some personal business on your work time, ever? Wow, you are a better man than me.

I won't requote the lenghty reply about the federal statute but can you tell me with 100% certainty that the deputy in uniform in his county broke the law? That is like saying when they take their meal break they aren't LEOs. I mean Jesus. Let's take the uniform and badge out of it. You are a civilian with a LTC and you go to your local IRS office that they lease out in a regular building.
You go thru the metal detectors and contract security says no go, go back to your car to disarm and you say BS so they draw down on you. Is that right? Let's use some common sense.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

You deduct a LOT from my post, so much so that I hesitate to entertain your line of questioning due to the preposterous nature of your first question alone.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[Sublime]

You deduct a LOT from my post, so much so that I hesitate to entertain your line of questioning due to the preposterous nature of your first question alone.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

C'mon, entertain me. I like discussing this stuff as you can see. Your earlier reply implied that since he was on "personal business" he should not be considered a uniformed deputy like he clearly was. It no workee like that. If I got it wrong, just tell me.

 

[jetcycles]

C'mon, entertain me. I like discussing this stuff as you can see. Your earlier reply implied that since he was on "personal business" he should not be considered a uniformed deputy like he clearly was. It no workee like that. If I got it wrong, just tell me.

I like discussing this stuff too, different perspectives allow an opportunity for growth if one retains the ability to keep an open mind. We're all a product of our own individual experiences, none of us ever walk the same path as another man, sharing those experiences can prevent another man from making the same mistakes.

Again, you deduct your own theories from my post. I merely implied that had he handled his business on his time, he likely wouldn't have found himself in the predicament. I could care less about the man's work attire; pipeliner/teacher/deputy doesnt mean shit to me. There are good and bad men in all professions, I dont hold a man in uniform on a higher pedestal nor give him a hall pass for his behavior due to his chosen line of work. If in fact he should not have entered the building in an unofficial capacity while armed, all of this is the result of his personal choice. I believe the security guard could've handled the scenario differently, obviously. I have troopers and leo/swat in my family and friends, I'm not anti LEO, I believe everyone should be held accountable for their actions.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[candcallen]

I guess we know where Gecko 45 works now.






So much fail from just 2 people and one handwringing hoplophobes who called 911.

Just give him the number and say I'm sorry but you cant be armed in an IRS office on personal buisness. Problem solved education delivered.

 

[Sublime]

So basically jetcycles, I interpreted your implication correctly. I will ask again, have you ever done personal bizness on work time? The deputy obviously works day shift and knowing the Feds and when their offices are open, did you ever think maybe it is near impossible to do it on his personal time? I never stated pr implied you were anti LEO. I was just commenting on your personal time comment.

I guess he should have burned some PTO, changed clothes, go unarmed leaving a weapon in his personal car that increases the risk of being stolen all so he could avoid a crack security guard drawing a gun on him. My bad.

Sent from my SM-T380 using Tapatalk

 

[jetcycles]

So basically jetcycles, I interpreted your implication correctly. I will ask again, have you ever done personal bizness on work time? The deputy obviously works day shift and knowing the Feds and when their offices are open, did you ever think maybe it is near impossible to do it on his personal time? I never stated pr implied you were anti LEO. I was just commenting on your personal time comment.

I guess he should have burned some PTO, changed clothes, go unarmed leaving a weapon in his personal car that increases the risk of being stolen all so he could avoid a crack security guard drawing a gun on him. My bad.

Sent from my SM-T380 using Tapatalk

Again with the preposterous question. What I do on the clock is not what created the news story or this thread. Have YOU ever done personal business on company time? Let's be honest here, everyone has done "personal business" on company time, myself included. Anyone that answers that question with a "no" is either a liar, a fool, or both. Back to the deputy in discussion. I have zero sympathy for the guy. His chosen line of work nor the hours that he performs his duties are of any concern of mine. The substance of the matter is that (based on what I can deduce, go ahead and clear it up for any if us that may be in error regarding his posession of a weapon on the property in question) the guy carried a firearm where he shouldn't have, irregardless of any scenario you can dream up in his defense. Actions have consequences. His actions resulted in an armed security guard pointing a weapon at him, and now he's crying mental anguish for an act he has likely perpetrated on others in his line of work. I could care less where he has to leave his weapon when he handles his personal business, many of us face the same daunting task of leaving a weapon in a vehicle when we enter areas that prohibit their carry. You can cuck for the deputy all you want, not all of us are willing to do so simply because he's a LEO. Have you ever had a weapon pointed at you? I have, on more than one occasion, and it's an eerie feeling knowing that your life rests in the thoughts and actions of another human being. For the record, I've been drawn on twice by LEO's, both times while I was in the process of apprehending or detaining a perpetrator. I never blamed the cops for arriving on scene and pointing their weapons at me, and I sure didnt cry about it in a court of law. You know why, because my actions resulted in the consequences in the same manner that his actions resulted in his consequences. Keep on cucking for the law, and I'll keep on examining every person in the same light no matter the clothes on their back or the title associated with their name.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[Bithabus]

So basically jetcycles, I interpreted your implication correctly. I will ask again, have you ever done personal bizness on work time? The deputy obviously works day shift and knowing the Feds and when their offices are open, did you ever think maybe it is near impossible to do it on his personal time? I never stated pr implied you were anti LEO. I was just commenting on your personal time comment.

I guess he should have burned some PTO, changed clothes, go unarmed leaving a weapon in his personal car that increases the risk of being stolen all so he could avoid a crack security guard drawing a gun on him. My bad.

Sent from my SM-T380 using Tapatalk

Would your position be different if the person in question weren't a LEO? What about an office worker going to the IRS on his lunch break? Would you be defending him?

 

[pronstar]

Cops are always on the job.
If he witnessed a crime at the IRS office, he would intervene even if in his “lunch break”.

This thread is ridiculous.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[candcallen]

This thread needs an enema.

 

[Bithabus]

This thread is ridiculous.

IMO the law is ridiculous. If our right to bear arms wasn't infringed we wouldn't have to worry about stupid crap like this.

 

[Sublime]

Would your position be different if the person in question weren't a LEO? What about an office worker going to the IRS on his lunch break? Would you be defending him?

Would I be defending a law abiding LTC holder from having a security guard drawing down on them for simply entering a commercial building attempting to get information at a federal office?? That would be an affirmative yes.

I honestly don't understand some responses here. How about the guard just advising whoever is lawfully armed that Federal law prohibits it and oh I dunno, providing appropriate lock boxes. I mean the fact that the IRS has to have armed contract security and make citizens go thru metal detectors should tell you something about the agency.

 

[Bithabus]

Would I be defending a law abiding LTC holder from having a security guard drawing down on them for simply entering a commercial building attempting to get information at a federal office?? That would be an affirmative yes.

No. I meant, would you be suggesting that maybe the LTC holder shouldn't have to burn personal time and leave his weapon in his POV where it might be stolen. Obviously the guard is an idiot.

 

[Sublime]

Again with the preposterous question. What I do on the clock is not what created the news story or this thread.

Hey you were the one who brought up the LEO was on personal time. I simply replied to that. The deputy doing his personal business on duty was NOT what caused the story either. It was the guard drawing down on a deputy that caused the story. Surely you get that. Jesus.

The substance of the matter is that (based on what I can deduce, go ahead and clear it up for any if us that may be in error regarding his posession of a weapon on the property in question) the guy carried a firearm where he shouldn't have, irregardless of any scenario you can dream up in his defense. Actions have consequences. His actions resulted in an armed security guard pointing a weapon at him, and now he's crying mental anguish for an act he has likely perpetrated on others in his line of work.

So anyone who lawfully carries and goes into an area that is prohibited should have a gun pointed at him because AGAIN, this is what we are talking about. Yep, actions have consequences, hence the guards arrest and the deputies lawsuit. Simple Q for you and everyone else - Should a guard draw down on a uniformed officer or an open carrier when the sole reason is the guard sees a gun??

You can cuck for the deputy all you want, not all of us are willing to do so simply because he's a LEO. Have you ever had a weapon pointed at you? I have, on more than one occasion, and it's an eerie feeling knowing that your life rests in the thoughts and actions of another human being. Keep on cucking for the law, and I'll keep on examining every person in the same light no matter the clothes on their back or the title associated with their name.

It appears I struck a chord since you used the word "cuck" twice. Hey, whatever you and your wife do in the privacy of your home is none of my business. You are the one focusing on the deputy, the uniform, and the badge. I have consistently stated the guard drawing his weapon on the deputy or anyone else legally armed was COMPLETELY UNJUSTIFIED.

 

[Sublime]

No. I meant, would you be suggesting that maybe the LTC holder shouldn't have to burn personal time and leave his weapon in his POV where it might be stolen. Obviously the guard is an idiot.

Honestly your question is a bit confusing. If Joe blow LTC holder can handle some personal business on work time and his boss doesn't care, hey more power to him. Do I think LTC holders should leave their gun in their car? Nope. It is a great way to have it stolen. Am I suggesting they should have lock boxes? Yep.

I will give you a for instance - I get a jury summons at Tarrant Co. Courthouse. I go thru the line and show my credentials. Deputy asks if I am going to the jury room. Yep and he tells me I can't be armed. He asks if I can take it to my car. That is a negative since I took the TRE. He calls his Sgt. and he verifies my credentials and then takes me to their office where there is a lock box. Same thing at Universal Studios in Orlando. I mean is it too much to ask that the IRS also has lock boxes if they are going to disarm lawful armed people because they are so afraid one of us is gonna twist off because they are tools?

 

[Hoji]

It occurs to me( mostly because I am kind of defective, but that can be another topic) that of all the places in fed.gov, the IRS should be a place you should be required to carry( if you legally can) given the amount of thievery and highway robbery that goes on there.

 

[Bithabus]

Honestly your question is a bit confusing. If Joe blow LTC holder can handle some personal business on work time and his boss doesn't care, hey more power to him. Do I think LTC holders should leave their gun in their car? Nope. It is a great way to have it stolen. Am I suggesting they should have lock boxes? Yep.

I will give you a for instance - I get a jury summons at Tarrant Co. Courthouse. I go thru the line and show my credentials. Deputy asks if I am going to the jury room. Yep and he tells me I can't be armed. He asks if I can take it to my car. That is a negative since I took the TRE. He calls his Sgt. and he verifies my credentials and then takes me to their office where there is a lock box. Same thing at Universal Studios in Orlando. I mean is it too much to ask that the IRS also has lock boxes if they are going to disarm lawful armed people because they are so afraid one of us is gonna twist off because they are tools?

IMO any place that forces you to disarm should have lock boxes. Should be State law.

 

[candcallen]

IMO any place that forces you to disarm should have lock boxes. Should be State law.

IRS offices dont have to follow state laws. Even in states that have subdivision restrictions they dont apply to federal facilities.
Example
Az req every government building that disarms people to provide lock boxes or other secure storage. Every political subdivision must comply. i.e. state city county have to do this and can not make any local ord more restrictive that the state law. Federal facilities in AZ do not have follow these laws.

 

[Bithabus]

IRS offices dont have to follow state laws.

The people inside them do. For example: theft or murder is still illegal inside an IRS office.

In any case I'm aware of what you're saying. My statement was meant generally and not in response to this specific incident.